bobpike Posted 8 January , 2020 Share Posted 8 January , 2020 I am trying to assist a friend who is researching his great grand-father, Charles Langrish who he believed served with the11th . Royal West Surreys. SDGW lists the following- LANGRISH-Private-CHARLES-6735-11th Bn.-Queen's (Royal West Surrey Regiment)----21/07/1916-----BAILLEUL COMMUNAL CEMETERY EXTENSION (NORD)-II. F. 72 LANGRISH-Private-CHARLES WILLIAM-94555-260th Coy.-Machine Gun Corps (Infantry)----01/11/1918-----KARACHI 1914-1918 WAR MEMORIAL- LANGRISH-Private-CHARLES-G/26000-1st Bn.-Buffs (East Kent Regiment)----08/10/1918-36-Son of John and Rebecca Langrish; husband of Annie Flora Langrish, of 12, Russell St., Portfield, Chichester, Sussex---VIS-EN-ARTOIS MEMORIAL-Panel 3 Unfortunately none fit the bill not least because all of these perished and his Charles most definitely did not! He was born in 1889 in Clerkenwell, London, was a resident in Islington with his paternal family. He was an inmate in 1939 in St Bernard’s Mental hospital, Hanwell. (It would be interesting to see his records and see if his illness was war realated) his profession is noted as a tailor. It seems that Royal West Surreys were recruited mainly from Lambeth whereas his great grandfather, as were the family all came from central London/ Islington area. Thank you Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
little bob Posted 8 January , 2020 Share Posted 8 January , 2020 A possible, 3/3968 Pte., Charles Langrish D C L I Served 11/3/1909 - 2/5/1916 discharged due to wounds, SWB issued. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corisande Posted 8 January , 2020 Share Posted 8 January , 2020 (edited) The 1939 Register gives him as born 9 Oct There is a "rough transcription" of R West Surrey on FmP which has this man, but wrong age (which could be transcription). Who also has a MIC. He is the first man on your OP list. Does this mean 2 Charles Langrish in R West Surrey? He may also be the man who volunteered for Red Cross in 1912 But he died Jul 1916 First name(s) Charles Last name Langrish Birth year 1892 Age 23 years Year 1915 Attestation date 04 Nov 1915 Length of service 3 years Service number 6735 Regiment Queen's Royal West Surrey Regiment County Surrey Country England Series Queen's Royal West Surrey Regiment Rough Register Of Recruits 1914-1917 Edited 8 January , 2020 by corisande Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corisande Posted 8 January , 2020 Share Posted 8 January , 2020 And this is the Red Cross Volunter First name(s) Charles Last name Langrish Year 1912 Birth year - Rank Private Address Albury Nr. Guildford County Surrey Country England Engagement date 03/1912 Pay at engagement 0 Termination date 1920 Rank at termination Private Pay at termination 0 Hours worked Occasional Commission Surrey Duties Unloading Convoys Wounded Archive British Red Cross Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corisande Posted 8 January , 2020 Share Posted 8 January , 2020 And finally I found this in a news report of Feb 1916 I suppose the obvious questions to ask are 1. How do you know the 11th R West Surrey. Or has someone just taken a punt at it. There is a link t a MIC on one of the Ancestry trees, which is the Charles #6735 who died 2. Do you have access to his medals Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Posted 8 January , 2020 Share Posted 8 January , 2020 Bob, If you know he survived the war, would you expect to find a match in 'Soldiers Died in the Great War'? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryBrook Posted 8 January , 2020 Share Posted 8 January , 2020 A record card exists for a dependant's pension claim in respect of 6735 Pte. Charles Langrish by his mother, Mrs. Jane Langrish, "Haslemere", St. James Avenue, Sutton, Surrey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobpike Posted 8 January , 2020 Author Share Posted 8 January , 2020 Thank you. More information/specualation. The onus is very much on London in the area of Holborn, Islington etc. All the information has come down through family stories, The medals are lost. His parents were Joseph and Mary with a large family including a brother George and a sister Elizabeth. He may have been wounded but he is not the DCLI Langrish Amazed how many Langrishes there are! Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark1959 Posted 8 January , 2020 Share Posted 8 January , 2020 (edited) A Charles Langrish with correctly named parents baptised 31/10/1888, St Silas Penton St. Father's profession is "Trimmer". This chap's DOB is noted as 9/9/1888, 1891 census shows very large family and father as an "iron dresser". Mother Mary Ann. 1939 inmate says 9/10/1888. Possibly bingo DCLI Man If this is the correct CL here then FMP has a POW record here with the same address. Parents name correct. Brother George. No Elizabeth found. Man propopsed by Little Bob above. Leg amputated. POW. The meaning of the codes is given on the previous page(26) on FMP All looks to fit except the family story Think these are the relevant ICRC records https://grandeguerre.icrc.org/en/File/Details/4312142/3/2/ Another record of POW conditions for him https://search.findmypast.co.uk/record/browse?id=gbm%2fpow-gallip%2f101598696%2f00164 Edited 8 January , 2020 by Mark1959 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milner Posted 8 January , 2020 Share Posted 8 January , 2020 (edited) Here he is in the 1891 and 1911 census. Joseph Langrish Head Male 64 London Saint Pancras, London Mary Langrish Wife Female 63 London St Lukes, London William Langrish Son Male 32 London Islington, London Charles Langrish ************************* Occupation: Carman Son Male 22 London Clerkenwell, London Henry Langrish Son Male 19 London Islington, London Name: Charles Langrish Event Type: Census Event Date: 1891 County: London Parish: Clerkenwell Ecclesiastical Parish: ST JAMES PENTONVILLE Registration District: Holborn Gender: Male Age: 2 Relationship to Head of Household: Son Birth Year (Estimated): 1889 Birthplace: London, England Page Number: 56 Registration Number: RG12 Piece/Folio: 227/ 66 Household Role Sex Age Birthplace Joseph Langrish Head M 43 London, England Mary A Langrish Wife F 43 London, England Joseph H Langrish Son M 23 London, England Thomas Langrish Son M 22 London, England John Langrish Son M 18 London, England Mary A Langrish Daughter F 17 London, England Catherine Langrish Daughter F 14 London, England William Langrish Son M 12 London, England James Langrish Son M 11 London, England Annie Langrish Daughter F 7 London, England George Langrish Son M 4 London, England Charles Langrish Son M 2 London, England Mary A Green Mother In Law F 67 London, England Line Number: 14 Citing this Record "England and Wales Census, 1891," database with images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:3RYQ-KMM : 1 May 2019), Mary A Green in household of Joseph Langrish, Clerkenwell, London, England, United Kingdom; from "1891 England, Scotland and Wales census," database and images, findmypast (http://www.findmypast.com : n.d.); citing PRO RG 12, London county, subdistrict, The National Archives of the UK, Kew, Surre Edited 8 January , 2020 by Milner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobpike Posted 8 January , 2020 Author Share Posted 8 January , 2020 That is briliant, my friend is delighted and is most grateful. He will now try and find out when and why he ended up in the DCLI He feels that sadly it may well explain his time in hospital, the trauma of loss of a leg far from home as a POW - another casualty of war Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark1959 Posted 8 January , 2020 Share Posted 8 January , 2020 (edited) He is on a War Office List of 15/10/15. . Returned prisoners of war who have been repatriated. Admitted to the 3rd London General Hospital, Wandsworth. 1/DCLI. To France 11/9/14. Captured 31/10/14 at La Bassee. The 1/DCLI Roll page for his 1914 Star has men for other regiments transfered. 1/DCLI had been in France since 15/8/14. The ancestry index refs East Surrey Regiment for him but there is nothing on the page to justify, Cannot find his MIC or a Pension Ledger card for him Interestingly both 1/ESR and 1/DCLI were in 14th Brigade, 5th Division and went out 15/8/14. Curious. His number is also a bit strange for a man in a regular battalion. Refers to a reserve battalion. Looking at close numbers for any pattern Edited 8 January , 2020 by Mark1959 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark1959 Posted 8 January , 2020 Share Posted 8 January , 2020 (edited) 3/3910 enlisted 16/2/09 . Went out same day. Ancestry also show ESR without apparent justification 3/3969 ditto without enlistment date 3/3921 ditto without enlistment date 3/3991 ditto enlisted 28/6/09 3/3925 Ditto - this man died 28/10/14 and was from London. See many other with ESR without justification on ancestry - assuming it is an error until clear evidence 3/3998 is also from London. Killed 1915 edit: Looks to have been a drive to get London chaps to join DCLI as Special Reservists 3/3734 EJ Everton was from Tottenham joined Jan 1909 for 6 years. Annual training undertaken. Mobilised 8/8/14 and to Franc. Posted to 1 DCLI on 11/9/14 day moved to France 3/4101 enlisted same terms 11/9/09 - Stoke Newington native 3/3368 Same terms 10/12/08. Lambeth Very few records of the batch survive. Indeed none found yet in the 3/39nn range. The ESR issue on ancestry issue is a complete red herring. They all enlisted directly into the DCLI Special Reserve battalion. Everton is only the only one found to be mobilised. Only one of three still in the reserve. Think there is enough of pattern. If I can find another few mobilised on 8/8/14 it would then be a reasonable conclusion Langrish was as well. edit 2 3/4346 enlisted 28/9/10 was also mobilised 8/8/14 and posted 1 DCLI 11/9/14. Plumstead 3/3841 enlisted 1/2/09. Mobilised 8/8/14 and posted 1 DCLI 11/9/14. Upton Park. That will do for me. Conclusion: Langrish enlisted for 6 years in Special reserve, 3 DCLI, in 1909. Went to the camps 1909-14, Mobilised 8/8/14 and was posted to 1 DCLI on move to France 11/9/14. That is definitely the near number pattern. Edited 8 January , 2020 by Mark1959 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobpike Posted 9 January , 2020 Author Share Posted 9 January , 2020 Thank you Mark and everyone else, from a start with very little to go on my friend has much to work on Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobpike Posted 9 January , 2021 Author Share Posted 9 January , 2021 This image has come to light ostensibly of CHARLES LANGRISH, can anyone confirm his regiment as DCLI please? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Posted 9 January , 2021 Share Posted 9 January , 2021 (edited) I think that might be a T [Territotial] on the shoulder title and possibly a curved horn that is a common insignia for Light Infantry regiments. Although it could just be the ornate knot in the badge. What have they done to this photo? Looks like some silly filter effect has been applied that kills all the fine detail. Can you get hold of the original, and post it in its natural state? Edited 9 January , 2021 by Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Broomfield Posted 9 January , 2021 Share Posted 9 January , 2021 No T, I think (it's the bow at the top of the bugle strings and a T would be above them), but certainly a Light Infantryman, and Cornwall would fit with the long curved title. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark1959 Posted 9 January , 2021 Share Posted 9 January , 2021 (edited) I would say it is DCLI, The bit nearest the neck on the shooulder title has the correct shape for DCLI. As my Welsh colleague says the detail has pobably been destroyed by the filter. But not certain Edited 9 January , 2021 by Mark1959 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Posted 9 January , 2021 Share Posted 9 January , 2021 1 minute ago, Steven Broomfield said: No T, I think (it's the bow at the top of the bugle strings and a T would be above them), but certainly a Light Infantryman, and Cornwall would fit with the long curved title. Yes just thought that ta. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jay dubaya Posted 9 January , 2021 Share Posted 9 January , 2021 Shoulder title appears to include a bugle horn, impossible to say which county the title is but could be Cornwall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobpike Posted 9 January , 2021 Author Share Posted 9 January , 2021 Does this help, gentlemen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Posted 9 January , 2021 Share Posted 9 January , 2021 Much better, thank you. Yes that's a Light Infantry insignia, a bugle or horn with a knotted string above, and the curved title below is long and could well say Cornwall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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