Pte Robert Brown No 202739

[DaveC]

Hi Everybody

   Seeking information on Pte Robert Brown No 202739 1/4th Bn Duke of Wellington' (West Riding) Regiment, KIA 03/9/1916 Born Cartworth, Yorkshire, Enlisted Stockton-on-Tees, He's aso on the Stockton War Memorial , I have his MIC, War Gratuity,   He buried in Mill Road Cemetery.  Please if anybody can add anymore information, i would be so great full.    Kindest Regards DaveC  (Stay Safe)

 

Edited 19 June , 2020 by DaveC

[clk]

Hi Dave,

 

His Soldiers' Effects record has his death as 'on or since 3.9.1916    death presumed'.  It shows that his mother was named Mary and a brother called George. Fold3 have a couple of pension index cards which give her address as 5 Paxton Street, Stockton-on-Tees. At that address in the 1911 census, there is a Brown family living there. It includes a Robert, with a mother called Mary, but of her 4 children (all still living) there isn't a George.

 

Image sourced from Ancestry

 

Going back to the 1901 census, the family is at the same address, but this time a George is recorded.

Image sourced from Ancestry

 

In the 1891 census (same address) taken on the night of 5 April 1891, Robert is listed as being 2 months old.

Image sourced from Ancestry

 

Regards

Chris

 

 

[DaveC]

Hi Chris, Many thanks for that information, Kindest Regards DaveC (Stay Safe)

 

[clk]

Hi,

 

The amount of War Gratuity shown as paid in his Soldiers' Effects record doesn't really help to date when Robert 'joined up'. It is the minimum amount payable to any man who served overseas, and had 12 or less months overall service.

 

It looks like you may be able to make some inferences about his service with the West Riding Regiment though by doing some near number sampling of other men from the regiment.

 

Prior to being renumbered to his 202739 number in 1917 a couple of records show that he was numbered 5756. Despite being missing presumed dead in September 1916, his records/affairs were still being administered by the army when TF renumbering occurred - for example the money order that was sent to his mother in October 1917 (shown in his Soldiers' Effects record). His 202739 number falls within the number block that was allocated to the line units of the 4th Battalion West Riding Regiment. Looking at just a couple of sets of near number men that bracket his 6 digit service number, it looks like they may have been renumbered sequentially based on their previous 4 digit numbers:

 

5755/202738 Beanland - transferred to 3/4 West Riding (from KOYLI) 9.6.1916; posted 1/4 West Riding 15.6.1916; embarked at Southampton 15.6.1916: at 49 Infantry Base Depot 16.6.1916; joined battalion in the field 26.6.1916

 

5756/202739

 

5759/202741 Fairfoot - transferred to West Riding  Regiment (from Yorkshire Regiment) 8.6.1916; posted 1/4 West Riding 15.6.1916; embarked at Southampton 15.6.1916: at 49 Infantry Base Depot 16.6.1916; joined battalion in the field 26.6.1916

 

The Bn War Diary shows:

Image sourced from Ancestry

 

It might help to do some more sampling, but it seems that Beanland and Fairfoot were part of the draft of 258 men that arrived on 26.6.1916, and that Robert might have been part of it too.

 

Regards

Chris

[DaveC]

Hi Chris

WOW. if you are correct which i know you are, that mean the Bn was going in to action on the 03/09/1916, with men that had been together, for 39 days Many Thanks Chris

Edited 19 June , 2020 by DaveC

[DaveC]

Here's Numbers either side of Pte Brown,   I can't check o see if hey are the same daft as I don't have ancestry or FMP, can anybody help Kindest Regards DaveC

 

 

202729 Pte Stansbury, Henry William - SWB

730 

731 Pte Kershaw, Herbert

732 Pte Lowry, John

733 Pte Machin, Albert Edward - Kia 29 4 1918

734 Pte Guy, Thomas

735 Pte Windle, from KOYLI, SWB

736 Pte Inglewood, James Wilson, Kia 9.10.1917 (Ingwood on CWGC)

737 

738

739 Brown

740 Pte Chatburn, A Coy, wia

741 Pte Fairfoot, Harry

742 Pte Gaukroger, Walter

743 

744 Pte Mitchell, G V - SWB

745 

746 Pte Rhodes, Frederick MM

747 Pte Sutcliffe, Richard

748 

749 

750

[DaveC]

Fighting Strength of the Battalion on the afternoon of September 2nd:-

Battalion HQ Officers 6      Other Rank 121

A Company  "         "  3       "               " 127

B Company   "        "  3        "               " 127

C Company   "        " 3        "               " 127

D Company  "        "  3        "               " 127

Total                        18                           629

 

Casualties 11 Officers   336 other ranks

 

Thought it might be of interest.     Kindest Regards DaveC

 

[DaveC]

Hi Everybody

   Can anybody help With the serial No's. below to see if they were part of a draft of 258 men allocated to the1/4h Bn on 26-06-1916.    Any help most welcome.    Kindest Regards DaveC.

202729 Pte Stansbury, Henry William - SWB Pension Ledger GSW L Hip

730 

731 Pte Kershaw, Herbert

732 Pte Lowry, John - John William Pension Ledger GSW Lungs

733 Pte Machin, Albert Edward - Kia 29 4 1918 CWGC Pension Card

734 Pte Guy, Thomas

735 Pte Windle, from KOYLI, SWB

736 Pte Inglewood, James Wilson, Kia 9.10.1917 (Ingwood on CWGC)

737 

738

739 Brown

740 Pte Chatburn, A Coy, wia

741 Pte Fairfoot, Harry

742 Pte Gaukroger, Walter

743 

744 Pte Mitchell, G V - SWB

745 

746 Pte Rhodes, Frederick MM

747 Pte Sutcliffe, Richard

748 

749 

750

Edited 24 June , 2020 by DaveC

[Matlock1418]

On 19/06/2020 at 15:30, clk said:

couple of pension index cards which give her address as 5 Paxton Street, Stockton-on-Tees

For family/mother, Mary - post-war

Card has entries that appear dated 9/5/28 [appears written 5 Paxton St - ? - G maps gives a Paxton Cl which seems north of river, is largely open land and has now no houses]

Ledger has a flurry of dates 1930 [appears written 5 Caxton St - which seems south of river]

Clerking error or coincidence or has the geography/town plan subsequently changed???

:-) M

[DaveC]

Hi Could anybody tell me what date Pte Whatmough transferred to the Duke Of Wellington's Regt, was it the Draft on the 24-06-16 or on the 26-6-16?

 

KILLED WHILST CARRYING WOUNDED COMRADE

 

TRIBUTE TO PTE. W. WHATMOUGH

 

   On Saturday evening, Mr. James Whatmough, a well-known contractor, 28 Moorfield Street, Halifax, received two letters informing him that his elder son.   Pte. Willie Whatmough (5465), West Riding Regiment, was killed in action on Sept. 3.   Capt. E. N. Marshall wrote: - “It is my painful duty to write to you the sad news that your boy, Pte. W. Whatmough, was killed in action on Sept 3.   he died doing a noble service, for he was helping to carry out wounded from the front line to the dressing station, when he was caught by shrapnel and killed at once.   He had only just joined us, but had already made many friends in his platoon, and gave promise of being a very trusty.   To die fighting for one’s country is surely a fine death, and though he never had the luck to get to grips with the enemy, like others, still to die trying to carry a wounded comrade to a place of safety is in itself to perform a great service.   I know that you will feel it sorely, but I trust it may be some comfort to you to know he was doing his duty, and that you have the deep sympathy of all the officers and men of his company in your bereavement.   I fear I should have written sooner, but these have been very strenuous, busy days for us all, and only to-day I have been able to find time to express to you my company’s feelings.” – Sgt. T. Vickerman, on behalf of his platoon, wrote: - “He was a very cheerful and obliging soldier.    The platoon feel the loss of a true comrade, and all miss him.   He did his duty cheerfully and was always there when wanted.   We all hope you will look on the bright side, and you can always rest content that your son died an honourable death, serving his King and country at the time of need.”

   Prior to the war, Pte. Whatmough, who was 35 years of age, was a mason in the employ of his father.   He joined the local Territorials on April 5 this year, in his group, and after a period of short training was transferred to another battalion, going to France in August.   Thus he had only been at the front about five weeks.   He was engaged to Miss Sarah Jones, Gibbet Street, and to her as well, as to his parents and family sympathy will be extended.

(The Halifax Evening Courier Monday 11/09/1916)

[clk]

Hi Dave,

 

His service file appears to show...

Image sourced from Findmypast

 

Regards

Chris

Edited 3 July , 2020 by clk

[DaveC]

Thanks Chris

 

                                                              IN MEMORIAM

 

WHATMOUGH.   In loving memory of Private Willie Whatmough, who was killed in action Sept. 3^rd 1916.

   To-day recalls a sad memory,

   Time can never heal;

   Nothing to us can ever repay’

   The sacrifice he made that day.

From his sorrowing father, mother, and sisters, 28, Moorfield Street, Savile Park, Halifax

(The Halifax Guardian Saturday 06/09/1919. p. 2.)