Rick Back Posted 29 May , 2019 Share Posted 29 May , 2019 Hi, spent the day at the National Archives yesterday trying to find out about my great uncle - George Henry Back- killed in the morning on the first day of the Somme with the 12th Batallion The Rangers. It looks like his family sent back his medals. Are these stored? Would I be able to ask for them? Also is there a record of where his 'death penny' would have been sent? At present our family have no artefacts associated with George to help honour his memory. rick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wandererpaul Posted 29 May , 2019 Share Posted 29 May , 2019 His MIC does say returned. Shown here His medal roll mentions the date 1923. More knowledgable people will say if you can request them from the MoD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin DavidOwen Posted 29 May , 2019 Admin Share Posted 29 May , 2019 Here's the form https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/749392/MODMO_0001.pdf Actual nearest next of kin living must apply and sign the form Good luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Kilkenny Posted 29 May , 2019 Share Posted 29 May , 2019 (edited) It all seems a bit vague. The form above states that medals awarded prior to World War Two can no longer be issued and there's no indication anywhere that this stipulation does not apply to medals that were issued but subsequently returned. I called the MoD Medal Office a few months back to ask about claiming a great-uncle's medals that had been similarly returned and the work experience type who took my call (I'm being charitable - he surely can't have been a permanent employee) immediately transferred me to the National Archives. They, of course, politely explained that claiming medals was absolutely nothing to do with them, but I knew that, even if the Medal Office apparently doesn't. Edited 29 May , 2019 by Tom Kilkenny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin DavidOwen Posted 29 May , 2019 Admin Share Posted 29 May , 2019 Just now, Tom Kilkenny said: It all seems a bit vague. The form above states that medals awarded prior to World War Two can no longer be issued and there's no indication anywhere that does not apply to medals that were issued but then returned. I called the MoD Medal Office a few months back to ask about claiming a great-uncle's medals that had been similarly returned and the work experience type who took my call (I'm being charitable - he surely can't have been a permanent employee) immediately transferred me to the National Archives. They, of course, politely explained that claiming medals was absolutely nothing to do with them, but I knew that, even if the Medal Office apparently doesn't. Tom Fill the form in for the WW1 medals and send it in. Others have had success doing so. Good luck David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tullybrone Posted 29 May , 2019 Share Posted 29 May , 2019 Hi, Here is the topic re the issue of “returned medals”. I’ve had a quick look at the MIC link above and my reading of the endorsement is that the medals were returned “for adjustment” - amend an error - so they would have been sent back out to the recipient - rather than there being an inability to get them to the rightful recipient in the first place. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wandererpaul Posted 29 May , 2019 Share Posted 29 May , 2019 21 minutes ago, tullybrone said: Hi, Here is the topic re the issue of “returned medals”. I’ve had a quick look at the MIC link above and my reading of the endorsement is that the medals were returned “for adjustment” - amend an error - so they would have been sent back out to the recipient - rather than there being an inability to get them to the rightful recipient in the first place. Steve Ah yes. Kings Regulation 1743 refers to that. But! See a message in this link...... https://www.ancestry.co.uk/boards/topics.Military.uk.britarmy/2031.1.1.2.1.1.1/mb.ashx The notation “Retd (1743 K.R. 1912) 8029/Adt” refers to Kings Regulations (1912) Para 1743 and its amendment, indicating that the medals were returned to the issuing office because of a problem with their delivery rather than them being returned due to an inscription error. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rksimpson Posted 29 May , 2019 Share Posted 29 May , 2019 HI I disagree with adt meaning adjustment, as noted above there was a problem with delivering them. I had the same issue with my Grandfather's medals. I applied to MOD as above with all the paperwork from MIC and rolls and they issued and sent me his medals. You can only try. regards Robert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tullybrone Posted 29 May , 2019 Share Posted 29 May , 2019 59 minutes ago, wandererpaul said: Ah yes. Kings Regulation 1743 refers to that. But! See a message in this link...... https://www.ancestry.co.uk/boards/topics.Military.uk.britarmy/2031.1.1.2.1.1.1/mb.ashx The notation “Retd (1743 K.R. 1912) 8029/Adt” refers to Kings Regulations (1912) Para 1743 and its amendment, indicating that the medals were returned to the issuing office because of a problem with their delivery rather than them being returned due to an inscription error. 55 minutes ago, rksimpson said: HI I disagree with adt meaning adjustment, as noted above there was a problem with delivering them. I had the same issue with my Grandfather's medals. I applied to MOD as above with all the paperwork from MIC and rolls and they issued and sent me his medals. You can only try. regards Robert Hi, Thanks to you both for the clarification/correction. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TEW Posted 29 May , 2019 Share Posted 29 May , 2019 The adt thing comes up time and time again. Audit is another possibility ie (file/list?) 7956 had to be audited to show the medal had returned to the medal office. Or that 7956 had to be adjusted or have an amendment. Just to confuse things, medals that were returned for a name/number correction may also use the adt thing but normally the correction to name/number is annotated. TEW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Back Posted 23 June , 2019 Author Share Posted 23 June , 2019 Hi, just to say on Thursday I got an email from the MoD saying that my Great Uncle's medals were ready for dispatch. I did include the medal roll information saying his medals were returned. So big thanks to you guys. It is going to be a tearful day when I see these returned to his family. Now how do I find his death penny? Rick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisC Posted 10 July , 2019 Share Posted 10 July , 2019 (edited) I have 2 MIC's to my Grandfather. Not strictly Great War as his active service was in Waziristan. There are 2 issues I'm interested in here from the MIC's: 1. Whats is the significance of 2 Service numbers - can we tell anything from them 2. The medal - India GS was returned and "scrapped" - why? Thank in advance for assistance. Chris Edited 10 July , 2019 by ChrisC photographs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HolymoleyRE Posted 10 July , 2019 Share Posted 10 July , 2019 41 minutes ago, ChrisC said: I have 2 MIC's to my Grandfather. Not strictly Great War as his active service was in Waziristan. There are 2 issues I'm interested in here from the MIC's: 1. Whats is the significance of 2 Service numbers - can we tell anything from them 2. The medal - India GS was returned and "scrapped" - why? Thank in advance for assistance. Chris Hello Chris, Re two service numbers, the 7 digit number is a post 1920 renumbering one, and the other his number before. Re scrapping the medal, two MICs for the same man, he returned the incorrectly named one and was subsequently scrapped, is my best guess'timate. Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisC Posted 10 July , 2019 Share Posted 10 July , 2019 Thank you Andy. C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baztac Posted 29 November , 2023 Share Posted 29 November , 2023 It is a bit of an old thread this one, but thanks to it we managed to get my Great Uncle's Medals reissued. His medal card had them listed as being returned, so got my Dad to request them using the form around summertime 2023 and got them just delivered last weekend (Nov 2023). One thing, He enlisted in the Seaforth Highlanders around 1917 and on reaching France transferred to the 10th Argyll and Sutherland Highlanders in March 1918. He was killed at Herleville on 23 August 1918. His medals are stamped with the Seaforth's and that Reg No. rather than the A&SH who he was in at the time of his death. Were medals issued with the Enlistement Regiment? I have had a look at a few others on ebay and they have so far followed that to some extent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin RussT Posted 29 November , 2023 Admin Share Posted 29 November , 2023 Welcome Medals were named to the unit the man had on first landing overseas. Regards Russ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baztac Posted 29 November , 2023 Share Posted 29 November , 2023 Just now, RussT said: Welcome Medals were named to the unit the man had on first landing overseas. Regards Russ Thanks for clearing that up for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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