Records for a serviceman and RAOC regimental information

[midge15]

Can anyone assist me in finding out more about my wife's great grandfather who served in the RAOC during WW 1. I have his rank and service number and have seen the medal cards kept by Ancestry. As this is a regiment about which I know nothing, all and any information will be of help in creating a picture of this mans life .

 

Name :- John Healey Richards

Rank:-  Private

Regiment: RAOC

Number:- s/7958

John was English, lived in Canada pre WW1, served throughout the war, surviving and eventually returning to Canada. I have records for War Gratuity payments for guardianship of his children with their maternal grandfather as sadly his wife died in early 1919 while he was still in service. Guardianship was granted and John returned alone to Canada (I presume 4 years of war and the death of his wife left their toll on his mental state.)

Thanks in advance.

Barry

[MaxD]

His medal records appear to be the only records that have survived (60% or so were lost in WW2).

 

He went to France on 12 Dec 1914 (entered on the card) qualifying him for the 1914/1915 Star. He was released to the reserve  (the normal release process) on 4 March 1919.

 

The Army Ordnance Corps became Royal in 1918, see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Army_Ordnance_Corps

 

As his record has not survived, we don't know which of the many AOC units he served with.

 

Max

[PRC]

2 hours ago, midge15 said:

John was English

 

The only match in the birth records for England and Wales is that of a John "Healy" Richards, mothers maiden name Lemar, which was registered in the Canterbury District of Kent in the July to September quarter, (Q3), of 1889. You had 42 days after the event to register a birth without facing prosecution and a fine \ jail, so potentially a birth registered in that quarter could have occurred as early as mid-May 1889.

 

Reason for mentioning that is that the death of a John "Healy" Richards was registered in the Hastings District of Sussex in the January to March quarter, (Q1), of 1974. Post 1969 the quarterly index of deaths in England & Wales published by the General Registrars Office included a date of birth. Note while this could come from documentation like a birth certificate or a passport, it could simply be the information available to the person notifying the death. In Johns' case all that is shown is June 1889.

 

Reason for stating all that is that December 1914 is a bit early for a civilian who volunteered even at the start of August 1914 to be going out to a Theatre of War - not impossible, just a bit unlikely. Of course if he had relevant experience for a technical job like the AOC that might bump him up the queue, but bear in mind you're also saying he is coming from Canada. What seems more likely is that he had some Military experience, possibly in the UK or with the Canadian Forces \ Militia.

 

On the 1910 Census of Canada there is a married John H Richards, born England 1889 \ age 21, working as a Fitter, recorded along with wife Elizabeth, born England 1888 \ age 22, recorded as "Roomers" at an address in the Simcox East District of Ontario. The couple arrived in Canada in 1910. There are no children recorded living with them.

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:276R-YC8

 

Now I don't know what Canadian birth certificates are like, but I suspect rather like British one there will be fathers occupation details. If they haven't had any children by 1910, barring twins they are going to struggle to fit in four children before John takes himself off to the war. So any birth certificate issued might only show Rank and Corps, but it may well show more details like unit.

 

Another angle is to look at men with nearby service numbers to see if a discernible pattern emerges - at least as to when they enlisted and what their first posting was. It may be John was just part of a replacement draft, but he could have been going over with the first of the new divisions created from Battalions that had been on Garrison Duty in the British Empire, or even the start of the Territorial Divisions.

 

Even if Service \ Pension \ Discharge records haven't survived, don't forget MiC's for the Silver War Badge and the associated Silver Wall Badge Roll. These will normally show date of enlistment.

 

As a starter try looking for

S/7949 Francis Ellis. Landed France 29.10.14

S/7950 John Hodge Landed France 12.12.14. Commissioned 1916, so details will be in his Officers papers.

S/7951 – No match in the MiCs held at the National Archive.

S/7952 William Wilkins. VM & BWM only.

S/7953 Walter H Fox. Landed France 1.10.14

S/7954 William Gainty. Landed France 9.10.14

S/7955 Cecil G Dawson, subsequently M2/132517 Army Service Corps. Landed France 29.10.14

7956 Henry Halley, subsequently M2/113292 Army Service Corps. Landed France 12.12.14

S/7957 James Irving, subsequently M2/113293 Army Service Corps. Landed France 29.10.14

S/7958 ~~~~~~

S/7959 James Carpenter. VM & BWM & IGSM (India General Service medal) only.

S/7960 George W Howe. First landed Egypt 28.9.15

S/7961 George F Gray subsequently WR/509625 Royal Engineers. Landed France 12.12.14

S/7962 Henry E Fraser. First landed Egypt 30.6.15

S/7963 Griffith Bowen Morgan subsequently M2/113294 Army Service Corps then commissioned in the Auxilliary Ambulance Cavalry Corps and the Army Service Corps. Landed France 24.9.14. Deatails will be in Officers papers.

7964 James Francis Fleming. SWB MiC. Enlisted 25.8.14, discharged 1915.

S/7965 John C Barron. Landed France 12.12.14 (Misconduct discharge 1915)

S/7966 John Marchant, subsequently M2/132518 Army Service Corps. Landed France 14.10.14.

S/7967 George Fennell, subsequently M2/176534 Army Service Corps. Landed Frane 6.11.14.

 

Hope that helps.

 

Good luck with your search,

Peter

Edited 7 November , 2019 by PRC
Typo

[midge15]

 

For PRC

 

""On the 1910 Census of Canada there is a married John H Richards, born England 1889 \ age 21, working as a Fitter, recorded along with wife Elizabeth, born England 1888 \ age 22, recorded as "Roomers" at an address in the Simcox East District of Ontario. The couple arrived in Canada in 1910. There are no children recorded living with them.""

 

 

Thanks. we are talking about the same person. He was English but lived in Canada , married there too. Came back to England , intended to go back to Canada but War got in the way.

Had two girls. They stayed in UK with Grandad.

Will follow up on service suggestions.

 

For MaxD

As I said I found some Canadian records covering post war but as you point out his wartime records were a casualty of WW2 bombing I suspect. I expect the RAOC reference on the Canadian records is because its post 1919 and it would be Royal by then.

 

My thanks to you both for the assistance and pointers .I will follow them up

Kind regards

Barry

[MaxD]

9 hours ago, midge15 said:

I expect the RAOC reference on the Canadian records is because its post 1919 and it would be Royal by then.

 

Exactly right, you'll note his medal card has AOC top right (when he joined) but the medal roll references, middle left, have RAOC as they were 1920 ish.

 

Max