SJHUK Posted 9 January , 2020 Share Posted 9 January , 2020 Hi All.... I wonder if anyone can help confirming or identifying the uniform in the attached photo please? The picture is of a relative of ours Private James Huskie of the Argyll & Sutherland Highlanders 2334 who died at Ypres on the 26th of April 1915, his remains were never found & his name is on the Menin Gate Memorial. Some time ago now my brother, who is researching our family tree, posted this picture on another forum & a respondent didn't seem to think the uniform was of the A & S H's so we wondered if anyone here could help. Any opinions or info would be of help & much appreciated..... Thank you. Stuart James Huskie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KizmeRD Posted 9 January , 2020 Share Posted 9 January , 2020 It's a Cameron Highlanders badge on the sporran. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SJHUK Posted 9 January , 2020 Author Share Posted 9 January , 2020 Hi Michael, many thanks for that! 👍 Kindest regards, Stuart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KizmeRD Posted 9 January , 2020 Share Posted 9 January , 2020 Not saying he wasn't A&SH - only that the photographer's studio (in Inverness?) where he posed for the photo only had the full ceremonial dress of the local highland regiment to dress him up in. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 9 January , 2020 Share Posted 9 January , 2020 (edited) He is a drummer of the Queen’s Own Cameron Highlanders. Collar badges refer as well as that on the sporran. Drum badges were supposed to only be worn on undress but quite a number of regiments ignored that and also wore them on full dress tunics as is the case here. It’s extremely improbable that he is ‘dressing up’ and more likely that he had service with the Cameron’s as well as the A&SH. Many men were transferred after wounding and subsequent recovery. Edited 9 January , 2020 by FROGSMILE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clk Posted 9 January , 2020 Share Posted 9 January , 2020 Hi Stuart, The service papers for James (FMP link) .indicate that he attested and was embodied on 8.9.1914 to 7/A&SH. They don't appear to reference the Cameron Highlanders, or any other regiment. Regards Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bif Posted 9 January , 2020 Share Posted 9 January , 2020 Is it possible the photo is NOT of Pte James Huskie, A & S ? What info do you have to verify that's him in the photo ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SJHUK Posted 9 January , 2020 Author Share Posted 9 January , 2020 Hi All...many thanks for your replies it is really good of you & appreciated! Kisme That could be a possibility, thank you! FROGSMILE Another possibility, all worth further thought, thank you! clk Thanks for the info, will follow it up! bif What I didn’t upload was a message to his mother on the reverse of the picture confirming his name, the photo has been in our family more or less since it was taken so we understand....thank you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Atkins Posted 9 January , 2020 Share Posted 9 January , 2020 (edited) His TF attestation form mentions previous service "4 years Volunteers"; however, not sure this can realistically be squared with service in another regiment (surely he would have specified?), though in truth the regiment he was attesting for isn't actually legible on the Ancestry image, so am just assuming 7th A&SH. I'd echo bif and ask if you're sure this is your man. Cheers, Pat Edit: Curses, too slow... please ignore my last comment then! Edited 9 January , 2020 by Pat Atkins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 9 January , 2020 Share Posted 9 January , 2020 (edited) “4-years volunteers” could quite easily relate to time served with a Volunteer Battalion (VB) of his territorially ‘local’ regiment and in that sense where he lived as a young man will be key. The Cameron’s very famously had just one battalion when first formed from the 79th Foot in 1881, but a 2nd Battalion was formed in 1897 and, like all other British (but not Irish) regiments, it had a VB, in its own case formed from the 1st Inverness-shire (Inverness Highland) RVC. This would seem to fit with the photographer’s mark. In 1908, with the formation of the Territorial Force, the VB became the 4th (TF) Battalion of the Cameron Highlanders, taking their place in sequence after the 1st and 2nd (Regular) and 3rd (Special Reserve) Battalions. When on parade with their drum, drummers usually moved their sporran onto a hip, and they did not generally wear a full plaid unless parading within the band as part of the percussion section rather than in the separate corps of drums. Edited 9 January , 2020 by FROGSMILE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KizmeRD Posted 9 January , 2020 Share Posted 9 January , 2020 Pre-war 4th bn. (TF) Cameron Highlanders were base in Rose Street, Inverness, which is consistent with the photographers address. Is there a date on the back? The drummer in the photo also has a good conduct stripe, so it could well be that he did 4 years with 4CH before leaving, then deciding to join-up again once war broke out, albeit, this time with the A&SH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SJHUK Posted 9 January , 2020 Author Share Posted 9 January , 2020 Much food for thought, thanks to One & All! We will dig a bit further, double check everything & see if we can make some progress, will keep you all posted as & when! Cheers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 9 January , 2020 Share Posted 9 January , 2020 35 minutes ago, KizmeRD said: Pre-war 4th bn. (TF) Cameron Highlanders were base in Rose Street, Inverness, which is consistent with the photographers address. Is there a date on the back? The drummer in the photo also has a good conduct stripe, so it could well be that he did 4 years with 4CH before leaving, then deciding to join-up again once war broke out, albeit, this time with the A&SH. The Volunteers were not entitled to good conduct badges, which were the province of regular soldiers. Instead they had a system of efficiency and proficiency badges. It was not until WW1 conscription was enacted, which rendered such differences irrelevant, that good conduct badges (stripes) became eligible for all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aim Posted 9 January , 2020 Share Posted 9 January , 2020 Does the photo in the OP show a marksman's badge on the lower left sleeve? Were many bandsmen also marksmen? aim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SJHUK Posted 9 January , 2020 Author Share Posted 9 January , 2020 Hi....I really don't know, this goes way beyond my knowledge base! Thanks very much for your contribution though.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 9 January , 2020 Share Posted 9 January , 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, aim said: Does the photo in the OP show a marksman's badge on the lower left sleeve? Were many bandsmen also marksmen? aim Yes, it is a regular army marksman’s badge, but he is a drummer, not a bandsman. Unlike the regimental band the battalion’s corps of drums were all trained soldiers and were distributed among the rifle companies, coming together daily for practice under the drum major (sergeant drummer), but in all other respects remaining members of their respective companies. There were marksmen in all companies. Edited 9 January , 2020 by FROGSMILE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Atkins Posted 9 January , 2020 Share Posted 9 January , 2020 It's an interesting one, this - I'm not sure how a good conduct badge (good spot, by the way!) on his CH uniform in the photo fits with the scenario of 4 years in the CH Volunteers or 4/CH (at 31 yrs and 9 months on his attestation form, he could well have served pre-1908), followed by - pre-conscription, and so unbadged - war service in 7/A&SH. Frogsmile is surely right about Territorial service in his local unit, though. Were TF units known to be free and easy re putting up 'illicit' GC badges, at all? If not, I'm stymied, barring some hitherto-undisclosed Regular service prior to his joining the CH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 9 January , 2020 Share Posted 9 January , 2020 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Pat Atkins said: It's an interesting one, this - I'm not sure how a good conduct badge (good spot, by the way!) on his CH uniform in the photo fits with the scenario of 4 years in the CH Volunteers or 4/CH (at 31 yrs and 9 months on his attestation form, he could well have served pre-1908), followed by - pre-conscription, and so unbadged - war service in 7/A&SH. Frogsmile is surely right about Territorial service in his local unit, though. Were TF units known to be free and easy re putting up 'illicit' GC badges, at all? If not, I'm stymied, barring some hitherto-undisclosed Regular service prior to his joining the CH. On balance I think that on the evidence we have there has to be some doubt that this man is who the original poster thinks he is. The man shown looks too much like a regular to me and I suspect that he is a different family member, or perhaps a friend from the past. Apart from anything else, I would not expect to see a VB/TF man of that period necessarily wearing a cocked feather bonnet. A glengarry cap was more common. The usage of good conduct badges was quite strictly restricted before WW1 so it must be doubtful that he is an auxiliary, citizen-soldier. The VB/TF also had their own patterns of musketry badge pre-war. Edited 9 January , 2020 by FROGSMILE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bif Posted 9 January , 2020 Share Posted 9 January , 2020 7 hours ago, SJHUK said: What I didn’t upload was a message to his mother on the reverse of the picture Stuart, Is there any way to get a copy of the backside posted up ? It MAY actually help, re more eyes on ??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SJHUK Posted 10 January , 2020 Author Share Posted 10 January , 2020 Good morning....I don’t actually have the picture, my brother does, hopefully he has it to hand but I’ll ask him to zip me over a copy of it....thank you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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