1098 William John Crawford Royal Irish Rifles

[Eric365]

I am trying to find out about William John Crawford. Service number 1098 served with the Royal Irish Rifles and was KIA on day 1st July 1916 at the Somme.

 

He was born in Ballyclare but later moved to Scotland.

 

left only his sister Mary Anna Milroy when he died.

 

any knowledge would be amazing thanks

[Dave66]

Hello Eric and welcome,

There is a register of soldiers effects here on ancestry, but service number 8/1089...Pte, serving with the 9th R.I.R...could this be him?.....https://www.ancestry.co.uk/interactive/60506/42511_6117463_0083-00080?pid=640924&backurl=https://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?_phsrc%3DhZX21%26_phstart%3DsuccessSource%26usePUBJs%3Dtrue%26indiv%3D1%26dbid%3D60506%26gsfn%3DWilliam%20John%26gsln%3DCrawford%26gsfn_x%3DNP%26gsln_x%3D1%26cp%3D11%26qh%3DggQHKnDQSRTPz4cQjkMKkg%3D%3D%26new%3D1%26rank%3D1%26uidh%3Dl37%26redir%3Dfalse%26gss%3Dangs-d%26pcat%3D39%26fh%3D0%26h%3D640924%26recoff%3D%26ml_rpos%3D1&treeid=&personid=&hintid=&usePUB=true&_phsrc=hZX21&_phstart=successSource&usePUBJs=true

Extract below from above record, showing more than one sister.

 

Dave.

 

 

Edited 29 July , 2019 by Dave66

[Eric365]

That’s amazing, never even knew there was three of them

[corisande]

Eric

 

I think you need to give us more of what you do know, otherwise forum members are a bit in the dark

 

For example an Ancestry tree - click - gives him born 1 Sep 1869. Is that him, he seems a bit old !

[MaxD]

CWGC has him as age 25 and gives Mary Anna as his sister.  No service record apparent.  Went to France 28 Nov 1915.  War gratuity (thanks Craig) suggests enlisted Oct 1914.

 

Your heading has CSgt which would mean Colour Sergeant - records have him as a Rifleman. War diary on Ancestry at:

https://www.ancestry.co.uk/interactive/60779/43112_2503_1-00000?backurl=&ssrc=&backlabel=Return if you have a sub.  At National Archives for £3.50:

https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C7354023

 

 

Max

Edited 29 July , 2019 by MaxD
diaries

[ss002d6252]

I've tweaked the title so that there's more chance that interested parties will see it.

Craig

[Eric365]

I really do know nothing about him other than what I have posed, it was a relative that had mentioned it a couple of days ago and as an ex soldier myself wanted to do some digging and here I am

 

[MaxD]

War diary well worth reading, has a set of remarks analysing the 1/2 July 1916 action.

 

Max

[Eric365]

37 minutes ago, corisande said:

Eric

 

I think you need to give us more of what you do know, otherwise forum members are a bit in the dark

 

For example an Ancestry tree - click - gives him born 1 Sep 1869. Is that him, he seems a bit old !

war records show that he died aged 25, if the year of birth was 89 I'd have believed it but unfortunately that would make him 20 years older than he was.  The rest seems to be correct

[corisande]

The one thing you do know from Soldiers Effects is that his sister was Mary Anne Milroy (and that he had two other sisters, Maggie, and Jeanie)

 

ScotlandsPeople gives he marriage to John Milroy in Ayr in 1902. And from 1911 census you can work out her year of birth as 1875. You need to get her marriage cert off ScotlandsPeople to establish her father's name

 

You then go to the Irish GRO, which is free online, and try to get her birth. From that you get her mother's Christian and Maiden name.

 

You then search the Irish GRO for the right birth of William John Crawford, to prove his age.

 

I rather fear that unless you establish exactly who he was, then the rest is surmise

[RaySearching]

The claimant of a dependents pension 

for Pte 8/1089 is listed as Jeanie Crawford (sister)

of 5 Memel Street Bridge End Belfast

 

 

Ray

[MaxD]

11 hours ago, RaySearching said:

 

The claimant of a dependents pension 

for Pte 8/1089 is listed as Jeanie Crawford (sister)

of 5 Memel Street Bridge End Belfast

 

One of the sisters named on the  Effects register is Jeannie.

 

Soldiers Died in the Great War records his birth place as Ballyclare and his residence as Troon.

 

Thus all the extant records have elements which add up to the description given in the first post.

 

Max

[corisande]

42 minutes ago, MaxD said:

he claimant of a dependents pension 

for Pte 8/1089 is listed as Jeanie Crawford (sister)

of 5 Memel Street Bridge End Belfast

 

She is not living in Memel Street in 1911 census - no Crawfords are living there in 1911 nor 1901

[MaxD]

Must give the credit for the dependant's pension post to Raysearching not me!

 

Max

[RaySearching]

22 hours ago, Eric365 said:

He was born in Ballyclare but later moved to Scotland.

 

Just a small query

How do you know that William later moved to Scotland ?

 

Ray

 

[RaySearching]

Have you recently purchased his medals ?

I noticed they were recently sold on flea bay

 

 

Ray

[corisande]

1 hour ago, RaySearching said:

Just a small query

How do you know that William later moved to Scotland ?

 

I guess you have answered your own query

[Eric365]

No not at all, I’ll need to ask questions about that sale

[RaySearching]

36 minutes ago, corisande said:

 

I guess you have answered your own query

 

Err no according to SDGW  William enlisted in Belfast

not in Troon Ayr Scotland as stated on the sale of the medals

 

His residence is shown as Troon Ayr on soldiers died in the great war

 

William may not have set foot in Scotland,  as you  know the place of residence on SDGW is not always the place that the soldiers resided 

but more often than not the last known address of his next of kin 

Hence the question?

 

Ray

[Eric365]

The Milroy’s moved to Troon, there is no record of William ever stepping foot in Scotland.

 

the Milroy’s still live in Troon and the great great grand daughter is my partner.

 

her dad has the plaque and scrolls but no one knew where the medals were until now

[RaySearching]

As William is shown as enlisted in 1914 in Belfast by  Max's calculation  (thanks to Craigs Calculator)

 

 I think you you need to establish where the family members were all residing in 1911

who emigrated to Scotland and who did not

 

Ray

 

 

 

 

 

[Eric365]

As far as I know only Mary went to Scotland.

 

the rest of the crawfords are unknown

Do you have a link to the Ebay page for the medals to find the seller/ buyer?

[RaySearching]

 

3 minutes ago, Eric365 said:

As far as I know only Mary went to Scotland

 

Which confirms my suspicions that William may never have set foot in Scotland

His next of kin Mary  the recipient  of his medals death plaque and scroll handed down through the family

the medals may have been held by another descendant of Mary

 

Quote

Do you have a link to the Ebay page for the medals to find the seller/ buyer?

Google is your friend  Google   8/1089 William John Crawford,   will result in several hits

 

Ray

 

[corisande]

22 minutes ago, RaySearching said:

I think you you need to establish where the family members were all residing in 1911

who emigrated to Scotland and who did not 

 

AS I put in my post #10 above, which the OP appears not to have noticed, , the OP has to do some hard grunt to establish this. It can be done from a circuitous route via that marriage certificate.

 

The 1911 and 1901 censuses for Ireland exist, but Crawford is a common name and it is just a fishing expedition until his parents have been established

[Eric365]

Apparently the medals were bought years ago from an auction in Glasgow.

 

the guy wasn’t very forthcoming with information so they could well have been stolen.

 

my mistake my partner is the great great granddaughter of Mary not william.

 

he never had kids