Wingcowyn Posted 7 August , 2020 Share Posted 7 August , 2020 I came across this picture in a junk shop. Someone had obviously gone to a great deal of trouble to cut it to fit into the frame so I thought that it deserved to be seen by a wider audience. There is some writing on it which might offer some clues to his identity. He is a 2nd Lieutenant wearing what appears to be the ribbon of the MM, so promoted from the ranks. I attach some pics and would welcome observations. Thanks, Peter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 7 August , 2020 Share Posted 7 August , 2020 (edited) He’s a 2nd Lieutenant in a branch of the Royal Artillery. He has a soft cap, cuff rank, a single wound stripe on his left lower sleeve, and carries a riding whip, that together suggest Royal Field Artillery, or Royal Horse Artillery circa 1916-17. Edited 7 August , 2020 by FROGSMILE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mancpal Posted 7 August , 2020 Share Posted 7 August , 2020 Is that a wound stripe on his left cuff? Does 13 Roker St, Workington still stand? and my final stab in the dark is does anyone know if a soldier called Ralph or Raphael was registered at said address. Time for bed, Simon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IPT Posted 7 August , 2020 Share Posted 7 August , 2020 Ralph Smith Miller lived at 13 Roper Street. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alisonmallen62 Posted 7 August , 2020 Share Posted 7 August , 2020 With best wishes your old pal Ralph I think it is. Sapper S Faul..? Faulkner, 7 Derisent St Worthington Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnmelling1979 Posted 7 August , 2020 Share Posted 7 August , 2020 (edited) Hello Says .. Sapper S Fawcett ? I think... 7 Derwent St.. and it still exists today Workington Edited 7 August , 2020 by johnmelling1979 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alisonmallen62 Posted 7 August , 2020 Share Posted 7 August , 2020 Ah brilliant I don’t know the area at all so guessing and a great photo too! 6 minutes ago, johnmelling1979 said: Hello Says .. Sapper S Fawcett ? I think... 7 Derwent St.. and it still exists today Workington Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnmelling1979 Posted 7 August , 2020 Share Posted 7 August , 2020 Sound someone who fits in and could be him Name: Stephen Fawcett Age in 1911: 26 Estimated birth year: abt 1885 Gender: Male Birth Place: Workington, Cumberland, England Search Photos: County/Island: Military Country: England Rank: Sapper Military Unit: Royal Engineers Registration District Number: 641 ED, institution, or vessel: Arabia, Cyprus, and Gibraltar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alisonmallen62 Posted 7 August , 2020 Share Posted 7 August , 2020 Sounds promising Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mancpal Posted 7 August , 2020 Share Posted 7 August , 2020 Alison, The photo shows an RA officer, the sapper and his address would I imagine be the recipient rather than the subject of the shot. Simon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alisonmallen62 Posted 7 August , 2020 Share Posted 7 August , 2020 Yes I realised that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnmelling1979 Posted 7 August , 2020 Share Posted 7 August , 2020 (edited) Found Ralph Smith Millers Army record Age 24 15494 Pte, 11 Service Battalion, The Borderers Regiment (Lonsdale Battalion) Confirming 13 Roper Street, Workington He was discharged as not being fit for service on 6 April 1915 Edited 7 August , 2020 by johnmelling1979 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mancpal Posted 7 August , 2020 Share Posted 7 August , 2020 Sorry Alison, my crystal ball evidently clouded over. Simon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alisonmallen62 Posted 7 August , 2020 Share Posted 7 August , 2020 Just now, mancpal said: Sorry Alison, my crystal ball evidently clouded over. Simon No need to apologise I realised the photo was being sent on to a friend and I always love it when a home is found etc etc makes it all even more interesting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mancpal Posted 7 August , 2020 Share Posted 7 August , 2020 I wasn't Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alisonmallen62 Posted 7 August , 2020 Share Posted 7 August , 2020 Ok was just interested will move on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 7 August , 2020 Share Posted 7 August , 2020 1 hour ago, mancpal said: Is that a wound stripe on his left cuff? Yes - as mentioned in post # 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David26 Posted 8 August , 2020 Share Posted 8 August , 2020 Having tried Ancestry, the London Gazette, TNA's WO339 and WO374 lists, IWM's LoWW1 and the WO338 register, I'm struggling to find a Ralph Smith Miller (even taking into account alternate spellings of Smyth or Millar) as an officer in the Royal Artillery. The closest I can get is a Temp Lt R S Miller MC who was serving in 1918 and 1919 in the South Africa artillery (see for example: https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/31591/supplement/12516). I know little about SA uniforms but might have expected something in the original photo which might have suggested a link there. I wonder though if a man who had been discharged as not being likely to make an efficient soldier, might have re-enlisted under a false name? David. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headgardener Posted 8 August , 2020 Share Posted 8 August , 2020 24 minutes ago, David26 said: I wonder though if a man who had been discharged as not being likely to make an efficient soldier, might have re-enlisted under a false name? Yes, he might, but being commissioned as an officer was a completely different process. The man had to present his birth certificate and get a reference from a person of good standing within the community who had known him for at least 5 years, so that would effectively rule out the possibility of someone becoming an officer under a false name. Ralph Smith Miller would have become liable for conscription once the MSA was introduced in 1916, and there are plenty of instances of men who had previously been discharged ending up being conscripted (I know of an example of a man going from discharge as 'not likely to become an efficient soldier' to being killed in action within 18 months due to him being conscripted under the MSA). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headgardener Posted 8 August , 2020 Share Posted 8 August , 2020 p.s. It's interesting that you can't find him. Absence from the MIC's could be explained simply by the fact that he never applied for his campaign medals, but there should still be a card for his MM (and, if he won the MM, his o/r services medals would have been issued to him automatically). His officers service file might be missing because he had service post 1921. As for the other sources, if he was an officer then he'd be in the LG and the army list. Intriguing. Are we certain that there wasn't another Ralph living at the same address as Ralph Smith Miller? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headgardener Posted 8 August , 2020 Share Posted 8 August , 2020 p.p.s. I can’t find an obvious candidate in the MM MIC’s. Regarding the possibility that he’s in the S African Army, the cap and collar badges aren’t right for SA Field Art or SA Hvy Art. I checked a copy of the Nov 1918 Army List and the only RS Miller’s are an RAMC man, an infantry officer and the SA man, and there are no ‘R Smith-Miller’s either. Regarding the photo, I note that he has a sword frog but no sword. I’ll have a look through some other Army Lists later. Hopefully someone else can interrogate the LG website! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 8 August , 2020 Share Posted 8 August , 2020 11 minutes ago, headgardener said: p.p.s. I can’t find an obvious candidate in the MM MIC’s. Regarding the possibility that he’s in the S African Army, the cap and collar badges aren’t right for SA Field Art or SA Hvy Art. I checked a copy of the Nov 1918 Army List and the only RS Miller’s are an RAMC man, an infantry officer and the SA man, and there are no ‘R Smith-Miller’s either. Regarding the photo, I note that he has a sword frog but no sword. I’ll have a look through some other Army Lists later. Hopefully someone else can interrogate the LG website! It’s been suggested to me in a PM that the RAMC man relates to the Roper St address on the back of the photograph, which if true might offer a clue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headgardener Posted 8 August , 2020 Share Posted 8 August , 2020 5 minutes ago, FROGSMILE said: It’s been suggested to me in a PM that the RAMC man relates to the Roper St address on the back of the photograph, which if true might offer a clue. Well, that might make some sense as Google told me repeatedly that there was a Dr called Ralph Smith Miller, although I dismissed him as they aren't an exceptional set of names and I hadn't linked him to that address. But maybe it is him. In which case, how to explain the uniform + medal ribbon in the photo? (I'm going to resist the obvious temptation, btw.... 😉) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 8 August , 2020 Share Posted 8 August , 2020 1 minute ago, headgardener said: Well, that might make some sense as Google told me repeatedly that there was a Dr called Ralph Smith Miller, although I dismissed him as they aren't an exceptional set of names and I hadn't linked him to that address. But maybe it is him. In which case, how to explain the uniform + medal ribbon in the photo? (I'm going to resist the obvious temptation, btw.... 😉) Yes, it’s a real conundrum. Perhaps PRC can solve it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headgardener Posted 8 August , 2020 Share Posted 8 August , 2020 Hmmmm.... No, the MIC's suggest that Dr R. S. Miller RAMC was Robert Stewart Miller. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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