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The Great War (1914-1918) Forum

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Training trenches experts required.


pompeyrodney

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Hi people

I am involved in a archaeological dig at the site of an army camp at Penally in South Wales. The Dyfed Archaeological Trust are carrying out the excavations with the help of volunteers such as myself. We are turning up some finds which are mainly cartridge cases and a few bullets. The construction of the trench I am in seems to use 6 inch corrugated sheets, with some wooden posts inserted at the corners. So far the archaeological team are unsure what we are looking at and if there are any trench experts on here I would much appreciate any help you can offer me. I will post some photos that show what we are looking at presently. If anyone can offer any information on the training during WW1 at Penally that would be really helpful. Many thanks.

IMG_20190612_160956.jpg

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Hi pompeyrodney,

The Clwyd-Powys Archaeological Trust have researched and dug practice trenches at Bodelwyddan (as part of the Kinmel Park Camp complex, Abergele).  Their report on the dig is available as document CPAT 1303 (Archaeological Excavations 2014).  Perhaps this might help?   

 

Clive

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Not claiming to be an expert. Do you mean the corrugated sheets are 6" wide which would make the feature on left 6" deep? To me the same feature is not down to natural yet, bit dirty at camera end. Bits of barbed wire in right hand section? A wire stake further back? Any details for cartridges & bullets and do they come from the feature or the trench as a whole? Dates & calibre?

Better wheelbarrow needed?

TEW

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  • 1 year later...

Thank you Clive and TEW, I shall do my best to provide information. I would say 6ft deep would not be correct as I was standing in the bottom and there was quite a bit of me visible and I am 6ft tall. More like 4 ft 6 deep i should say. We did find some barbed wire but not half as much as I expected. Regarding the cartridge cases, they varied in calibre from huge to presumably 0.303 Lee Enfield ammunition. I cannot find the photos that I took at the time but one bullet I found was even larger than the current 50 calibre ammunition, I took this to be 0.577 which I believe was a service rifle calibre of around the time when Penally was first used an army camp, in 1860. This was following the Crimean war when a requirement for musketry training was identified. Dyfed Archaeology were the lead on this dig and I believe there is now a report in circulation regarding what was found.

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Where in relation to the WW1 Training Trenches indicated are you digging, It looks standard British Wriggly Tin revetment and could be WW1 WW2 or later.  

Penally Training Trenches.jpg

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5 hours ago, pompeyrodney said:

Thank you Clive and TEW, I shall do my best to provide information. I would say 6ft deep would not be correct as I was standing in the bottom and there was quite a bit of me visible and I am 6ft tall. More like 4 ft 6 deep i should say. We did find some barbed wire but not half as much as I expected. Regarding the cartridge cases, they varied in calibre from huge to presumably 0.303 Lee Enfield ammunition. I cannot find the photos that I took at the time but one bullet I found was even larger than the current 50 calibre ammunition, I took this to be 0.577 which I believe was a service rifle calibre of around the time when Penally was first used an army camp, in 1860. This was following the Crimean war when a requirement for musketry training was identified. Dyfed Archaeology were the lead on this dig and I believe there is now a report in circulation regarding what was found.

I have found large calibre  bullet heads which could have been Martini -Henry at a camp site where the 5th,7th and some 8th Battalions Manchester regiment were encamped in late 1914 just prior to embarking for Gallipoli via Egypt. I found them whilst metal detecting . All I can assume is they still had some of the older weaponry about for training such as these men, who were actually Territorial Army?

Edited by tom bowler
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  • 1 month later...

Hello!  Here is a link to another report by Wessex Archaeology on excavations of practice trenches on Perham Down, Salisbury Plain which was done in conjunction with Operation Nightingale and Breaking Ground Heritage:

 

https://breakinggroundheritage.org.uk/onewebmedia/Perham Down Evaluation Report v1.pdf

 

From what i recall the wriggly tin we found was used more for shelters rather than trench revetting.  Reason for this was probably that the trenches were dug into the chalk.

 

May or may not be of help but best of luck with the dig!

Carlos

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