SheetMetalRifile Posted 27 May , 2020 Share Posted 27 May , 2020 (edited) I recently acquired this rifle, and was hoping to learn more about it, particularly about the regimental markings on it. Other than a Turkish bolt and rear sight, I do not believe it has any Turkish markings. I was also wondering if in the photo of the cleaning rod if the brass was field repair. Other than a small spot of solder on the very front of the barrel shroud to presumably cover up a hole, there are no other non-arsenal modifications. Any insight is greatly appreciated. Edited 27 May , 2020 by SheetMetalRifile Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4thGordons Posted 27 May , 2020 Share Posted 27 May , 2020 Hello! Welcome to the forum There are others who are better informed on unit markings than I so I'll pass there...apart from to say 266 is probably the weapon number.(oh ok my GUESS is Bavarian ? 12 Reserve Infantry Regiment? 10th Kompany, 266 rifle?) I await correction! The rifle has been modified to use the Spitzer (pointed bullet) 7.92 (that is the significance of S stamp and the slight notch in the receiver ring). The S-patrone was introduced in 1903 I think so this is a modification to your 1893 rifle Would some overall pics of the rifle be possible looks like a nice example. I can't actually make out the brass on the cleaning rod very clearly- but IIRC one of my Gew 88s has brass showing on the rod tip so I don't know if that is a field repair or if the tip is cast in brass and then coated and the coating wears off (jags etc are often made of brass as it is less likely to damage the bore (being softer). Best Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SheetMetalRifile Posted 28 May , 2020 Author Share Posted 28 May , 2020 1 hour ago, 4thGordons said: Hello! Welcome to the forum There are others who are better informed on unit markings than I so I'll pass there...apart from to say 266 is probably the weapon number.(oh ok my GUESS is Bavarian ? 12 Reserve Infantry Regiment? 10th Kompany, 266 rifle?) I await correction! The rifle has been modified to use the Spitzer (pointed bullet) 7.92 (that is the significance of S stamp and the slight notch in the receiver ring). The S-patrone was introduced in 1903 I think so this is a modification to your 1893 rifle Would some overall pics of the rifle be possible looks like a nice example. I can't actually make out the brass on the cleaning rod very clearly- but IIRC one of my Gew 88s has brass showing on the rod tip so I don't know if that is a field repair or if the tip is cast in brass and then coated and the coating wears off (jags etc are often made of brass as it is less likely to damage the bore (being softer). Best Chris Here are some more pictures. Can anyone explain the meaning of the dot above the s? As seen in the photos, the stock is very well used and dented, but there are very few chips and zero cracks in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SheetMetalRifile Posted 28 May , 2020 Author Share Posted 28 May , 2020 Here are some more. Also what was the purpose of having two slots in the cleaning rod, rather than one like a modern rod? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assafx Posted 28 May , 2020 Share Posted 28 May , 2020 3 hours ago, SheetMetalRifile said: Here are some more pictures. Can anyone explain the meaning of the dot above the s? As seen in the photos, the stock is very well used and dented, but there are very few chips and zero cracks in it. do you have Ottoman acceptance marks on it? Assaf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigjohn Posted 28 May , 2020 Share Posted 28 May , 2020 The two slots in the cleaning rod,to pass 4×2 or equivalent through ? John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 28 May , 2020 Share Posted 28 May , 2020 10 hours ago, SheetMetalRifile said: ... Any insight is greatly appreciated. 8 hours ago, 4thGordons said: (oh ok my GUESS is Bavarian ? 12 Reserve Infantry Regiment? 10th Kompany, 266 rifle?) I await correction! The rifle has been modified to use the Spitzer (pointed bullet) 7.92 (that is the significance of S stamp and the slight notch in the receiver ring). The S-patrone was introduced in 1903 I think so this is a modification to your 1893 rifle Nice to have such a clear stamp! Chris is spot on, Kgl. Bayer. 12. Reserve-Infanterie-Regiment, 10 Komp., Waffe 266. The style is correct for the period up to 1909. To the best of my knowledge the dot over the 'S' has no significance. Julian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SheetMetalRifile Posted 28 May , 2020 Author Share Posted 28 May , 2020 7 hours ago, assafx said: do you have Ottoman acceptance marks on it? Assaf No, It does not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assafx Posted 28 May , 2020 Share Posted 28 May , 2020 4 hours ago, SheetMetalRifile said: No, It does not. This is a bit strange because your sight might suggest that it was used by the Ottoman army (unless i read it wrong). If i am right this might have been part of the support that Germany sent to the Ottomans. I hope @trajanmight have more insights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve1871 Posted 28 May , 2020 Share Posted 28 May , 2020 The Gew.88 went through several changes. yours show 2 at a glance. With the spritzer bullets, beside an The “S” stamped on top of chamber for that improvement, it also has dished cut-out at top back of chamber because the slightly longer spritzer rounds were just catching that back part of chamber. 2nd, using stripper clips in a hurry, soldiers complained of catching and or cramping their thumb on the receiver wall after extended shooting.A narrow / shallow cut out was made to new rifles. Thumb relief,/ thumb cut ect. That one, the one you shoe, I believe was short lived, as a final version with a deeper, more pronounced thumb cut out was quickly made. That would make yours a little more scarce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shippingsteel Posted 28 May , 2020 Share Posted 28 May , 2020 I don't think anyone has mentioned it yet but this rifle is actually a Gewehr 88/05 and as such has had quite a few modifications from the original rifle that left the Amberg factory in 1893. As Chris has noted it has been upgraded to accept the S-Patronen which is the pointed Spitzer ammunition. It has also received a barrel upgrade with the modified barrel contours and rifling to suit the S-Patronen. This is what the Dot above the chamber signifies. So the S.dot is a commonly seen marking on the earlier rifles that went through the system. As for the 88/05 designation this involved the upgrading of the weapon for charger loading with the charger guides placed over the receiver. The magazine was also modified internally and a sheet steel plate attached to the bottom to cover the slot. With the addition of the backsight stamped with the Ottoman numerals this rifle was most likely sent out to Turkey as military assistance during the war. They did not always receive any further Ottoman acceptance marks. Cheers, SS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assafx Posted 29 May , 2020 Share Posted 29 May , 2020 5 hours ago, shippingsteel said: With the addition of the backsight stamped with the Ottoman numerals this rifle was most likely sent out to Turkey as military assistance during the war. They did not always receive any further Ottoman acceptance marks. Cheers, SS Thank you for clearing that up. do you think that as the war progressed they even skipped over changing the backsight? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 29 May , 2020 Share Posted 29 May , 2020 On 28/05/2020 at 03:55, SheetMetalRifile said: Here are some more pictures. No problem with those Ottoman numbers so yes Ottoman use! Also, as SS notes, an 88/05. Now what about this 1914 mark, or, rather, the symbol above it? I know I have seen it before but I can't remember where or what it means... FYI: The Ottoman High Command asked Germany sometime before May 1916 for a supply of Gew.98. They received some but Germany began to send out instead 'retired' Gew.88/05 (possibly Gew. 88/14 also). The exact numbers are unclear - possibly around 220,000 in all during a roughly 17 month period. I have always assumed these came with ‘Ersatz’ bayonets, which is why there were so many in Turkey until the 1970’s. Julian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4thGordons Posted 29 May , 2020 Share Posted 29 May , 2020 (edited) 13 hours ago, trajan said: Now what about this 1914 mark, or, rather, the symbol above it? I know I have seen it before but I can't remember where or what it means... Julian It's a manufacturers mark - I looked it up once but I can't for the life of me remember what - I think it is a German company which pre war manufactured tinplate toys and such. I have an identical one on my 88/05. I am pretty sure it was identified in a thread on here too - I shall go in search. Chris Ahhha --- here it is in ref to my very similar rifle. Edited 29 May , 2020 by 4thGordons add link Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 29 May , 2020 Share Posted 29 May , 2020 25 minutes ago, 4thGordons said: It's a manufacturers mark - I looked it up once but I can't for the life of me remember what - I think it is a German company which pre war manufactured tinplate toys and such. I have an identical one on my 88/05. I am pretty sure it was identified in a thread on here too - I shall go in search. Chris Ahhha --- here it is in ref to my very similar rifle. Thanks Chris!!! The moment I read the 'tinplate toys' it started to come back! Julian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigred Posted 26 August , 2020 Share Posted 26 August , 2020 the s with a dot shows its been altered to accept the new cartridges as your rifle is the 1888/14 the new rounds were higher pressure and slightly longer hence the small cut out just below the date stamp and the 14 dated cover under where the clip would be ejected out the bottom on the old system Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now