James William Pearson dob 14/10/1896

[Pat Atkins]

I've been down similar pathways in my own family research, Lahana - this is a red herring about the wounding/SWB, proceding from a plausible, but incorrect, assumption - it's a pattern horribly familiar to me!  Accordingly, I also reckon 78108 is your man. Some good work being done on here, congratulations to all.

 

Cheers, Pat.

[Lahana]

2 minutes ago, ss002d6252 said:

Even smaller at the moment !

 

Where does the date of his wounding come from ?

What details do you have on Harold ? - quite often it turns out that family history can confuse parties.
 

Craig

After their parents died in 1933/34 the siblings went their seperate ways and my mum grew up not knowing her aunts and uncles. All we know about Harold is what I can gather from census etc and that he was born only a year after James. It was definitely James in the photo in uniform hanging on the wall for so many years

[RaySearching]

Here is the Medal Roll  for 78108 N/F - GS79466 R/F

(details previously posted by Max post7)

Served as William Pearson 

entered the theater of war with the Northumberland Fusiliers on the 8/8/18 eight days later 16/8/18 transferred to the Royal Fusiliers

served with the Royal Fusiliers from 17/8/18 till 21/9/18  (served in the theater of war for just over a month)

 

 

[Lahana]

Thanks Ray, I have a feeling there’s more to his war history than just a month in the theatre, especially near the end. Could he have been in a different Regiment/battalion and have another service number too?  Especially when he was born in 1896, he had had a few years where he could have enlisted; he often remarked “he was young and stupid” to enlist

 

interested in thoughts

[IPT]

The 1918 Absent Voters List would solve this.  It's held at Gateshead Library, which is currently closed due to Covid.

[Skipman]

If it's any use, 79466 W Pearson Royal Fusiliers (Newcastle) appears on a casualty list 29/10/1918

 

Mike

[RaySearching]

19 hours ago, corisande said:

If we start with what the OP believes is true, that is his dob in Oct 1896

 

The only James William Pearson born in that quarter in England, was registered in Gateshead

 

The then appears in , from FmP, the 1901 and 1911 censuses

 

 

 

The 1911 census is at 202 St Cuthberts Road which seems close to the 35 St Cuthberts Rd in FmP

 

And the transcription of Northumberland Fus records on FmP _ Click . Previous posters on the thread have mentioned this man below

 

First name(s)	James William
Last name	Pearson
Residence	Gateshead
Address	36 St.Cuthberts Rd
Enlistment year	1881-1920
Service number	78108
Rank	Private
Battalion	3rd(Res)
Transfer to/from	To Royal Fusiliers(9th Bn)(17/8/18)
Notes	R.Fusiliers No.GS/79466

 

My conclusion is that this is the likely man sought, although I have not analyzed the 1911 census to ascertain if another James William might have lived in 35 St Cuthberts Rd in 1911

 

 

Corisande above pretty well sums it up

 

Enlisted date not known

Placed in the 3rd Reserve training battalion

 

 

From the Long Long Trail

3rd (Reserve) Battalion
August 1914 : in Newcastle on Tyne. A training unit, it remained in UK throughout the war. Moved to East Boldon in August 1914, then to Sunderland.

 

Posted in 1918 to one of the New Army Battalions of Northumberland Fusiliers and embarked for France

Transferred to the Royal Fusiliers wounded in action and evacuated home , convalesced at Whinney House

 

That is the extent of his short known war service 

 

He did not serve abroad prior to 1918

 

His wounding and evacuation home confirmed by Mikes Post

 

49 minutes ago, Skipman said:

If it's any use, 79466 W Pearson Royal Fusiliers (Newcastle) appears on a casualty list 29/10/1918

 

Mike

 

 

Ray

[MaxD]

There is a number of men of similar ages, from Gateshead, called up to the Northumberland Fusiliers in mid April 1918, spending a short time with 3rd Reserve Battalion NF, all arriving in France on 8 August 1918 destined for 8 Battalion NF but then being sent, as was a quite normal process, to other regiments after just a few days.  I'd suggest 78108's dates were similar.

 

Returning from France in Sep 1918 before the war was over could well suggest being wounded, evacuation and subsequent convalescemce.

 

Max

Working in parallel to Skipman and Ray would seem to have arrived at the same outcome!

 

max

Edited 20 May , 2020 by MaxD

[MaxD]

September 1918 was a particularly horrendous month for 9th Royal Fusiliers - 110 casualties 18th, 270 21st, 30 on 24th.  Looks as if this was the period in which 78108 was wounded and evacuated (casualty lists were behind the actual events).

 

There would appear to have been a common factor with the men I looked at in that they were all miners, deemed to have enlisted earlier but sent back down't pit until needed in France.  This may answer the query - did he serve before?

 

Max

Edited 20 May , 2020 by MaxD

[Lahana]

Thanks for all this information; I find it so interesting and adding it to the timeline.
 

In 1911 at 14 years old he was a Message Boy for a Newsagency in Gateshead, his dad was in the printing business. During the 1930/40’s he worked as a Engineer in Armaments, with some time before 1935 picked to relocate down south to work in ammunition’s, think it was Royal Odinance Factory, Enfield, Middlesex. There’s been no connection to miners in the family so I don’t think he would have been doing that. I am very intrigued, as didn’t the Military Service Act of 27 January 1916 make every unmarried man 18-40 deemed to have enlisted? The Tyneside shipyards were deemed essential services during WW1, I wonder if he was doing something that was considered essential like that?

 

There’s the connection to some kind of military service in Ireland somewhere in there too. 

[Skipman]

3 hours ago, Skipman said:

If it's any use, 79466 W Pearson Royal Fusiliers (Newcastle) appears on a casualty list 29/10/1918

 

Mike

 

It's quite a large casualty list, 200 or more, might be worth checking some of them for service records etc to see any patterns? Click

 

Mike

[MaxD]

My suggestion was that his dates were likely to have been similar.

 

Have a look at:https://www.longlongtrail.co.uk/soldiers/a-soldiers-life-1914-1918/enlisting-into-the-army/ in particular the section headed the Military Service Act 1916.  Men of the right age bracket were indeed deemed to have enlisted but if they  were in an occupation "vitally important for war work" they went back to their essential job.  Note what it says about April 1918. The commonality with those with near numbers (who were not all miners) is also that they have a sequence of dates on their records similar to the one attached.

 

This is 78100 McKee of Gateshead miner born 1899

Deemed to have enlisted 2 4 16 - not recorded on this one but he is now on the reserve

Called up 17 4 18 to 3 NF

France for 8th NF 8 8 18

Compulsorily transferred (in his case) to Yorks and Lancs 13 8 18

 

So yes, while he may not have been a miner, he almost certainly had a record that looked very similar to this one.

 

Max

 

Edited 20 May , 2020 by MaxD

[Lahana]

Thanks so much for your help everyone. I will look in more detail on where the 9th Royal Fusiliers were fighting in September 1918 now. So many men all transferred together from NF, with such high casualties I wonder how many friends my grandad lost 😔

 

very much appreciated your help

[MaxD]

Diary can be downloaded free at the moment, you just have to register:

 

https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C7352684

 

CWGC commemorates 131 men of 9 NF who died between 1 Sep 1918 and 1 Oct 1918.  An awful lot of them appear to be transfers with similar numbers.

 

Max

[Lahana]

2 hours ago, MaxD said:

Diary can be downloaded free at the moment, you just have to register:

 

https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C7352684

 

CWGC commemorates 131 men of 9 NF who died between 1 Sep 1918 and 1 Oct 1918.  An awful lot of them appear to be transfers with similar numbers.

 

Max

Thanks Max

 

i registered with National Archives recently so will take a look, appreciate you finding it.

 

i have been reading about how soldiers re-enlisted after WW1 as they were paid good money to serve in Ireland etc. it’s possible to obtain a copy of their 1920-1923 service record and sometimes their WW1 file is attached. Will look into it

[MaxD]

Good luck

 

https://www.gov.uk/get-copy-military-service-records

 

Max

[Lahana]

Hi Again, thanks for all your help tracing my grandfather’s details. I’ve read the Battalions war record for the period, understand most of it and glad to know details but awful too. One day I’ll take our family to these parts of France.

 

I’ve found a few more family members in WW1 which is interesting but am stuck with a particular one and I’m hoping you can help... 

 

Service Number: 210980

Robert Barnfather 

Labour Corps
 

I know very little other than the following: my grandmother (Beatrice) uncle.  Robert Barnfather was born abt 1890, Gateshead, County Durham, mother Elizabeth Barnfather, address St Albans Tce, Gateshead. I find no trace of him in later life other than perhaps a death in 1921. I can see minimal details of the Pension Record Ledger on Ancestry for the above service number and am hoping you may have access to check the address to confirm.

 

much appreciated and thanks

[MaxD]

I don't have access to the pension cards unfortunately and there doesn't seem to be any other records for him, he may have served in UK only and hence no medal record.  I believe you can get a trial sub for the Fold3 area of Ancestry.

 

Max

[Skipman]

There seem to be three entries for him in the pension cards/ledgers Click

 

 

 

Mike

Edited 8 June , 2020 by Skipman

[MaxD]

That's useful Mike as one of them has Gateshead and 1890 dob with mother Elizabeth which would seem to add up given such a distinctive name.

 

Max

[Skipman]

. Can confirm your address is correct number 20. Died 15/1/1921. Best have a look yourself, you know what you're after. Don't want to fall foul of the rules re 'look-ups'

 

Mike

Edited 8 June , 2020 by Skipman

[Lahana]

Thanks for the confirmation. I’ve now downloaded the records; am I right in understanding his mother Elizabeth was initially refused entitlement in May 1921, but in March 1926 there is a stamp marked OK, and the 3rd document is a Dependants Pension Card - did she eventually begin receiving his pension from 1926?

 

My grandparents named one of their sons after Robert, we had no idea of the significant connection until discovering this

 

Thanks

[Skipman]

7 hours ago, Lahana said:

 am I right in understanding his mother Elizabeth was initially refused entitlement in May 1921, but in March 1926 there is a stamp marked OK, and the 3rd document is a Dependants Pension Card - did she eventually begin receiving his pension from 1926?

 

My grandparents named one of their sons after Robert, we had no idea of the significant connection until discovering this

 

Thanks

 

 

Not certain. It mght be worth posting a new thread on this in the Interpreting Documents part of the Forum, with that specific question.

 

Mike

Edited 9 June , 2020 by Skipman

[Lahana]

Thanks for the advice 😊