pierssc Posted 3 September , 2019 Posted 3 September , 2019 (edited) We visited Myanmar (formerly Burma) earlier this year, and I took this photo of a memorial in St Matthew's Church in what used to be called Moulmein and is now Mawlamyine. There are not many memorials of any kind left in the church; apparently it suffered a lot of damage in WW2. The names are: Lionel Henry Liptrap Carver Amos Lloyd Connor George E. Cuningham Percy Dawn Harold Dawn Arthur Dawn John Francis Xavier D'Mello Henry Vane Fanshaw Clement Foucar Louis Foucar C.E. Graham John Graves Osman Hannay Cyril R. Hughes Alexander Muir Otto Robert C. Mullerworth Guy Barclay Pollexfen George Edward Thomson Philip Thompson Philip Edward Utting Neville Ward A few of the men listed have appeared on previous threads on the GWF Carver https://www.greatwarforum.org/topic/174937-great-war-stained-glass-memorials-to-fallen/page/5/?tab=comments#comment-1706172 Cuningham https://www.greatwarforum.org/topic/242205-george-edmund-cuningham/?tab=comments#comment-2434339 Graves https://www.greatwarforum.org/topic/215464-capt-j-graves-suffolk-yeomanry/?tab=comments#comment-2141861 Thompson possibly https://www.greatwarforum.org/topic/71916-capt-philip-thompson-no-22-sqdn-royal-flying-corps/?tab=comments#comment-650393 I post it here in case it is of use to anyone. Piers Edited 3 September , 2019 by pierssc
rolt968 Posted 3 September , 2019 Posted 3 September , 2019 I wonder what the connection was. This seems to be Philip Edward Utting: https://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/1601686/utting,-philip-edward/ RM
pierssc Posted 3 September , 2019 Author Posted 3 September , 2019 And I suspect "Osman Hannay" is Osmond George Hannay https://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/333227/hannay,-osmond-george/
pierssc Posted 3 September , 2019 Author Posted 3 September , 2019 Mullerworth here: https://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/638032/mullerworth,-/
BereniceUK Posted 3 September , 2019 Posted 3 September , 2019 Thank you for posting this, Piers. Much appreciated.
Uncle George Posted 3 September , 2019 Posted 3 September , 2019 One can’t help but think of Kipling: By the old Moulmein Pagoda, lookin’ lazy at the sea, There’s a Burma girl a-settin, and I know she thinks o’ me; For the wind is in the palm trees, and the temple-bells they say: ‘Come you back, you British soldier; come you back to Mandalay!’ ...
pierssc Posted 4 September , 2019 Author Posted 4 September , 2019 4 hours ago, Uncle George said: One can’t help but think of Kipling: By the old Moulmein Pagoda, lookin’ lazy at the sea, There’s a Burma girl a-settin, and I know she thinks o’ me; For the wind is in the palm trees, and the temple-bells they say: ‘Come you back, you British soldier; come you back to Mandalay!’ ... Indeed.
rolt968 Posted 4 September , 2019 Posted 4 September , 2019 (edited) This is John Francis Xavier D'Mello, I think (Baptised 1889, St. Mary's Moulmein): https://www.findmypast.co.uk/transcript?id=BL%2FBIND%2FB%2F535508 RM Edit: I wonder if this is him? https://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/628123/d'mello,-/ Edited 4 September , 2019 by rolt968
pierssc Posted 4 September , 2019 Author Posted 4 September , 2019 (edited) I suspect it might be. There aren't many Mello/De Mello/D'Mello s on the CWGC website, and this one has a Burma link, and a Mayawady one at that. I suppose it is possible that somewhere along the clerking line "Xavier" was heard or recorded as "Savier", hence the "S". Myawady (now usually written Myawaddy) is a town on the Thai/Burma border more or less due east of Moulmein - assuming there have been no changes to national borders. Rather at the back of beyond in terms of early twentieth-century Burma. Nowadays Myawaddy is a significant crossing point between the two countries (we crossed from Thailand there), but only 15 or so years ago peering across from the Thai side I remember it looking very small and sleepy. I don't think that Mawlamyine and Myawaddy have been connected directly until very recently, but my guess is that 100 years ago (and probably even today) the river could have been used for the part of the the journey, in which case Moulmein WAS probably the nearest significant British settlement to Myawady. This is a rather longwinded way of saying that they're both in roughly the same part of the country so I think a connection is plausible. Edited 4 September , 2019 by pierssc
rolt968 Posted 4 September , 2019 Posted 4 September , 2019 8 minutes ago, pierssc said: I suspect it might be. There aren't many Mello/De Mello/D'Mello s on the CWGC website, and this one has a Burma link, and a Mayawady one at that. I suppose it is possible that somewhere along the clerking line "Xavier" was heard or recorded as "Savier", hence the "S". Myawady (now usually written Myawaddy) is a town on the Thai/Burma border more or less due east of Moulmein - assuming there have been no changes to national borders. Rather at the back of beyond in terms of early twentieth-century Burma. Nowadays Myawaddy is a significant crossing point between the two countries (we crossed from Thailand there), but only 15 or so years ago peering across from the Thai side I remember it looking very small and sleepy. I don't think that Mawlamyine and Myawaddy have been connected directly until very recently, but my guess is that 100 years ago (and probably even today) the river could have been used for the part of the the journey, in which case Moulmein WAS probably the nearest significant British settlement to Myawady. This is a rather longwinded way of saying that they're both in roughly the same part of the country so I think a connection is plausible. Thanks for the information about Myawaddy. I really don't know the geography of that part of the world at all. Did you notice that his mother had married again and was Mrs R Thompson (and there are Thompsons on the memorial?) RM
pierssc Posted 4 September , 2019 Author Posted 4 September , 2019 Thompson and Thomson..... you're right, it hadn't struck me. But if the RFC Philip Thompson is the right guy his parents are listed differently.
rolt968 Posted 4 September , 2019 Posted 4 September , 2019 This is Clement Foucar: https://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/1612872/foucar,-clement-auguste/ There is an entry in de Ruvigny
rolt968 Posted 4 September , 2019 Posted 4 September , 2019 I think Louis Foucar must be James Louis Foucar https://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/1612873/foucar,-james-louis/
pierssc Posted 4 September , 2019 Author Posted 4 September , 2019 There can't be many with such a close name, but I wonder what the Burmese connection was? He may have grown up there of course. Short biog here: https://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/205294984
rolt968 Posted 5 September , 2019 Posted 5 September , 2019 I haven't checked how the two Foucars are related, however the entry in de Ruvigny for Clement Foucar provides useful information: "4th son of the late Ferdinand Louis Foucar, of Rangoon and Moulmein, Burma, Teak Merchant [of a Huguenot family who came from Proisy in Picardy after the Revocation of the Treaty of Nantes, 1685]" RM
pierssc Posted 5 September , 2019 Author Posted 5 September , 2019 (edited) I think that's Clement accounted for then, and James Louis looks like the right guy. If you Google him you find he was a technical chemist and quite a scientist. A posthumously published paper of which he is co-author has him as "Major J. Louis Foucar" which indicates (to my mind at least) that he was known as Louis, as was the man on the memorial. His parents are different to Clement's but both fathers appear to have been born in Germany. James Louis' father was Alexander Louis who was born in Friedrichsdorf, near Frankfurt who became a naturalised British Citizen in 1889 and J.L was born in Brockley (South London) according to the 1911 census. According to Wikipedia Friedrichsdorf was founded by Hugenots - French Protestants - in 1687, which helps to explain why there are Foucars on a memorial in a C of E church. The trouble is that - apart from being a Foucar and probably related (I really don't want to get too far into this) - there doesn't seem to be a Burma connection for James Louis. On the other hand Clement had a brother Louis F[erdinand]. There seems to be someone on Ancestry researching them - it may be simplest for me to drop her a line! I'm really not researching any of these people as such (I put the photo up and listed the names so that if anyone did a Google search for any of them, they'd hopefully show up) and I'm trying to resist the temptation to dig very much deeper, but it is interesting to discover a bit about them isn't it? There's an 1895 Moulmein directory online at https://abldirectories.weebly.com/1895-moulmein.html which may catch some of the parents of the people listed (they may of course be unrelated). Names include W.A.W. Dawn is an assistant at T.D. Findlay, Bodeker & Co. , Rice and Timber Merchants T. D'Mello, residing Mayangoon St F.L. and E.J. Foucar, of Foucar & Co, Merchants, Commission Agents and Mill owners (FL - presumably Ferdinand Louis - Clement's dad - was also the German Consul) both residing in Mission Road. J.O. Hughes, Advocate 1st Grade, also proprietor of the "Moulmein Advertiser" G. Muir, Engineer and Mill Superintendant, Bombay-Burmah Trading Corporation Ltd L.S. Thomson, Burmese interpreter, Judge's Office (who may or may not also be L.S. Thompson, Treasury Accountant, Deputy Commissioner's office) E. Thompson, Preventative Office, Customs dept, residence not listed, also an L Thompson and N Thompson residing in Mayangoon (an interestingly mixed area with a number of residents with French, Portuguese (?) and Burmese names The 1905 directory https://abldirectories.weebly.com/1905-moulmein.html introduces a J. Connor, Public Works Department, Amhurst Division, Supervisor at Tavoy; R.B. Muir and a G Muir (possibly not the G Muir of 1895) are both assistants at Bombay-Burmah Mrs M Mullerwurth (sic) is an assistant teacher at ABM Burma Boys School an E.L. Thompson is a 2nd Clerk in the Customs dept (E. Thompson is still a Preventative Officer) There's a W. Thomson and an E. Thomson living at apparently different addresses in Penang St Dawn is still in post at T.D. Findlays, F.L. Foucar has vanished and E.J. Foucar is now Manager of Foucar's and German Consul (residing Salween Park) D'Mello and Hughes have disappeared The 1915 Moulmein directory https://abldirectories.weebly.com/1915-moulmein.html G.E. Cunningham (sic) - of the memorial? - is an assistant at TD Findlay & Son Ltd. Mr Dawn is now the Manager. E.J. Foucar is director of the family firm, but is now an Honourary Magistrate. C.E. Graham Lieutenant, Border Regiment, is Adjutant of the Moulmein Volunteer rifles. Probably Cecil Erskine Graham whose CWGC entry is https://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/931473/graham,-cecil-erskine/ W. Muir is a Forest assistant at TD Findlays There is no Mrs Mullerworth (or Mullerwurth) All the Thomsons and Thompsons have gone. J.H. Utting is a licenced pilot in the Marine dept. By 1920 most of the names have vanished. https://abldirectories.weebly.com/1920-moulmein.html W.A.W. Dawn and E.J. Foucar are still there. A Miss L.B. Hughes is an ABM Missionary and is probably also the Miss Lizbeth B Hughes who is a Superintenant of the A.B.M Morton Lane Burmese Girls High & Normal Schools. An F.P. Thomson is an Extra Assistant Conservator in the Forestry Dept. That's it. Edited 5 September , 2019 by pierssc various types and got Graham and Graves muddled
Eastindia Posted 6 October , 2020 Posted 6 October , 2020 Rather belatedly I have discovered these very helpful replies for which many thanks. Much appreciated
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