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Remembered Today:

176438 Herbert Harry Bucknall


Pirate

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Hi I'm interested in finding information on my great grandfather in ww1. 

His service number was 176438

A Gunner in the 493 siege battery royal garrison artillery. 

Any help would be great.  Thank you 

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The National Archives have his medal card:

 

https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/D1572281

 

which shows he went overseas after the end of 1915.  The associated medal roll for the RGA does not add anything.  His service record looks as if it was lost in WW2 to bombing (as 60% of them were).

 

493 Siege Battery went to France on 28 January 1918 armed with two 12 inch Howitzers on road mountings. https://www.militaryfactory.com/armor/detail.asp?armor_id=888

 

There is a war diary that covers Feb 1918.  https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/da2ebe105b434fa3af6b70055f4e1c81 download for £3.50.

They were army troops and other diaries are proving elusive, need more time to look.

 

Max

 

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21 minutes ago, MaxD said:

The National Archives have his medal card:

 

https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/D1572281

 

which shows he went overseas after the end of 1915.  The associated medal roll for the RGA does not add anything.  His service record looks as if it was lost in WW2 to bombing (as 60% of them were).

 

493 Siege Battery went to France on 28 January 1918 armed with two 12 inch Howitzers on road mountings. https://www.militaryfactory.com/armor/detail.asp?armor_id=888

 

There is a war diary that covers Feb 1918.  https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/da2ebe105b434fa3af6b70055f4e1c81 download for £3.50.

They were army troops and other diaries are proving elusive, need more time to look.

 

Max

 

Thank you very much for your reply.  Lots to look at. 

I didn't know he was over seas  in 1915. Where did you get  that information from. 

Kind regards Dave 

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No I said he didn't go overseas until after 1915.  He has the British War and Victory medals, had he been overseas in a war theatre before end 1915 he would have qualified for one or other of the 1914 Star or 1914/1815 Star.

 

Max

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Sorry  Max my mistake.  I have  his 2 medals  plus 1 of his dog tags  shoulder and cap badge.  

He thankfully came back.

I just wounder  where he was at the end of the war. 

Big  thanks 

Dave

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The diary for 26 Brigade RGA covers up to May 1918, the battery was with them from Feb 1918 to ,May 1918  https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/057fbe63cde941698172650030cf2fe8

 

The battery was still with 26 Brigade after May but I haven't time to follow further at the moment.  Hope to get back to it tomorrow.

 

Max

 

 

Edited by MaxD
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1 hour ago, MaxD said:

The diary for 26 Brigade RGA covers up to May 1918, the battery was with them from Feb 1918 to ,May 1918  https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/057fbe63cde941698172650030cf2fe8

 

The battery was still with 26 Brigade after May but I haven't time to follow further at the moment.  Hope to get back to it tomorrow.

 

Max

 

 

I've managed to get some info the 493 was attached to the Australian imperial force.  In  August 1918.  Now I'm stuck again.Screenshot_20190605-214638.png.c1bce7addac60a740e5f4032ffc0b7f4.png

20190605_220533.png

20190605_220844.jpg

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59 minutes ago, MaxD said:

That's a useful spot -  I'll check out August in the 26 Bde diary to see if the attachment was from there.  Meanwhile check out the Aus Corps Heavy Artillery Commander at

 

https://www.awm.gov.au/collection/C1339031

Back later

 

Max

Chears Max. 

I will have a look but . WOW just found  this out. 493 transferred  to the Canadian corps  on the 5th August 18. 

The plot deepens....

20190606_102311.png

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Just an observation - much of the time the change to another higher formation didn't necessarily involve a physical move, simply a change of communication system.

 

Next move. The August 1918 Canadian Corps Heavy Artillery diary starts here:

http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/lac-bac/results/images?module=images&SortSpec=score+desc&Language=eng&ShowForm=hide&SearchIn_1=mikanNumber&SearchInText_1=2004789&Operator_1=AND&SearchIn_2=&SearchInText_2=&Operator_2=AND&SearchIn_3=&SearchInText_3=&Level=&MaterialDateOperator=after&MaterialDate=&DigitalImages=1&Source=&ResultCount=10

 

Slightly unhelpful in that it refers to RGA brigades and there is a considerable amount of further movement/re-allocation of RGA units including attachments to the French and back to the British Corps.

More work needed.

 

Max

 

See next post!

 

Edited by MaxD
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Better diary is GOC RA Canadian Corps as all artillery allocated to the Canadians from beginning of August was under the command of GOC RA.

Here is 493 Battery arriving on 5 August:

 

http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/lac-bac/results/images?module=images&SortSpec=score+desc&Language=eng&ShowForm=hide&SearchIn_1=mikanNumber&SearchInText_1=2004734&Operator_1=AND&SearchIn_2=&SearchInText_2=&Operator_2=AND&SearchIn_3=&SearchInText_3=&Level=&MaterialDateOperator=after&MaterialDate=&DigitalImages=1&Source=&ResultCount=10

 

You might like to follow this through until they leave the Canadian Corps!

 

This was the beginning (on 8 August) of what became known as the Black Day of the German Army and in particular the Canadian Corps part of that.

 

Max

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Hi Dave,

 

On a different tack, it looks like Herbert was called up/mobilised in late August 1917. Surviving service papers for RGA men with near numbers show them as being called up and initially posted to No. 4 Depot in Ripon.

 

176430 MacLean - 28.8.1917

176435 Jones* - 27.8.1917

176438

176439 Moor - 27.8.1917

176449 Stockdale - 28.8.1917

*This man was subsequently posted to 493 Siege Battery on 13.9.1917, before being posted to another unit on 29.10.1917

 

Regards

Chris

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More. Just back tracking to post #6.   493 SB remained firing under the tactical control of 26 Brigade until 1 August when it is reported "leaving the Army area".  This marries up with what you have so far (briefly under the Aus Corps and then the Cdn Corps).

https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/7bb4a06bd78d4a4881bc9edd245946cb

 

Trail lost at the point at which they are with the Canadian Corps!

 

Max

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7 minutes ago, MaxD said:

More. Just back tracking to post #6.   493 SB remained firing under the tactical control of 26 Brigade until 1 August when it is reported "leaving the Army area".  This marries up with what you have so far (briefly under the Aus Corps and then the Cdn Corps).

https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/7bb4a06bd78d4a4881bc9edd245946cb

 

Trail lost at the point at which they are with the Canadian Corps!

 

Max

Cheers Max. That's great. 

Haven't found any more in the Canadian army reports but still looking. With help we can do it.

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2 hours ago, clk said:

Hi Dave,

 

On a different tack, it looks like Herbert was called up/mobilised in late August 1917. Surviving service papers for RGA men with near numbers show them as being called up and initially posted to No. 4 Depot in Ripon.

 

176430 MacLean - 28.8.1917

176435 Jones* - 27.8.1917

176438

176439 Moor - 27.8.1917

176449 Stockdale - 28.8.1917

*This man was subsequently posted to 493 Siege Battery on 13.9.1917, before being posted to another unit on 29.10.1917

 

Regards

Chris

Thanks Chris. That's something I never thought about. Very interesting. 

 

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On 06/06/2019 at 15:18, Pirate said:
On 06/06/2019 at 11:48, MaxD said:

Better diary is GOC RA Canadian Corps as all artillery allocated to the Canadians from beginning of August was under the command of GOC RA.

Here is 493 Battery arriving on 5 August:

 

http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/lac-bac/results/images?module=images&SortSpec=score+desc&Language=eng&ShowForm=hide&SearchIn_1=mikanNumber&SearchInText_1=2004734&Operator_1=AND&SearchIn_2=&SearchInText_2=&Operator_2=AND&SearchIn_3=&SearchInText_3=&Level=&MaterialDateOperator=after&MaterialDate=&DigitalImages=1&Source=&ResultCount=10

 

You might like to follow this through until they leave the Canadian Corps!

 

This was the beginning (on 8 August) of what became known as the Black Day of the German Army and in particular the Canadian Corps part of that.

 

Max

Thank you very much for your help. 

It was very much appreciate.  Just a shame the trail has gone cold 

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