Armistice Day in danger of fading away

[Moonraker]

So thinks a Sunday Times reporter in an article behind a paywall. Apparently Remembrance Day parades are being scaled back, "sparking concerns that the tradition may wither as the First World War recedes into history". One problem is that police and councils are cutting traffic and marshalling services.

 

It would seem that attempts to widen the public's perception of the Day have failed, not helped by the fact that it is closely linked to the date and time that the Armistice began. But I gather that it became Remembrance Day at the end of WWII, to commemorate those who died in that conflict.

 

Moonraker

[The Scorer]

I think it depends on what they mean by "Armistice Day".

 

It's correct that the actual day (11th November) is often not commemorated by large scale parades etc. as we see on Remembrance Sunday, but it is still commemorated. The Western Front Association hold a parade at The Cenotaph every year, which I've not been to because of work and location, and this is the only one that I know about. Nearer to home for me, quite a few people from my office and the other offices etc. around the Civic Centre in Cardiff gather around the War Memorial in Alexandra Gardens to mark the 11th hour of the 11th day of the 11th month. Nothing's formally organised, it's just a group of people, many of whom don't know each other, waiting for the guns to sound the salute from Cardiff Castle and falling silent. My office (the Welsh Government) also announces that there will be a silence at 11.00am and asks everyone to observe it - which I think that they do.

 

Remembrance Sunday parades are a different matter. It's true that there have been problems with the police and councils providing resources to close roads etc., but I think for the most part these have been resolved satisfactorily. One problem that is relevant, though, is that there aren't very many bands available to lead parades. I've mentioned before that I'm a member of a Boys' Brigade Stedfast Band; we've taken part in the Newport Parade for many years, mostly as the second band, but for the last two years (following the demise of the Newport Pipe Band) we're the lead (and only) band. We are, in fact, one of only two "youth" bands in the Newport area, the other one being the local Scout Band which leads their local parade. In the afternoon, we combine to lead the parade at Usk, which is very enjoyable. I also know of some of places that don't have a band still have a "parade", but they assemble at their local Cenotaph and hold a service there, which is well supported. 

 

So, whilst I agree that there are problems, I don't agree that it is in danger of fading away.

[Moonraker]

The article  relates to Remembrance Sunday parades, but the headline says "Armistice Day is in danger of fading away". In today's high-tech age I don't know how reporters' articles are processed, but presumably someone else fits them into available space and provides headlines. "Armistice" is shorter than "Remembrance" and thus would commend itself to that "someone else".

 

Moonraker

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[chaz]

one of our local parades  may be less the Fire Service this year. because of many new recruits it has been decided by the higher ups that as all fire fighters have their work suits but not all have No1 dress suits, they will parade in work kit...the heavy duty boots and all. otherwise it would be 75% N01 and 25% civvies or work.

this has met the disapproval of the 'troops' due to weight and if its warm or wet .

we will be in France for 11/11, I expect we will pass by a few local events, mostly in side streets so no interruption to traffic.

[gilbo139]

The Sunday Times reporter should come to Worcester. The main event at the Cathedral on Remembrance  Sunday has grown year on year since I started going in the seventies. The Fire Service attend the march past in fire kit , because of cut backs they are no longer issued ....best bib and tucker !....and worse still, again because of cut backs, there are only about 8 instead of the 14 that used to turn up !

[seaJane]

Armistice Day event on the 11th where I work. 

[PhilB]

Any idea why the cut off date for remembrance is 1914? Lots of service people before that date deserving our gratitude.

[Michael Thomson]

I'm not sure about how public events for Armistice Day/ Remembrance Day are holding up to the passage of time in Europe or in Britain as I live in South Africa , where there are very few if any public commemorations of the above. 

 

I do however notice that a very large number of people in Britain wear poppies around this time of year, both private individuals and those in the public eye like television presenters etc. 

 

This gives me hope that the concept is not dying out. I do however believe that it has morphed somewhat in peoples' minds from a marking of the Armistice (ie purely WW1) to a more generalised 'Remembrance' of those who have died in combat. Either way, it is encouraging that people are remembering.

[sassenach]

2 hours ago, PhilB said:

Any idea why the cut off date for remembrance is 1914? Lots of service people before that date deserving our gratitude.

I suppose there has to be a cut off, otherwise you could go back to 1066...The concept of remembrance only really took hold after WW1.

Edited 5 November , 2019 by sassenach

[Gunner Hall]

The Remembrance parade in Sunderland gets bigger every year.   This year they are installing viewing screens so people who can't get to the memorial (because of the crowds) can see the service.

[keithfazzani]

Just returned from Canterbury. I would suggest that less than 10% of people were wearing poppies. This despite a presence of a large RBL stall in the centre of the city. The lack of poppies wasn’t restricted to any particular age group. The restaurant where we had lunch was average age 60+ and I only saw one person other than my colleague and myself wearing a poppy. Perhaps there is still time, but I was surprised.   

[Black Maria]

I didn't notice any WW1 vignettes in this years BBC Remembrance Day coverage for the first time that i can remember . Maybe they think that now the centenary 

has ended they will just let it fade away, like the old soldiers have and concentrate their efforts on more recent conflicts .

[Michelle Young]

I would say that the turn out at Castle Combe today was consistent with that of recent years. The bugler was missing due to ill health but as always, the Minister conducted a moving service. 

[mbriscoe]

On 03/11/2019 at 23:02, gilbo139 said:

The Sunday Times reporter should come to Worcester. The main event at the Cathedral on Remembrance  Sunday has grown year on year since I started going in the seventies. The Fire Service attend the march past in fire kit , because of cut backs they are no longer issued ....best bib and tucker !....and worse still, again because of cut backs, there are only about 8 instead of the 14 that used to turn up !

 

I can't see any problem with the Fire Brigade turning out in their kit, they don't have to wear all of it.  In most rural areas (i.e. perhaps the majority of War Memorials) there will probably be a retained crew with one appliance so will quite likely attend ready for a call.

 

I noticed in the news that when the funeral was held a month or so ago for the police officer murdered on duty, the fire brigade had to turn out to call.  That was quite a large town so perhaps others were in uniform in the church. 

 

 

28 minutes ago, Black Maria said:

I didn't notice any WW1 vignettes in this years BBC Remembrance Day coverage for the first time that i can remember . Maybe they think that now the centenary 

has ended they will just let it fade away, like the old soldiers have and concentrate their efforts on more recent conflicts .

 

Could just be that there other things to do 'vignettes' on.  They can't do everything every year.

 

 

[Black Maria]

10 minutes ago, mbriscoe said:

 

 

 

 

Could just be that there other things to do 'vignettes' on.  They can't do everything every year.

 

 

We shall see .

[Alan24]

We seem to have done it back to front in Southampton this year...

Last post at 10.58

2 minutes silence 

11 bongs

Reveille on the 11th bong.

 

Regards

 

Alan.

 

 

[gilbo139]

A terrific turnout at Worcester today.......however an absolute shambles of a Remembrance Service held outside at the Cross of Sacrifice in the Cathedral grounds .....if you weren’t in the first few rows,  people who didn’t know the service had started were still talking so I didn’t here the last post or in fact any spoken word...... compared to twenty years ago theres probably 5 times more people now but it certainly needs some sort of PA system so people can here what’s going on.......I am pleased to say though that the local TA still fire a field gun at the start and at the end of the two minute silence even after some do gooder  tried to stop it some years ago in case anyone was offended. And yes my old comrades from the Fire Brigade were there but another first for me....17 years out of the job.....I never knew one of them.....makes me feel old .....RIP

[Gunner Bailey]

Chatham Militaria fair today and I'd say poppies were at about 90%. Two minutes silence immaculately observed. My wife was in Canterbury this morning so that's another poppy there Keith.

Edited 10 November , 2019 by Gunner Bailey

[KONDOA]

With respect to those that died . We should now look to the future and those veterans of many recent wars. We cannot change the past but influence the future. I live in Vietnam which saw many multiples of our own casualties and dead during the American War, the future is the answer, not living in the past. Only the living make the future. We respect those that died but those soldiers who lived had a harder burden to bear.

 

Roop

[chaz]

all quiet around Doullens and over to Beaumont Hamel, Serre , Gommecourt area today. maybe tomorrow there maybe more on show as the French tend to commemorate on the 11th not nearest sunday.

[mbriscoe]

The BBC commentary made an odd comment about the Sappers digging trenches ahead of the lines, not carrying any identification if they were killed it said that the CWGC could not bury the bodies.  I think he had got a garbled story, they were strict on war graves in WWI but they would have been buried in CWGC graves without a name

[Malcolm Linham]

I have been to two commemorations today ,  The Avon branch of the WFA  does a small one in Greenbank cemetery, Bristol  when it was started only a few years ago it was approx only five members of the WFA. Today we were joined by the local church for the third time and the numbers are slowly growing.

I then returned to my home village where because they share the local band the service was at 3:00pm,. A new war memorial has been put up in the High Street , and number seem to well up on last year, even if the retained fire crew could not take part because half way through service they were called out. 

  

[johntanner]

Over 250 at St Andrew’s Enfield this morning. About double our normal service numbers.

[MikeyH]

Around 300 present at the Cenotaph service in our small town.

 

Mike.

[keithfazzani]

I took the service in a small Kentish village today. Despite my earlier comments about poppies it was very well attended. Most moving was the attendance of a goodly number of children from the local junior school. They had each made their own poppy crosses with lollipop sticks and hand made poppies, they were obviously very carefully and lovingly made. They also laid a beautiful wreath which they had made. I found their presence very moving and an “encouragement” for the future.