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Remembered Today:

grandpa in hill 60


lyndaf

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hi everyone!

 

 

 

my grandpa served at hill 60 1916-1917 as  a member of the RE.  I just wanted to know if there's anything on hill 60 at the time he was there.

many thanks

 

hope everyone's ok 

 

lyndaf

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May we assume your grandfather was

Sapper 36718 Angus Findlay 101 Field Co Royal Engineers

 

Ray

 

Edit 

The 101 Field Coy war diary can be downloaded from the National archives

 

101.JPG.4d2b44dbff70a4156882180df4c20a3e.JPG

 

Here is the LINK

Edited by RaySearching
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many thanks .

 

grandpa angus was indeed part of 101 RE and was at hill 60 from Aug 1916 to battle of messines ridge 1917.  He was there for most of that time and later was in Railway wood and hooge.  In july , he was promoted to lce/Cpl after someone else was involed in a drunken brawl.

 

 

many thanks again and regards

lyndaf

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Hi lyndaf,

 

It might also be worth downloading this war diary, and these. If there appears to be a particular association between his Field Company and one of the Infantry Brigades in 23 Division, it might be useful to get hold of a copy of their headquarters diary too. The National Archives search page is here.

 

Regards

Chris

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many thanks.

I will look into that

 

also there's a story about him getting a MM at River Piave, Italy in 0ct 27-28th 1918, when he saved his soldier mates from being drowned during the crossing of the river , when he was in the throws of trying to construct a pontoon bridge.

 

many thanks

 

lyndaf

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The MM was for "acts of gallantry and devotion to duty under fire".

 

Acts of bravery like the one you refer to, would have had a Royal Humane Society Medal

 

This PhD thesis covers RHS medals - click - look at p244/245 for ww1

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Hi,

 

There is no known existing central source for Military Medal citations. His MM index card confirms that it was for his actions in Italy. The war diary might hint towards confirming the story, but unfortunately isn't available as a download - link. If you would like a copy when the National Archives re-opens, and can't make it there yourself, a file copying service such as this one (link) would probably be very competitive in price compared to getting one direct from TNA. I guess that you'd only want the part of the record that relates to his Field Company.

 

image.png.8529c3814cc6f082cf380dfaf7d15066.png

Image sourced from Findmypast

 

The publication/notification in the London Gazette is here.

 

Regards

Chris

Edited by clk
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If he came from Coventry this might be him:    https://britishmedalforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=53195&p=737570&hilit=findlay#p737570         Post 1/4/14.

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many thanks

 

grandpa himself was bn in balham 1890, (24  yrs old when he enlisted in 1915)

The whole family moved to tooting, London 1900

but when he did his heroic deed in 1918 he also got wounded in the knee and was hospitalised in Italy, but I can't find out where as there's no war records as they were burnt during ww2.

how can I find out the hospital records?

Also there's no mention of him having any war pension.

many thanks for your help

 

regards

 lyndaf

 

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If you're incredibly lucky you might find him on Find My Past.  About 1% of hospital/CCS etc. admissions registers were retained for statistical analysis post-war, and these are now on FMP.  Worth a punt.   I find searching by regimental number to be better than a name search, btw.

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The following account by a British medical officer suggests that the crossing of the River Piave would have qualified as being under fire:

 

On the night of October 23rd-24th, by a brilliant preliminary operation, the northern part of the largest island, the Grave di Papadopoli, was captured by the British infantry, who crossed the swirling flood in flat-bottomed boats, rowed by pontieri of the Italian genio.  The way was thus prepared for the great attack by the English and the Italian corps of the Tenth Army on the night of October 26th-27th.

 

The preliminary bombardment began half an hour before midnight, and with it began the rain.  It was an anxious business waiting by the river bank for the attack at dawn, knowing that if the rain did not stop - and why should it stop in November? - the whole scheme must miscarry.

 

But stop it did, when the attack began, and it never rained again anywhere where I was till I had been a fortnight in Trieste, except for half an hour's drizzle on the morning of October 29th.  The weather-god, like every one else, had begun to Wilsoneggiare, as the Italian papers called the prevailing political tendency in Europe.

 

At 6.45 a.m., October 27th, the British and the Italians, under Lord Cavan's orders, moved to the attack, to capture the remaining part of the system of islands and the farther shore.  A fair number of Italian and Austrian wounded were carried back across the river to our ambulances in the first twenty-four hours.  But we saw less of this battle than of others at which we had assisted, because the infantry went right over the islands, through the swift channels that took their toll of them, and away across country beyond the river, leaving miles behind them every wheeled vehicle - artillery, supplies, and ambulances - unable to cross the channels until the bridges were made.

 

The British bridges, as already recorded, broke down on the night of October 27th-28th; and the Italian bridges for carrying wheeled traffic, which were our concern, were only completed to the farther shore after dusk on the evening of October 28th.

 

On the afternoon of the 27th I had walked over to the farther bank by footbridges, passing on the Islands a few corpses and many piles of Boche helmets thrown away wherever the Austrians had fled from the Italian attack.  The infantry were already far forward, out of sight even from the farther bank.

 

On the morning of the 28th I walked into San Polo, a village two miles beyond the farther bank, and found all the Italians there in high spirits, though very hungry, captured Austrian cannon still facing down the street, and all the signs of recent fighting.  But the line was somewhere far ahead.

 

In fact, the back of the business had been broken, as far as the Tenth Army was concerned, in the short, fierce struggle on the 27th, when the Austrians proved incapable of standing up to our men.  They put up their last serious rearguard action on the evening of the 29th, after which, as Lord Cavan writes, "the defeat became a rout."

 

There is an interesting and in-depth article about a British soldier drowning after falling off the pontoon bridge, just 3-days after the assault, here: 


https://www.westernfrontassociation.com/world-war-i-articles/a-farewell-to-the-army-service-corps-the-story-of-another-ernest-on-the-piave/

Edited by FROGSMILE
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many thanks.

 

giavera was also the cemetery where vera Britain's brother was buried.  he was in the 9th staffs (23 Div)

 

I've also got a little bit more research into grandpa!

 

many thanks and reguards,

lyndaf

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I was looking into the 23rd div at papadopoli island.  looks like they were next to the 7th  div at salletulelo (whoops about spelling!) so therefore right of the island. Also on the day grandpa got his mm there were 2 other soldiers (Cpls) who also got the same reward, 1 from Idle, Yorks and the other 1 from Bolton , lancs

 

 

many thanks

 

lyndaf

 

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also it seams looking further into the war diary, that grandpa got premoted to lce/Cpl ~ july 19th 1917 at dickesbusch area of ypres over a fight between two other soldiers, a sapper and a lce Cpl (both were drunk at the time).  he was a peacetime boxer (not professional) and would have carried through to wartime.  looks as though he was ordered to look after the sapper.  

I want to find out if this was true and how were boxer treated in ww1.

 

many thanks lyndaf

 

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