Guest Posted 8 October , 2019 Share Posted 8 October , 2019 15 hours ago, johnboy said: don;t know Dai. I cant open your link. Maiden Name was May Wray Not Fay Wray? ........ King Kong.....Just a thought So we do know he is the KRRC man- all helps. I cannot see a debriefing record for him as a POW. Do we know when he was reported "Missing"? This might enable us to work out when he was lost from KRRC-and to have a look at any debrief reports from 1918-1919 to see what happened to KRRC and those captured by Germans Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnboy Posted 8 October , 2019 Author Share Posted 8 October , 2019 8 minutes ago, voltaire60 said: Not Fay Wray? ........ King Kong.....Just a thought So we do know he is the KRRC man- all helps. I cannot see a debriefing record for him as a POW. Do we know when he was reported "Missing"? This might enable us to work out when he was lost from KRRC-and to have a look at any debrief reports from 1918-1919 to see what happened to KRRC and those captured by Germans John is the KRRC man Captured Battle of the Dunes along with many others. Going back to the man in question , Alfred. Was he ruled out for service on medical grounds? Was he sent for munitions Service? How did he get The shop/shops in Danbury Street? Not being that good at family trees I now see that it could be helpful.Who were Alfreds uncles or cousins? Did they include a Jonas Hewish , Eagle street, I am trying to see if any money could have come from other family members. I think Alfreds father died around 1911 leaving his mother Emma a widow to bring up 4 children One son ,John was a house painter, The other , Thomas was an Apprentice, so I assume Not much money coming in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Posted 8 October , 2019 Share Posted 8 October , 2019 15 hours ago, johnboy said: I don;t know Dai. I cant open your link. Maiden Name was May Wray FMP confirm death year as 1918 The link isn't important johnboy. It only links to an image of the page in the GRO register. It wouldn't give any extra detail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnboy Posted 8 October , 2019 Author Share Posted 8 October , 2019 (edited) 1932 Electoral Roll shows Alfred and Florence at 36 Danbury street but abode 2 Fortress road NW5. 32 and 34 are under 2 other names. I am now wondering if the shops were only rented and Alfred had only taken over the rents on the three originally 1919 electoral roll shows Alfred and Florence at 34 Danbury street. Edited 8 October , 2019 by johnboy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PRC Posted 8 October , 2019 Share Posted 8 October , 2019 Have you tracked them down on the 1939 National Register? On FMP, (and possibly Ancestry), the scan of the original document has been taken in such a way thay you can usually see the first column of the facing page.That columns header is "See Instructions". What it appears to have been used for subsequently is to record WW2 Civil Defence roles. While not everyone who served in the Air Raid Police \ Special Constabulary \ National Fire Service \ St Johns Ambulance et al had previous Armed Forces experience, I would have thought for most males born before 1900 this would have been the case. It's not definative, it doesn't include the Home Guard and I've no doubt there were far more veterans of the Great War still alive in 1939 than ever served in all those organisations put together. It's just I've had the pleasure of researching a few Norfolk Village Rolls of Honour for those who served rather than just those who died and there seems to be a strong correlation with them turning up on the 1939 National Register in those roles - if they lived that long. On the odd occasion the notes in that column also reference previous military service - particularly if the man was an officer or senior NCO. It may also reference when an individual was released from the Civil Defence Roll to serve in the Armed Forces - although admittedly I've only come across that twice since these records became available. Will probably be a blank, but always worth a check. Sometimes the information being looked for will turn up in the oddest of places Cheers, Peter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnboy Posted 8 October , 2019 Author Share Posted 8 October , 2019 I will check 1939 Register I think it will show him at The greenway Hendon. I have downloaded a PO directory for about 1891 700 odd pages long, to try and find original keeper of the shops Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnboy Posted 8 October , 2019 Author Share Posted 8 October , 2019 The 1939 register throws up more questions Alfred is shown as Provisions shop Foreman and the 3 rd entry is strange https://www.findmypast.co.uk/transcript?id=TNA/R39/0819/0819J/004/32 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skipman Posted 8 October , 2019 Share Posted 8 October , 2019 13 minutes ago, johnboy said: The 1939 register throws up more questions Alfred is shown as Provisions shop Foreman and the 3 rd entry is strange Could "Foreman" be "Salesman" Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnboy Posted 8 October , 2019 Author Share Posted 8 October , 2019 (edited) possibly Mike.it says foreman on transcription but could have been misread, The 3rd entry is strange Edited 8 October , 2019 by johnboy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skipman Posted 8 October , 2019 Share Posted 8 October , 2019 6 minutes ago, johnboy said: possibly Mike. The 3rd entry is strange You mean Florence M M Paine (Hewish) born 1920. Don't you recognize the name? Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Posted 8 October , 2019 Share Posted 8 October , 2019 15 minutes ago, Skipman said: You mean Florence M M Paine (Hewish) born 1920. Don't you recognize the name? Mike And there's more: Births Mar 1917 (>99%) Hewish Alfred L Slade Shoreditch 1c 92 Hewish Frederick T Slade Shoreditch 1c 93 Births Sep 1918 (>99%) Hewish Alfred J Slade Eastbourne 2b 98 Births Jun 1920 (>99%) Hewish Florence M M Slade Islington 1b 647 Births Dec 1922 (>99%) Hewish David Slade Islington 1b 489 Births Sep 1924 (>99%) Hewish Leonard R Slade Islington 1b 435 Births Jun 1926 (>99%) Hewish Dennis Slade Islington 1b 407 Births Sep 1927 (>99%) Hewish Ronald Slade Islington 1b 402 Births Jun 1930 (>99%) Hewish Rheta Slade Islington 1b 434 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnboy Posted 8 October , 2019 Author Share Posted 8 October , 2019 I don't think I would know her name But if she was born 1920 why was she still using Paine in 1939? Adopted or result of naughties by mother? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Posted 8 October , 2019 Share Posted 8 October , 2019 (edited) She married sometime after 1939. Paine is her married name. They kept the register going well into the 1970s (I think), as the National Registration number continued as the NHS number. Women as they married had their entries amended with their married surname. Marriages Jun 1942 (>99%) Hewish Florence M M Paine Hendon 3a 1582 Edited 8 October , 2019 by Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnboy Posted 8 October , 2019 Author Share Posted 8 October , 2019 Thanks Dai. Sorting out where all these people fit in is a nightmare for me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skipman Posted 8 October , 2019 Share Posted 8 October , 2019 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Dai Bach y Sowldiwr said: She married sometime after 1939. Paine is her married name. Married Edit second quarter 1942 Mike Edited 8 October , 2019 by Skipman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnboy Posted 8 October , 2019 Author Share Posted 8 October , 2019 1 minute ago, Skipman said: Married Edit second quarter 1942 Mike So why use the name 2 yrs before marriage? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skipman Posted 8 October , 2019 Share Posted 8 October , 2019 Hmmm this from 1940 so not sure where we are or who's who? Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnboy Posted 8 October , 2019 Author Share Posted 8 October , 2019 I think the last entry might be correct.Seen the name West on another marriage record on FMP. Bethnal Green would tie in. Florence died1993 registered Barnet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnboy Posted 8 October , 2019 Author Share Posted 8 October , 2019 Before I started this topic. I wondered why I had not heard of him. I wondered if he fell out with his family because he had not fought during the war.One brother killed, one brother a POW. I have no evidence of exemption from service. Now I am back to thinking there was a family fallout for whatever reason. In 1939 he lived a 10 minute walk from his brother, John, wife and nephew and nieces.I saw my granddad and nan ,weekly. I would have thought i would have met him at some time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Posted 8 October , 2019 Share Posted 8 October , 2019 1 hour ago, johnboy said: So why use the name 2 yrs before marriage? The word 'PAINE' wasn't written in the register in 1939. It would have been added after she got married. For example, in the 1939 register, my mum's maiden surname is crossed out and married surname written in. She got married in 1951. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Posted 8 October , 2019 Share Posted 8 October , 2019 1 hour ago, Skipman said: Hmmm this from 1940 so not sure where we are or who's who? Mike 1 hour ago, johnboy said: I think the last entry might be correct.Seen the name West on another marriage record on FMP. Bethnal Green would tie in. Florence died1993 registered Barnet But it might be a co-incidence. There are a lot of "Florence M"s around. Of the 22 Florence Paines married between 1940 and 1983, 9 were 'Florence M's. Alfred's daughter was Florence M. M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnboy Posted 8 October , 2019 Author Share Posted 8 October , 2019 I think this is the correct one. i Think her full name was Florence Maud Minnie.from other docs I have Seen Thanks for help. I seem to have had a few unknown relatives. But no answer as to why Alfred did not serve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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