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Remembered Today:

Capt Alan Binnie C Flight 60 Squadron


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In his autobiography, Air of Battle,  William Fry, has Alan Binnie with 60 Squadron in December 1916 (p. 90 and photograph p. 98+). However, his casualty form at Hendon (https://www.casualtyforms.org) indicates he was not with the squadron until 15 January 1917. Does anyone have other official information to confirm this either way?

 

(Scott's history points to the later date but not conclusive and Warner's history has Jan to April 1917)

 

Many thanks.

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Alex Revell is the guy to consult on this (see his Osprey book on 60 Squadron, and of course he knew Willie Fry personally). From my own researches I can say that DV Armstrong flew with C Flight consistently from the squadron's inception until just before Christmas 1916, and he never mentions Binnie. It doesn't prove much because his notes are very sparse. However ...

 

Willie Fry's memoir speaks of C Flight members ".... Eustace Grenfell and, later, Binnie". Alex Revell gives 11 December as the date Eustace Grenfell broke his ankle in a crash, as a result of which he was invalided home and Duke Meintjes was promoted to captain and given command of C Flight ('No 60 Squadron RFC/RAF', Osprey, pp. 27-8). Alex's photo on p. 28 with Binnie is probably the one you've seen, and his fellow pilots in C Flight  in this photo don't include Armstrong or Grenfell -  if you could determine whether Binnie flew with either of those two pilots in C Flight before they left, then he definitely would have been with 60 Squadron in December 1916. I'll give Alex a head's-up in case he hasn't already seen your enquiry.

 

Best of luck

Annette

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Annette is correct. The photo on page 28 shows Binnie as a member of C Flight. Willie was absolutely positive that this photo was taken at Savy. 60 Sqdn was there from 1st Sept 1916 until 18 Jan 1917  when the sqdn moved to Filescamp Farm.

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6 hours ago, Annette Carson said:

Alex Revell is the guy to consult on this (see his Osprey book on 60 Squadron, and of course he knew Willie Fry personally). From my own researches I can say that DV Armstrong flew with C Flight consistently from the squadron's inception until just before Christmas 1916, and he never mentions Binnie. It doesn't prove much because his notes are very sparse. However ...

 

Willie Fry's memoir speaks of C Flight members ".... Eustace Grenfell and, later, Binnie". Alex Revell gives 11 December as the date Eustace Grenfell broke his ankle in a crash, as a result of which he was invalided home and Duke Meintjes was promoted to captain and given command of C Flight ('No 60 Squadron RFC/RAF', Osprey, pp. 27-8). Alex's photo on p. 28 with Binnie is probably the one you've seen, and his fellow pilots in C Flight  in this photo don't include Armstrong or Grenfell -  if you could determine whether Binnie flew with either of those two pilots in C Flight before they left, then he definitely would have been with 60 Squadron in December 1916. I'll give Alex a head's-up in case he hasn't already seen your enquiry.

 

Best of luck

Annette

Hi Annette,

Thanks for that. I agree, anything that collaborates the December 1916 date would be useful but my research on Grenfell and Armstrong is only cursory.  A brief look through the CITAs does not include a mention to Binnie though I may have missed one and operations over December very low. And of course an absence in the documents I have is no real proof of his absence from C Flight in December 1916.

Many thanks,

Adam

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5 hours ago, alex revell said:

Annette is correct. The photo on page 28 shows Binnie as a member of C Flight. Willie was absolutely positive that this photo was taken at Savy. 60 Sqdn was there from 1st Sept 1916 until 18 Jan 1917  when the sqdn moved to Filescamp Farm.

Hi Alex,

 

Appreciate you answering this for me. I of course have your excellent book on 60 Squadron, a great read!

 

I'm trying to reconstruct members of C Flight until March 1917, so your extensive knowledge very much appreciated.

 

Best,

 

Adam

Edited by Grid
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Alan Binnie's RFC/RAF service record (AIR 76/39/59 at the National Archives, Kew) lists his postings as:

  2 Sept. 1916   Reading                        

 18 Oct. 1916   26 Reserve Squadron   

 8 Nov. 1916     18 Reserve Squadron   

 24 Nov. 1916    IRS, Gosport                 

 27 Nov. 1916    Royal Aero Club Pilot Certificate & commissioned Flying Officer  

 30 Dec. 1916    Vickers Machine Gun Course 

 2 Jan. 1917       60 Squadron   

Binnie's Casualty Form differs from his service record, as follows:

3 Jan. 1917        attached to 1 ASD, in the field

15 Jan. 1917      posted to 60 Squadron

It is likely that Binnie was flying with 60 Squadron whilst he was attached to 1 ASD, as his service record indicates.

Either date, 2 January or 15 January, is prior to the date 60 Squadron changed aerodrome so Binnie could be in a

photo taken at Savy, but not in December.

 

Josquin

               

    

Edited by josquin
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6 hours ago, josquin said:

Alan Binnie's RFC/RAF service record (AIR 76/39/59 at the National Archives, Kew) lists his postings as:

  2 Sept. 1916   Reading                        

 18 Oct. 1916   26 Reserve Squadron   

 8 Nov. 1916     18 Reserve Squadron   

 24 Nov. 1916    IRS, Gosport                 

 27 Nov. 1916    Royal Aero Club Pilot Certificate & commissioned Flying Officer  

 30 Dec. 1916    Vickers Machine Gun Course 

 2 Jan. 1917       60 Squadron   

Binnie's Casualty Form differs from his service record, as follows:

3 Jan. 1917        attached to 1 ASD, in the field

15 Jan. 1917      posted to 60 Squadron

It is likely that Binnie was flying with 60 Squadron whilst he was attached to 1 ASD, as his service record indicates.

Either date, 2 January or 15 January, is prior to the date 60 Squadron changed aerodrome so Binnie could be in a

photo taken at Savy, but not in December.

 

Josquin

               

    

Thanks for this. I had just looked at the Air 76 as well and this does tie in pretty well with the Casualty Form. My guess is the WO file would line up with this as well, but it'll have to wait a while to get to the UK to check this out. Once again thanks for the information here, very useful.

 

Really interesting stuff on Binnie's WWI POW experience here. Found it on a previous thread on Binnie.

 

Adam

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