Dating and understanding uniform on picture

[LizC]

Hello

I've found the attached photo which I'm told is of a WW1 soldier, Mark Liberty Head.  From my research of this person, he joined the army on the outbreak of the First World War, attesting on 6th August 1914 joining the East Surrey Regiment (4th Batn).  Service number 7073 Rank Lance Sergeant, Corporal Corps East Surrey Regiment.  Now this photo doesn't look like someone in the ranks to me, although I'm not an expert.  Can someone recognise what kind of rank this person is, and if possible, what regiment?

 

Thanks

Liz

[museumtom]

Looks like a Khedive star on the right.

[Coldstreamer]

I agree with museumtom - you do get men from that campaign 1880s that served in ww1 - not many though

maybe someone could check the rolls (say on ancestry) for him to see if someone of this name was in Egypt then

Edited 12 January , 2020 by Coldstreamer

[Coldstreamer]

 cant see his name in the London Gazette

[Coldstreamer]

The one you have found according to the details on FMP was born 1884

 

interestingly says this - certainly an older chap in ww1 times

This recruitment register: has SR for ‘Special Reserve’ written on the spine. Until the outbreak of the war, most recruits are for the 3rd or 4th Battalions of The East Surrey Regiment. From August 1914 the recruits (mainly older men) are sent to a greater variety of units. There are very few entries for 1915. In this register, details of the mans employer have been added in the Remarks column.

[Coldstreamer]

i cant see anyone else with this exact name - maybe his father is in the picture ?

[FROGSMILE]

The photograph shows an subaltern officer of the Royal Engineers.  The velvet ‘facings’ (collar and cuffs), wavy line on the pouch belt, waist belt clasp, bullion grenade collar badges, and cocked hat, all refer.

 

Edited 12 January , 2020 by FROGSMILE

[LizC]

18 hours ago, Coldstreamer said:

i cant see anyone else with this exact name - maybe his father is in the picture ?

Thanks for everyone who has replied.  I think this really cannot be the person referred to as he had relatively brief service in WW1 and the uniform looks like an officer dress uniform (the Royal Engineers as indicated).  So if it is him, he's used the dressing up box rather than wore his own uniform.  

[LizC]

And I've just found on the Surrey Recruitment Registers record, he is described as having brown hair, the main in the photo looks quite fair.

[FROGSMILE]

2 hours ago, LizC said:

And I've just found on the Surrey Recruitment Registers record, he is described as having brown hair, the main in the photo looks quite fair.

 
The idea of ‘dressing up’ is a bit of a fallacy at that time of general seriousness, Liz, especially once the ‘rolls of honour’ (casualty lists) started to appear in newspapers.  The man in your photo is definitely a Lieutenant (commissioned officer) of Royal Engineers.

Edited 13 January , 2020 by FROGSMILE

[LizC]

Thanks, I'm assuming that the family of Mark have confused the photos in some way, maybe a relative with a similar name who was in the Royal Engineers.  My comment about dressing up was mostly in response to what else I've learned about Mark Liberty Head, where he is often difficult to pin down, changes wives/girlfriends and jobs rather often, and confuses me.  My research is rather random as I'm researching him as he was my Great Grandmother's partner.  I knew this brilliant forum would be able to help with the uniform.

 

Liz

[FROGSMILE]

1 hour ago, LizC said:

Thanks, I'm assuming that the family of Mark have confused the photos in some way, maybe a relative with a similar name who was in the Royal Engineers.  My comment about dressing up was mostly in response to what else I've learned about Mark Liberty Head, where he is often difficult to pin down, changes wives/girlfriends and jobs rather often, and confuses me.  My research is rather random as I'm researching him as he was my Great Grandmother's partner.  I knew this brilliant forum would be able to help with the uniform.

 

Liz

A family member seems likely, Liz. Whoever the Royal Engineer was he was a regular soldier and fought in Egypt or perhaps the Sudan, against the Dervishes (fanatical Islamist warriors).  We can tell this because he has the Khedive Star and either, the Egypt medal, or possibly the Sudan medal as mentioned.  
The Khedive's Star was a campaign medal established by Khedive Tewfik Pasha to reward those who had participated in the military campaigns in Egypt and the Sudan between 1882 and 1891. This included British forces who served during the 1882 Anglo-Egyptian War and the subsequent Mahdist War, who received both the British Egypt Medal and the Khedive's Star. Cast in bronze and lacquered, it is also known as the Khedive's Bronze Star.

 I can’t see it well enough to be 100% sure but the other medal looks like it might be the Indian Medal for the Relief of Chitral as that trio was a quite common group.

There is a book about the Royal Engineers Service in the campaign, which was really important because of the huge distances and difficult conditions.

 

 

Edited 13 January , 2020 by FROGSMILE

[FROGSMILE]