Copmanthorpe

[Alan Bentley]

From my fathers collection labelled "Copmanthorpe", but no date. I think that is him in the cockpit.

Any ideas on date and Squadron?

[HERITAGE PLUS]

The following is the entry for Copmanthorpe Airfield in ‘Action Stations Vol.4 – The Military Airfields of Yorkshire’ by Bruce Barrymore Halpenny.

 

Copmanthorpe – 105/SE575465 – 3 miles SE of  York

 

Sited near the village of Copmanthorpe adjacent to the Leeds-York railway line, this was the replacement site for Knavesmire and was developed into an aerodrome with hangars and other buildings.

 

During May 1916, ‘B’ Flight of 33 Squadron moved in from Knavesmire with their BE2C aeroplanes. ‘B’ Flight remained here until September that year and for a few weeks ‘A’ Flight used the airfield.

 

On 8 June 1916 No: 57 Squadron was formed here from a nucleus of No: 33 Home Defence Squadron. Equipped with FE2ds 57 Squadron moved to France in the same year as a fighter-reconnaissance unit and remained in Europe for the duration of the war.

 

From September 1916 ‘A’ Flight of 76 Squadron RFC operated here with Avro 504s AND 504Ks until March 1919.

 

The airfield closed the same month and the facilities were soon dismantled and the land sold.

 

Today* the only remains are some concrete foundations from the hangars and a small mound of earth which formed the firing range.

 

The entry for Ripon Airfield in the same book states that the HQ of 76 Squadron was there with Flights stationed at Copmanthorpe, Catterick and Helperby.

 

The squadron disbanded on 13 June 1919 at Tadcaster.

 

* Book published 1984

 

Some local information on the airfield here:  https://www.copmanthorpeparishcouncil.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/copmanthorpe-story.pdf

 

Dave

 

Edited 3 April , 2019 by HERITAGE PLUS
Additional info added

[hmsk212]

From  " The SE5 File " by Sturtivant & Page :-

 

250 SE5a ordered 24/06/1918 from Austin Motor Co, Longbridge,  Birmingham, numbered F7951 - F8200.

Deliveries to No 14 AAP Castle Bromwich ( 200-hp Hispano-Suiza )

 

F7965 :- At 14 AAP Castle Bromwich 21/12/1918, allotment to E F cancelled, reallotted to 2 FS Marske ;

              Tadcaster --/10/1919

 

Steve

[Alan Bentley]

I am very much obliged for this info, as I am trying to trace my father's footsteps.

However , written on the back is "Copmanthorpe" and I know from his service record that he was briefly at Tadcaster. 

Could Copmanthorpe be an error?

[jonbem]

Hi

have a look at

http://www.abct.org.uk/airfields/airfield-finder/tadcaster-bramham-moor/

and

http://www.abct.org.uk/airfields/airfield-finder/copmanthorpe/

about 6 or 7 miles apart

regards

Jon

[pete-c]

18 minutes ago, Alan Bentley said:

I am very much obliged for this info, as I am trying to trace my father's footsteps.

However , written on the back is "Copmanthorpe" and I know from his service record that he was briefly at Tadcaster. 

Could Copmanthorpe be an error?

 

 Morning Alan,

 

The aeroplane sheds featured in your photo certainly seem to match with the description of Copmanthorpe given in the Cross and Cockade Gazetteer of Flying Sites:

'Two HD pattern flight sheds, 65x120 feet, as a coupled unit ...'     

From the same source:  76 (HD) Sqn A Flight  at Copmanthorpe from 10.10.1916 then to Tadcaster (Bramham Moor) on 3.5.1919.

The aerodrome was apparently 1/4 mile from Copmanthorpe railway station.

 

Hope this helps,

Peter.

[Alan Bentley]

Thanks for that Pete.

[mickdavis]

The photo cold well show Copmanthorpe, but certainly not Tadcaster, which had 1917 pattern timber GS sheds, one of which still survives. The two stations were only a few miles apart. Copmanthorpe housed A Flt of 76 Squadron, equipped with Avro 504K (NF) from the autumn of 1918 but also accommodated some machines for use by senior officers attached to the NE Area HQ, 16 Group HQ and 16 Wing HQ based in York. Tadcaster housed 38 TDS, which was equipped with SE5a and Avro 504K. It was also used as a Storage Station during 1919. 76 Sqn (all 3 flights + HQ) moved to Tadcaster on 30 May 1919, prior to disbandment a fortnight later. 

[Alan Bentley]

More from Copmanthorpe.

What is that civvie a/c?

[pete-c]

On ‎13‎/‎04‎/‎2019 at 14:18, Alan Bentley said:

More from Copmanthorpe.

What is that civvie a/c?

 

Alan,

 

It would appear that the 'civvie' aircraft G-EALN is the modified two-seat Blackburn Sidecar.  The photo can be dated fairly accurately as its appearance was seemingly changed dramatically, and it was re-engined with a 100hp Anzani radial - as pictured - post July 1921.  By October 1921 it was apparently logged as being un-airworthy.   A better scan of this image may well reveal the details of the markings on the fuselage.

 

And I'm sure that the details in the other photos will confirm if this is actually Copmanthorpe or not.   Over to you Mick.

 

EDIT:  Having done some more research on the above aircraft, it now seems likely this was the Blackburn 'White Falcon' - an aircraft produced for the Blackburn test pilot William Rowland Ding.  It was apparently built in 1915.  Ding was killed in 1917.  I can only presume that the registration G-EALN was taken over for this machine following the realisation that the Blackburn Sidecar was un-airworthy.

Edited 14 April , 2019 by pete-c

[Alan Bentley]

[Alan Bentley]

This is my father's record with entries for 1919 & 1920s. It shows Tadcaster & Scampton but no specific Copmanthorpe entry.

With the mass of RAF unit initials is it possible to decipher which, if any ,refer to Copmanthorpe.?

I have three albums, Copmanthorpe, and Scampton, no dates , and Tadcaster Sept 1919

Over to the experts!

Edited 13 November , 2022 by Alan Bentley

[pete-c]

The only extras I have come up with Alan are regarding the three RAF machines.

 

Bristol F2b E2631  was with 37 Sqn

Avro 504K J5499 was transferred to the Civil Register and apparently wore both G-EAGD and G-EAEL, obviously at different times.

But I'm afraid I've got nothing at all on SE5A E5816.

[topgun1918]

All I have for E5816 in my database, is that it was with 38 TDS, Tadcaster and crashed in May 1919.

 

Graeme

 

[pete-c]

38 minutes ago, topgun1918 said:

All I have for E5816 in my database, is that it was with 38 TDS, Tadcaster and crashed in May 1919.

 

Graeme

 

 

Thanks for that Graeme.  This should help pin down the possible date of the photo.

[Alan Bentley]

On ‎16‎/‎04‎/‎2019 at 11:08, pete-c said:

 

Thanks for that Graeme.  This should help pin down the possible date of the photo.

Well done lads!

I have photo of  E 5816 on it's belly on some grass with it's wheels "retracted" and what looks like prop damage.

This could then be May 1919, but where was 38 TDS?

[HERITAGE PLUS]

Tadcaster became 38TDS in 1918 remained so until the closure in June 1919.

Edited 18 April , 2019 by HERITAGE PLUS

[pete-c]

1 hour ago, Alan Bentley said:

Well done lads!

I have photo of  E 5816 on it's belly on some grass with it's wheels "retracted" and what looks like prop damage.

This could then be May 1919, but where was 38 TDS?

 

Alan,

 

As Mick points out in Post #8 - if I read his post correctly -  Copmanthorpe was used as a Storage Station during 1919 - this probably explaining the number of different types in the photos - Avro 504, SE5A, Bristol F2 and, of course, the Blackburn White Falcon; this last machine possibly the property of a senior officer, who, as Mick intimates, could well have used it for commuting between the various NE Area airfields.

As far as your father's record goes, perhaps Copmanthorpe was not considered 'important' enough to warrant a entry?  He obviously moved around a lot so perhaps, in the course of various transcriptions of his record, both written and typed, Copmanthorpe simply got missed off.

[mickdavis]

It was Tadcaster which was the Storage Station during 1919. What's most interesting about the service record is that the gentleman was posted to Tadcaster after Copmanthorpe had closed. Copmanthorpe's relinquishment was notified on 6 November 1919 and confirmed on 22 January 1920 ( and these events were noted in the contemporary aviation press, such as Flight and The Aeroplane). I have BF E2631 as being with 2 FS at Marske and the large station number 77 would tally with this. In one of the other photos there is a BF marked 76, which was probably C4695, another 2 FS machine.

The RAF monthly List of Units and Stations for February 1920 (I don't have a copy of that for March). The only unit noted for Tadcaster was the Tadcaster Mobile Disposal Squadron, whose function was in the name - detachments went around collecting and disposing of RAF equipment, including aeroplanes. This could well tie in with the M Section in the service record. There is no mention of Copmanthorpe  in that list. My only suggestion is that Tadcaster, being used for civilian flying, was used on an ad-hoc basis by Tadcaster - but that's only a guess.

As for Avro J5499 and its civilian identity - some sources link G-EAGD/GEALE with D5499 but that machine served in the Middle East. Does anyone know where Aerial photo Ltd was based?

[pete-c]

1 hour ago, mickdavis said:

It was Tadcaster which was the Storage Station during 1919.

 

Thanks for putting me right Mick.  Would Aerial Photo Ltd and Aerofilms Ltd be one and the same?  Aerofilms Ltd (Claude Grahame-White, Francis Wills) operated initially from a suite at the London Country Club, Aerodrome Road, Hendon and then from offices within the aerodrome itself.

[Chris Robinson]

I am secretary of South Ainsty Archaeological Society which covers the area South of York including Copmanthorpe. We published a book in 2010 entitled Coppenthorpe to Copmanthorpe which has a chapter on the war in Copmanthorpe.  We also collect photographs of the area and post these on our website. I have just come across your photographs of Copmanthorpe airfield and these are the only photos we have ever seen of the airfield when in operation (we have one of the inside of a hangar taken in 1920 when used for storing bricks!). 

Could we gain your permission to put these photographs on our website? 

Thank you very much for your assistance and again cannot praise you enough for these photographs of what is now a little known episode in the history of our village.

Chris Robinson 

[Michelle Young]

Welcome to the forum. @Alan Bentleyhasn’t visited the forum for a few months. Hopefully, my tag will alert him to your post. 

[Chris Robinson]

Thanks for your help

 

[Alan Bentley]

Could I have details of the archaeology website please?

[Chris Robinson]

Hi Alan the website is www.southainstyvillages.org. Not much Great War stuff on there up to now! a bit of 2nd World War as Acaster Malbis Airfield was nearby. I would be grateful if you could send me JPEG copies of your father's photographs if you are agreeable to us using these on our website, with appropriate attribution. 

I have also come across the Kavala site which seems to be open access and gives a history of your father's service (and includes photographs of your father and yourself, are we allowed to use these if we wish?)

Chris