Where were the 24th London Regiment (The Queens) in September 1918?

[Pumfrett]

I am trying to work out where my grandfather was wounded.  Frank Isaac Shimwell was a Private with the 2/6th Notts & Derby Regiment (Sherwood Foresters).  In August 1918 he was transferred to the 24th London Regiment (Queens) and given a new regimental number – 72899.

 

We found a note with his medals, saying that he was wounded on 20th September 1918 – near Verdun.  He was a stretcher bearer and was shot in the arm.   Unfortunately his service record did not survive.  So I downloaded the War Diary for the 1/24 London Regiment (WO95-2744-2-3) from TNA, and on the 20th September it shows that the Battalion were training.  Actually, I have got the right diary for him? 

 

Earlier in September, on the 6th, it says that ‘Lt RW Turner took command of D Coy’.  Then on the 9th it says ‘D Coy acted as a Loading Party for 142 Bde.  Lt Col RSI Friend DSO leaves Battalion and goes to 142 Inf. Bde.’

 

Would my grandfather have been part of 'D Coy', and what happened to them and where did they go?  I would love to find the relevant war diary for the battalion that he was with, to find out where he was on the 20th September, and to read more about what they were going through at that time.

 

I new to the forum, so any suggestions will be hugely appreciated.
 

[alf mcm]

Welcome to the forum.

Your grandfather may have served in 2/24 London Regiment. It may be worth looking at their war diary. https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C7355100

Diary is free if you register. Once you get it,, check where each Battalion was, and see which was nearest Verdun.

Hope this helps.

 

Regards,

 

Alf McM

[Pumfrett]

Many thanks for your advice and the link - I will have a look and check where the 2/24 were at the time.  I don't think it was a bad wound as I can't see he got a pension and he wasn't disabled out.  

 

with best wishes

 

 

[Vlaamse Verhalen]

I'm pretty sure your grandfather was actually serving with the Queen's (Royal West Surrey) Regiment......he's certainly on their medal roll, along with many others whose previous unit is listed as 1/24th London Regiment.

 

Edit: ah, okay, please ignore that....I see now that the 1/24th became part of the QRWS's corps during 1916.

 

If your grandfather was injured, whilst the rest of his Battalion was elsewhere, my bet would be that he was seconded or attached to another unit. I've come across that with a couple of lads I've researched, too: recorded on the Menin Gate, whilst their Battalion was in reserve down near Arras at the same time.

 

Best wishes

Edited 14 May , 2020 by Vlaamse Verhalen

[Pumfrett]

I have just reread my notes and yes you are right, he was transferred to the Royal West Surrey (Queen's) and then posted to the 1/22 or 1/24 London Regiment - on the 30th Sept both of these were in training, and not near Verdun.  In the war diary for the 1/22 it said that 'D Coy' were then acting as a loading party for the 142 Bde - that is why I thought he might have been attached to another unit - but I have no idea where to look next for the 142 Bde!    

 

many thanks for your help

[Vlaamse Verhalen]

I've had a quick scan through a couple of the relevant war diaries & the reason why the 142nd Infantry Brigade, including its constituent Battalions (so both the 1/22nd & 1/24th) were out of the line is that their "parent" division....the 47th....had been due to "swap" with another & entrain for service in Italy. This was, at first, postponed & then presumably cancelled altogether.

 

Your grandfather was definitely on the roll for the 1/24th (as confirmed by the medal rolls), which makes no mention of the 1/22nd in relation to him.

 

Relevant war diaries for this period can be found online via the National Archives & are all free of charge at the moment:

 

47th Division (Headquarters & Staff)

 

47th Division (Assistant Director Medical Services)

 

142nd Infantry Brigade (Headquarters)

 

1/24th Battalion London Regiment (The Queen's)

 

For the sake of completeness, the diary for the 1/22nd is here, in case you're interested in that too:

 

1/22nd London Regimet (Queen's)

 

I suppose it's plausible that your grandfather may have been attached/seconded to one of the Division's Field Ambulance units, but that's purely conjecture. It might be worth a look at those too, just to check to see if they were still "active", or remained with the rest of the Division awaiting the entrainment to Italy, which never materialised......

 

Best wishes

 

 

Steve

 

[Pumfrett]

Many thanks for all the information and links - I will download and have a read.  After I went through the 1/24th diary I looked up where they were on the map, and they were not close to Verdun.  I think I need to do a lot more digging and reading!  Your thoughts on him being seconded to one of the Division's Field Ambulance Units is interesting, so I will check them out as well.  

 

with best wishes 

[Vlaamse Verhalen]

58 minutes ago, Pumfrett said:

Many thanks for all the information and links - I will download and have a read.  After I went through the 1/24th diary I looked up where they were on the map, and they were not close to Verdun.  I think I need to do a lot more digging and reading!  Your thoughts on him being seconded to one of the Division's Field Ambulance Units is interesting, so I will check them out as well.  

 

with best wishes 

 

No worries whatsoever; happy to assist, wherever possible.

 

The 47th Division's 5th London Field Ambulance is a non-starter, unfortunately: they, too, were in the Lillers vicinity, well away from the front lines, also awaiting the Italian move, it transpires.

 

One of the local entrainment instructions, for 10th September, does partly answer part of your original post, though:

 

It appears that one of the companies from each of the three battalions was, indeed, assisting with other units, in the field. In the case of the 1/24th this was evidently with the 47th Division's 6th London Field Ambulance (and cable section, in these specific circumstances). Although that answers whom the "loading party" was attached to, they were still detailed to join back up with the other constituents of their brigade on September 10th.......

 

Edited 15 May , 2020 by Vlaamse Verhalen