ddycher Posted 7 July , 2019 Share Posted 7 July , 2019 All Trying to make sense of the ref's below in the pension record of one of the pre-war Sgt.Inst I am researching. His service ref's in the pension record does not cover the time he spent on the PS of TF Coys. It shows him discharged in 1901 then re-attesting in September 1914. But I know I have the right man and unless there was an interim service that has been lost in his pension file His original service ran 1884 ~ 1901 ie the 17 years ref'd above. His war-time service ran Sept'14 ~ May 1918 and is called out in his discharge as 3 years 255 days. So I am trying to piece together the 9 years 178 days. It is possible that he served 1908 ~ 1914 in Permanent Staff of the 7th and 5th Devons but don't have the service record to confirm. Can anyone tell me what articles 1135 and 1136 are ? Also still strying to get my head around various types of "service" if anyone could point me in the right direction. Would appreciate any guidance... Regards Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 7 July , 2019 Share Posted 7 July , 2019 I think article 1135 was something about counting time towards pensionable service. I'll see if I can see anything else on that. What was his name? Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddycher Posted 7 July , 2019 Author Share Posted 7 July , 2019 Thanks Craig He was Col.Sgt Samuel Heath (1064 then 7642) Devonshire Regiment. regards Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 7 July , 2019 Share Posted 7 July , 2019 Just looked around and both 1135 and 1136 seem to have covered qualifying service for pension purposes. A Jan 16 Army Order clarified that https://search.findmypast.co.uk/bna/viewarticle?id=bl%2f0000587%2f19160126%2f155&stringtohighlight=article 1135 EDIT: I read his record as meaning that only 9 of the 17 years will be regarded as pensionable qualifying service from his periods with the Devons. 'Pensionable Service' and 'Pay Warrant Service' could differ. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Clifton Posted 7 July , 2019 Share Posted 7 July , 2019 (edited) Hello Dave Here are the relevant paragraphs of the Pay Warrant: "Service" 1135. The following periods shall be reckoned as "service" for the purpose of establishing the date at which a non-commissioned officer or man (except a non-commissioned officer of Our Royal Marines transferred for service in Our Army) shall be assessed for pension under this Our Warrant:- (a) Time allowed to reckon towards discharge from the date of last attestation. (b) In the case of re-enlisted soldiers, time allowed to reckon under a previous attestation towards discharge, except in cases in which the previous service does not reckon as qualifying service under Article 1137(h). (c) In the case of men discharged from Our Royal Navy or Our Royal Marines who enlist in Our Regular Army, the period of their Navy or Marine service which reckoned towards discharge, provided that the total period of such service did not exceed four years, or, if they enlisted in Our Army between the 1st October, 1880, and the 1st September, 1898, that not more than four years of such service shall reckon. "Qualifying service" 1136. The following periods shall be reckoned as "qualifying service" for the purpose of fixing the rate of pension to which a non-commissioned officer or man (except a non-commissioned officer of Our Royal Marines transferred for service in Our Army) is entitled:- (a) Time served with the colours from the date of last attestation for Army service. (b) Qualifying service under a previous attestation, subject to (h) of Article 1137, or embodied service with Our Militia or Imperial Yeomanry, or mobilized service in Our Special Reserve or Territorial Force, provided that he acknowledged his former service on enlistment. (c) In the case of a man enlisted in Our Army after having been discharged from Our Royal Navy or Our Royal Marines, the period of service in the Navy or the Marines which would have reckoned towards pension had he continued to serve therein, provided (1) that the total period of such service did not exceed four years, or, if he enlisted in Our Army between the 1st October, 1880, and the 1st September, 1898, that not more than four years of such service shall reckon towards pension, and (2) that he acknowledged his former service on enlistment in Our Army. (d) In the case of native soldiers of Our Indian Army enlisted in the Hong Kong-Singapore battalion of Our Royal Artillery, such of their former service in Our Indian Army as would have been allowed to reckon towards pension if they had continued, or had re-enlisted, in such service, and also, in the case of men re-enlisted into the Hong Kong-Singapore battalion of Our Royal Artillery, any qualifying service rendered under their previous attestation, provided such former service was acknowledged on re-enlistment. (e) Time served in Our 1st Class Army Reserve before joining the colours from Section A or B of the Reserve, on being called out for permanent duty, or on rejoining at a time when any portion of Section B of the Reserve has been called out for duty, or on being specially invited to re-enter upon army duty. (f) Time served in Our 1st Class Army Reserve, if the soldier has been invalided through army duty, after rejoining the colours from Section D of the Reserve at a time when any portion of Section B has been called out for duty. (Section 1137 covers cases where part of a man's service has been forfeited for disciplinary reasons: subsection (h) refers to those men discharged with less than three months' service.) Ron Edited 7 July , 2019 by Ron Clifton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ss002d6252 Posted 7 July , 2019 Share Posted 7 July , 2019 He did 7 years 192 days with his original colour service but that didn't include his recall for the Boer War - that was another 21 months or so, which gives 9 and a half years service (roughly). The remainder of the 17 years was on reserve service which didn't qualify for pension purposes. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddycher Posted 7 July , 2019 Author Share Posted 7 July , 2019 Both Many thanks. Going to run through this carefully and I'll get back to you. Regards Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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