Origins of the rank Warrant Schoolmaster in the R.N?

[davidbohl]

Warrington casualty Maurice John Glover attained the rank of Warrant Schoolmaster in the R.N according to cwgc.

 

https://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/2747676/glover,-maurice-john/

 

Can GWF tell me if he was actually doing an actual role on HMS Glatton or Warrant Schoolmaster was his shore job ?

 

Many thanks

Dave

[horatio2]

He originally joined as a Naval Schoolmaster (rating) and served six months from Feb - Aug 1918 before being given his warrant. Schoolmasters served ashore and afloat. They had to be Certified Teachers (Certified by the Board of Education).

[davidbohl]

Thanks for that, how unlucky to get caught in an ammo explosion so late in the war https://forgottenwrecks.maritimearchaeologytrust.org/wrecks-and-sites/explore-the-wrecks/articles/hms-glatton

 

Dave

[michaeldr]

“Killed by explosion on ship” seems designed for the benefit of the family

and the second CWGC document is only slightly nearer the truth: “was on a vessel blown up”

What a sad happening and what a very difficult decision to be made by those in charge, notably Keyes

[horatio2]

An interesting man. A schoolmaster in civilian life, he first volunteered for the Mersey Division RNVR (Mersey Z/3247) on 18 May 1917, serving as an Ordinary Seaman. He transferred to the RN as a Naval Schoolmaster (M.30320) on 25 February 1918.

CWGC information is at odds with his naval records: for RNVR and RN he gave his years of birth as 1889 - CWGC age at death 36 = 1882. His RN record states"Date of birth given on F.E. (first entry) [i.e. 1889] to be adhered to although true date appears to be 7 May 1882."

Also, his naval records show Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk as his p.o.b. - CWGC = Warrington. 

GLATTON was destroyed on 16 September but GLOVER died of his injuries six days later. He was not "killed by explosion on ship 22 September".

Edited 17 March , 2019 by horatio2

[davidbohl]

 

Some more info on BNA

WARRINGTON SCHOOLMASTER'S DEATH. has reached Warrington of thd death from injuries receive*] the result an ..

... SCHOOLMASTER'S DEATH. has reached Warrington of thd death from injuries receive*] the result an explosion board ship of Mr. Maurice Glover, naval schoolmaster. was thirtyfive years of age, married, and prior to joining the Navy held the position of assistant ...

Published: Tuesday 24 September 1918 
Newspaper: Liverpool Echo 

 

[michaeldr]

 

I presume that the dreadful details of what happened here were not generally known at the time

Even now I can find no mention of it in Aspinal-Oglander's biography of Keyes

Nor for that matter in The Keyes Papers edited by Paul Halpern

[horatio2]

The absence of GLATTON from the Keyes papers is extraordinary since his actions on that day probably saved the town of Dover from annihilation (as Halifax, NS)

[davidbohl]

 

I haven't got access to BNA at the moment but I assume these bits are relevant ?

TO-DAY’S NEWS

... military, who with bayonets axed gradually sent the people into the back streets. It was feared the lire would roach the Glatton's magazines, and if this had happened disaster would have befallen the town. The danger was increased by the presence other ...

Published: Wednesday 27 November 1918 
Newspaper: Cambridge Daily News 

 

SIGNING ARMISTICE

... reach the Glatton s magazines, brought glorious'end, and it « knowledge of the requirements 'waitin®' J was seen settling doao. glare j Mt f f>. behalf of the* the ' and the dependants of the fallen . gave place to intense darkness as the Glatton ! of the ...

Published: Wednesday 27 November 1918 
Newspaper: Western Morning News 

 

Rctarscd Heme

... increased by the presence of other craft with explosives board. Suddenly muffled report was heard, smoke shot in the air, and the Glatton seemed be settling down. The monitor had been sunk by torpedoos. It was stated that the destroyer I'roke, of the Channel fight ...

Published: Wednesday 27 November 1918 
Newspaper: Sunderland Daily Echo and Shipping Gazette 

 

THE LOSS OF H.M.S. 'GLATTCH'

... tell on the Dockyard, but none at all on the Sea Front. a moment the decks of every ship Idled with men were looking the Glatton. where the explosion occurred could seen little flames licking round the topworks. A few men ran along the deck towards the ...

Published: Friday 29 November 1918 
Newspaper: Dover Express 

 

 

THE KING AT DOVER

... with the operations of war. In reply to Councillor Chitty, was stated that the cost of the inquests held the men of H.M.S. Glatton was £54 4d. Councillor Chitty said that it seemed to him that there was necessity to hold inque-st men when one would have ...

Published: Friday 06 December 1918 
Newspaper: Dover Express 

 

T. MALONE'S, ARDEE. BALROTNERY GUARDIANS AND COUNCIL. The Collestions—Readmeo's Wages

... arrived on the scene, and the creeds were gradually shepherded rule the bank streets. It was feared the lire would reach the Glatton'i ensgasinee, and if this had hsppened dinner would hmre befallen the town. The danger was increased by the preemies of other ...

Published: Saturday 14 December 1918 
Newspaper: Drogheda Argus and Leinster Journal 

[michaeldr]

There's a good article here on the event and the aftermath

https://doverhistorian.com/2015/03/07/glatton-the-catastrophe-and-the-salvage/

[michaeldr]

Looking at the Naval History Net and their listings of the Royal Navy's fallen

HMS Glatton men are recorded and named on September 16^th, 17^th, 18^th, 19^th, 21^st, 22^nd, 23^rd, 25^th, 26^th, 27^th, 28^th and 29^th. As well as on October 2^nd, 3^rd and 7^th

 

https://www.naval-history.net/xDKCas1918-09Sep.htm

https://www.naval-history.net/xDKCas1918-10Oct.htm

[michaeldr]

In Keyes' “Naval Memoirs 1916-1918” (published 1935)  his own account of this tragedy commences on p.356

see https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.524527/page/n377

 

Edited 17 March , 2019 by michaeldr

[seaJane]

I've posted on GLATTON on the GWF before now, as her surgeon was Edward Leicester Atkinson, from Scott's TERRA NOVA expedition 1910-12 - searching should track that down. He was awarded the Albert Medal in Gold for his actions that day, and the extent of his injuries can still be seen in postwar photograph groups from Haslar. Citation in the LG.

[michaeldr]

7 hours ago, seaJane said:

I've posted on GLATTON on the GWF before now, as her surgeon was Edward Leicester Atkinson, from Scott's TERRA NOVA expedition 1910-12 - searching should track that down. He was awarded the Albert Medal in Gold for his actions that day, and the extent of his injuries can still be seen in postwar photograph groups from Haslar. Citation in the LG.