02/4th-5th? pattern tunic Scottish Cutaway

[Spook1940]

Morning Chaps,

 

So I picked up this tunic that has been done up to the 8Btn Manchester, however the interior markings and front cutaway show it to more than likely be Gordons.

 

The overseas and lance jack chevrons are original to the tunic according to the buyer, however judgements reserved until it arrives.

 

Curious to know what the dating is -  the ink stamp is certainly first war in style but I can't find reference to it. I'm also unsure if this is a later 4th pattern 02 or a 22' pattern 5th variant.

 

Any thoughts would be appreciated.

 

Cheers, Spook

[Andrew Upton]

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/WW1-BRITISH-TUNIC-JACKET-LATE-WW1-4th-PATTERN-POSSIBLE-1922-5th-PATTERN/113723103095?hash=item1a7a6cd777:g:uHsAAOSwjr5cuYkj

[Spook1940]

Yes, the above is what I purchased, thus my curiosity. 

[Grovetown]

It's on the cusp date-wise.

 

The single dart and fly lining are indicative of the 1921 (not 1922) pattern jacket; however the 'numbers over letters' stamp is typically wartime.

 

I'm not sure when that was replaced with 'letters over numbers', and it's possible that stamp styling dragged into the early 1920s.

 

There have been some credible anecdotal references to a few examples of the 1921 ptn appearing with war-dated paper labels; yet these seem to have been early, trial types and very, very, very far and few between.

 

That's a bit expensive for a 1921 ptn jacket, yet not too bad; although I wouldn't give it house room TBH.

 

Cheers,

 

GT.

[Steven Broomfield]

If it's a Scottish cut-away type jacket (sorry, don't now the technical terms), why is it badged to a Manchester Regiment battalion?

[Toby Brayley]

I am with Grovetown on this one. 

 

Is it actually a cut away? It doesn't seem very pronounced or am I just being blind?

 

Were they still producing cutaways late War? 

 

Regards 

Toby 

[Spook1940]

Thanks for all the replies.

 

I'm not terribly familiar with all bar the basic varieties of the 02 tunic, but on paper i'm relatively happy with the tunic and the price, as my area of collection encompasses the Gordon's wartime and interwar, so it should make a nice accompanying piece to my other two Gordon 22's. 

 

It is certainly a Scottish cutaway, as per communication with the buyer prior to purchase. Why it's badged to the 8th Manchester - God only knows.

 

Again, thanks for all the help. Once it arrives i'll throw my eye over it and update later. 

 

Cheers, Josh.

Edited 27 April , 2019 by Spook1940

[Muerrisch]

The garment is correctly called a JACKET. This is to distinguish it from tunic, frock, doublet and a few others. Worth getting it right.

[Toby Brayley]

20 hours ago, Spook1940 said:

 

 

It is certainly a Scottish cutaway, as per communication with the buyer prior to purchase. Why it's badged to the 8th Manchester - God only knows.

 

Again, thanks for all the help. Once it arrives i'll throw my eye over it and update later. 

 

Cheers, Josh.

 

Thank you,  if you could share with us the Jacket when it arrives always nice to compare any examples.  At the price you paid can't go wrong. 

 

Toby 

[Grovetown]

Like Toby, I'm not convinced this is really cutaway - it doesn't look pronounced enough, and in the fourth image it seems like you can see the stitching outline of the dressing pocket, which does not survive the cutaway process.

 

An old example of mine, featured in Campaign 1914, is shown below for comparison.

 

And if it is cutaway, and the images are misleading, what on earth was the owner doing badging it up to the Manchesters...

 

I also note that he claimed to be a militaria collector of 50 years standing, yet only recently discovered, in the context of this sale, that numbers over letters was the correct stamping style.

 

Sounds more like he has one year's collecting experience, 50 times.

 

Cheers,

 

GT.

 

Edited 28 April , 2019 by Grovetown