Soldiers identified in photo

[kloughnane]

Dear all,

A friend recently gave me a copy of the Picture Post dated September 16, 1939. I found the attached article on the readers' letters page and was wondering if anybody knows if the identification of the named soldiers is correct? Or is this another Great War photo where several people have come up with different IDs for the pictured men?

Regards,

Kev Loughnane

[Dai Bach y Sowldiwr]

This photograph was discussed in some detail here last year.

I'll try and dig it out.

[kloughnane]

DByS,

Thank you.

Regards,

Kev Loughnane

 

[Dai Bach y Sowldiwr]

 

[kloughnane]

DByS,

That's brilliant - thank you. There's a few pages on that original subject so a little bit of reading to do.

Thanks again,

 

Kev Loughnane.

[Dai Bach y Sowldiwr]

[Dai Bach y Sowldiwr]

OK.

The way I read it, the Picture Post again states that No.5 is Pte. Jack Pizzey of the Berkshires.

But, it states that No.6 is his pal Pte. Jack Clare, of the same regiment.

However the writer of the letter claims the picture was taken at "Villers Cottrel, on the right of Vimy Ridge" in 1918, when both men were "attached to the Military Police".

 

The IWM description of this photo (Q 800) is:

"Battle of Bazentin Ridge. Five British and German walking wounded, injured in their arms and legs, on the way to a dressing station near Bernafay Wood, 19th July 1916."

 

A few discrepancies to sort out here again then!

[kloughnane]

At the risk of casting aspersions - is it possible that the IWM may have the wrong information? 

Regards,

Kev Loughnane.

[Dai Bach y Sowldiwr]

47 minutes ago, kloughnane said:

is it possible that the IWM may have the wrong information? 

Anything is possible.

 

But I think I will go with IWM than the Picture Post.

 

Villers Cottrel on the right of Vimy Ridge is a new location for me, as is the dating of the photo to 1918, by which time  Edward/Edmund Dillamore (Supposedly No. 7) was dead.

And I can't see any evidence that Nos. 5 & 6  were anything other than infantry or pioneers, certainly nothing in their uniforms suggest they were Military Police.

[TEW]

I'm sure the previous topic on the photo pretty much established it was Somme 1916. There are at least 2 almost identical photos taken by Brooke and Brookes (from memory) both official photographers of the Somme. Plus other members provided convincing evidence for the location.

TEW

[Dai Bach y Sowldiwr]

10 hours ago, Dai Bach y Sowldiwr said:

Villers Cottrel on the right of Vimy Ridge is a new location for me

What I meant by that was "Is there such a place anywhere in France?"

There's a Villers-au-Bois some 8 miles to the rear but nothing else with a name anything like Villers Cottrel.

[TEW]

There are now 4 seperate topics that suggest Pizzey is in the photo which gives some weight to the idea.

 

Pizzey was previously IDd as 7593 John Thos Pizzey 1st RB only according to medal roll. Diary for 1/RB has them training 19/7/1916 but took up nr Delville Wood 24/7/1916 and were in Bernafay Woods 26/7/1916 ready for attack on Delville Wood 27/7/1916 which concluded 28/7/1916. 152 ORs wounded.

 

ADMS for 2nd Div has Medical Arrangements;

 

There's also an accompanying map showing the Bearer Post in Bernafay Wood, ADS in Carnoy and MDS Bronfay Farm. Walking cases could walk from Bernafay Wood to Carnoy or are they walking from RAP to Bernafay?

 

Clare could be John Clare 7449 later MGC but no RB battalion found as yet.

TEW

[ss002d6252]

27 minutes ago, TEW said:

There are now 4 seperate topics that suggest Pizzey is in the photo which gives some weight to the idea.

 

Pizzey was previously IDd as 7593 John Thos Pizzey 1st RB only according to medal roll. Diary for 1/RB has them training 19/7/1916 but took up nr Delville Wood 24/7/1916 and were in Bernafay Woods 26/7/1916 ready for attack on Delville Wood 27/7/1916 which concluded 28/7/1916. 152 ORs wounded.

 

ADMS for 2nd Div has Medical Arrangements;

 

There's also an accompanying map showing the Bearer Post in Bernafay Wood, ADS in Carnoy and MDS Bronfay Farm. Walking cases could walk from Bernafay Wood to Carnoy or are they walking from RAP to Bernafay?

  

Clare could be John Clare 7449 later MGC but no RB battalion found as yet.

TEW

#7449 John Clare has a surviving service record - https://search.findmypast.co.uk/record?id=GBM%2FWO363-4%2F007266264%2F01869&parentid=GBM%2FWO363-4%2F7266264%2F139%2F1869

 

He was in France in July 16 (sent home in Nov 16) and with 2nd Royal Berks at the time. No wounds reported in 1916 though.

 

Craig

Edited 11 March , 2019 by ss002d6252

[TEW]

If Clare was 2/RB that puts the two men in different divisions. 2/RB diary places them in reserve for the dates that worked well for Pizzey. Other topic had 'No.6 (Clare?) as a pioneer.

 

I have Pizzey on casualty lists on 30/11/1914 and Clare 29/12/1914 & 10/12/1917. Despite their appearance their wounds may not have been enough to get them listed for the photo event. There again, Dillamore who looks the worst off doesn't show either.

 

Just checked other topic and it seems this photo was used in the press a week before Pizzey was near Bernafay Woods.

TEW