18th Ottoman Infantry Regiment

[Jeff Pickerd]

For many years now I have been trying to find information on 18th Regiment, as it forms an important part of the history of the 3rd Light Horse Brigades' time at Gallipoli, in particular to Walker's Ridge/Russell's Top.

What I have established of the 18th Regiment so far is rather sparse in detail, and much of that has only added more questions than answer. It was attached to the 19th Division on the 13th June from the 6th Division, taking over the positions on Baby 700 facing the 3rd LH Bde on Russell's Top from the 3/64th Regiment. The commanding officer (name unknown) was killed soon after from what is described as 'infantry fire' while inspecting the trenches above the Turkish trench 18 line on Baby 700.

Does anyone know the name of this officer, or the date of his death>

Major (Binbasi) Mustafa Asin Efendi  of the 15th Regiment was appointed CO of the 18th Regt. [reference Atase Archive 4530/30/6-3] From the "Gallipoli Centenary Turkish Archives Research Project", a note states that he was killed during the month of August.

Does anyone know the date of his death?

The Turkish attack on the 3rd LH Bde trenches at the Nek on the night of 29th/30th June would appear to have been carried out by the 1st, 2nd & 3rd Battalions of the 18th Regiment. A ,.

great deal is known of this battle from Australians sources, But Turkish accounts are limited and in many cases misleading.

Does anyone know if the 18th Regiments war diaries have been translated  and able to give such information?

Any assistance wold be greatly appreciated.

 

Jeff

[Guest]

Mate,

 

I have little on the 18th Regt in my records sorry;

 

18th Infantry Regt    Maj Mustafa Bey KIA 9-8-15 - LtCol Abdülkadir Bey    6th Div 1914 to 2nd Div 1918    1-3/18th Regt + 18th MG Co        surrendered the River Dicle (Tigris) (28/30-10-18)
 

Abdülkadir Bey    18th Regt - 8-15 to ?    LtCol        
Ali Osman Mehmet    18th Regt 3Bn     Pte    KIA 8-15    KIA 8-15
Halil Ömer    18th Regt 2Bn     Pte    KIA 8-15    
Ismail Mustafa    18th Regt - 2Bn     Pte    KIA 8-15    KIA 8-15
Mehmet Hamdi    18th Regt - 3Bn     Pte    KIA 8-15    KIA 8-15
Mehmet Hasan    18th Regt - 2Bn     Pte    KIA 8-15    KIA 8-15
Mustafa Bey     18th Regt - 1915 to 8-15     Maj    KIA 9-8-15    KIA 9-8-15 at 1st Anafartalar 
Mustafa Hüseyin    18th Regt - 2Bn     Pte (1571)    KIA 8-15    KIA 8-15
Mustafa Hüseyin    18th Regt - 2Bn     Pte (2776)    KIA 8-15    KIA 8-15
Mustafa Mehmet    18th Regt - 3Bn     Pte    KIA 8-15    KIA 8-15
Osman Mehmet    18th Regt - 2Bn     Pte    KIA 8-15    KIA 8-15      
Süleyman Hasan    18th Regt 2Bn     Pte    KIA 8-15    KIA 8-15

 

6th Div

 

Thrace 1914 to Gallipoli June 1915 to Mesopotamia 1916 to Nth Persia (Iraq) 1916 recaptured Kermanshah 2-7-16 Mesopotamia 1917/18    

2nd Corps -1914 & Gallipoli June 1915 15th Corps- Gallipoli 1915 13th Corps- Feb 1916/17 6th Army     

6th Division (Kirkkilise)    

LtCol Süleyman Sakir (Orbay) Bey 1914  to 8-15 reported sacked by Liman von Sanders-                                           Col Nazif (Kayacik) Bey 8-15 -           Col Fahrettin (Altay) Bey -                   LtCol Mehmet Hayri Bey    Maj Mehmet Hayri (Tarhan) 6-15 shown LtCol Selahattin Adil 7-15 no record? to Capt Nihat 8-15 to Ömer Halis (Biyiktay)    

1-4/16th Regt - 16th MG Co 
1-4/17th Regt - 17th MG Co 
1-4/18th Regt - 18th MG Co     

 

16th Regt - LtCol Ahmet Hakki Bey KIA 23-8-15 to Maj Mehmet Emin (Yazgan) 9-15 shown Lt Birtz date?  17th Regt - LtCol Hasan Bey KIA 11-7-15 at Kerevizdere & Maj Hüseyin Bey KIA 12-7-15 - LtCol Hail to LtCol H Nurettin (Özsu) 10Co/3Bn Capt Mustafa Efendi KIA 22-7-15  18th Regt - Maj Mustafa Bey KIA 9-8-15 at 1st Anafartalar to LtCol Abdülkadir Bey Composed Gendarm Regt - Maj Yusuf Ziya     

 

Garrison Smyrna 1914 - 18th Regt det to 19th Div at Gallipoli June 1915 & Composed Jandarma regt (combinded 4Bns of regt) - 13th Corps- Feb 1916 6th Army  (2nd, 4th, 6th Div's) crosses the Persian frontier in June 1916 recaptured Kermanshah 2-7-16 and Hamadan 10-8-16 - Jan 1917 - 156th Regt (or 22nd Regt) replaced 17th Regt (156th Regt shown attach 18th Corps) - shown Feb 1917 Allied reports - 16th Regt 18th Regt + Composed Jandarma Regt - fighting around Kermanshah 11-3-17 shown March 1917 British records - at Khaniqin near Bisitum (4500 men 12 guns) - action at Ruz Canal (Jabal Hamrin) 26-3-17 - shown July 1917 Allied reports - 6th Div (4000 men 36 guns) - shown Aug 1917 Turkish reports 16th Regt 6xMGs 18th Regt 6xMGs 1&2Bn/156th Regt 4xMGs Sqn cav 16 guns) - shown Oct 1917 (3400 men 40 cav 26 guns) shown Dec 1917 Allied reports - 16th Regt 22nd Regt - action at Qara Tepe 5-12-17 - shown May 1918 Allied reports (16th Regt 18th Regt 22nd Regt) - shown Aug 1918 Allied reports (16th Regt 22nd Regt & 18th Regt to 2nd Div Oct 1918 shown 2nd Div records Aug 1918) - shown Sept 1918 Allied reports (1800 men 40 MGs) 16th Regt 22nd Regt + attack/Storm Co + Cav Sqn (80 cav) + 8 guns) also reported 16th Regt disbanded to 22nd Regt? - action at Sharqat - Baiji near Mosul on 23/27-10-18 and surrender the River Dicle (Tigris) (28/30-10-18)    

 

6th Artillery Regt - Maj Arif Bey (1915) to Maj Ali Kemal Bey     1/6th FA Bty (4x 75mm QF) 2/6th FA Bty (4x 75mm QF) 3/6th FA Bty (4x 75mm QF) 4/6th FA Bty (4x 75mm QF) (5MBty & 6MBty Mountain Btys each (6x 7.5cm Gebirgskanone L/14 Krupp)     Bty - Lt Sami ( Topçu) shown 1914 Russian intelligence - 4 batteries some armed with Schneider guns (Serbian Schneider 75mm M 1907 A guns captured 52 guns in Balkans War)     

 

5th Sqn 3rd Cav Regt (Capt Nezir) - 6th Field Hosp - Dr Haci Bahaeddin - 6th Sig sect - Lt Mustafa June 1915 - 6th Eng Co (3rd Pnr Co) - Capt Ibrahim Halil June 1915 6th pontoon sect     

 

02.08.14 Kirk Kilisa __.12.15 Istanbul (Aya Stefanos) 22.02.16 Müslîmiye Stn 25.02.16 Ras el Ayn 27.02.16 Nusaybin 04.03.16 Tel el Hayal 08.03.16 Tel Uveynât 11.03.16 zü'l Âb 16.03.16 Musul 20.03.16 Hamam el Alîl 23.03.16 Çeyâre 28.03.16 Kal’at es Serkat 30.03.16 Kal’at el Ma’kul 04.04.16 Kal’at ebu Riyâze 14.04.16 Tikrit 20.04.16 Samarra 27.04.16 Beled 30.04.16 Serî’at el Beydâ 06.05.16 Bagdad 08.05.16 Bakuba 18.05.16 Sehriban 28.05.16 Kizil Ribat 02.06.16 Hanakin 09.06.16 Kasr i Sirîn 16.06.16 Ser Pûl 27.06.16 Kerend 29.06.16 Hârun Âbad 01.07.16 Kirman Sah 05.08.16 Sungur 08.08.16 Esad Âbad 10.08.16 Sal Âbad 23.02.17 Kirman Sah 26.02.17 Kerend 29.02.17 Kasr i Sirîn 19.03.17 Hanakin 14.06.17 Kizil Ribat 14.07.17 Deli Abbas Han'i 19.07.17 Erbil 20.02.18 Revandiz 20.04.18 Rayet 24.04.18 Pirâne 27.04.18 Nâlus 29.04.18 Usnu 12.05.18 Tas Agil 19.05.18 Hâne 23.06.18 Nagâde 05.07.18 || (de-comissioned
 

Sorry mate its not much on this Regt, since the Div Garrison Smyrna at Kirkkilise  pre war, then the Regts may have drawn there men from around there?

 

Maj Mustafa appears to be the same as Mustafa Asin so I hope that helps.

 

As I said there is little on the 18th Regt, and as far as I known no unit war dairy is around, or I am I aware of one on any Ottoman Regt?

 

Cheers

S.B

Edited 2 March , 2019 by stevebecker

[Jeff Pickerd]

Many thanks Steve,

 

All of that is most useful, I’ll come back to this once I have gone over what I have and have added your information.

 

Jeff

[Jeff Pickerd]

OK Steve, a quick response to your useful information.

I have done a search of the war diaries of the 8th,9th, and 10th LH Regt’s to see if there was any indication to the death of Major Mustafa on the 9th August. It seems the 8th LH relieved the 8th Cheshire Regiment in the reserve trenches on Russell’s Top that day. The 9th and 10th doth report that ongoing fire was being put down on the 18th Regiment, but no indication to the extent of its effectiveness that would give any clue to the Majors death.

 

I would assume that you have already gone through all of the 16 Pdf’s of translated woks from the Macquarie University, “Translated Turkish Works on Gallipoli.” ‘The Gallipoli Campaign with Maps, by Marathas Karakas (2007)’has been particularly useful. The entry for the 13th June 1915 “the 3/64 Regiment was replaced by the 18th Regiment, the 3/64 was sent to the 9th Division which was located at/in Kaval Tepe area.” Note ref 1 - After the replacement, when the 18th Regiment Commander was visiting the trenches that he took over he got hit in the head by infantry fire and was sent to hospital. Major Mustafa Bey from the 15th Regiment was appointed to the command of the 18th Regiment,” Reference given as Atase Archive 4530/30/6-3.

 

I have also found the memoirs of Major Halis of the 3/27th Regiment also very useful.

 

Jeff

[emrezmen]

On 2 Mart 2019 at 09:22, Jeff Pickerd said:

The commanding officer (name unknown) was killed soon after from what is described as 'infantry fire' while inspecting the trenches above the Turkish trench 18 line on Baby 700.

 Does anyone know the name of this officer, or the date of his death>

 

Lt.-Colonel Abdulkadir (b. 1874). He was a Turkish officer from Damascus. Wounded on 13 June, only a day after his regiment took over the trenches, and lost his life on 20 June. There are some details in Bean's official history (vol.2 p.308) about his death, but their accuracy is highly doubtful.

 

The Trench No.18 (marked as "A1" in Allied diagrams) was located to the northwest of the today's Turkish monument:

(AWM, RC04278)

 

On 2 Mart 2019 at 09:22, Jeff Pickerd said:

Major (Binbasi) Mustafa Asin Efendi  of the 15th Regiment was appointed CO of the 18th Regt. [reference Atase Archive 4530/30/6-3] From the "Gallipoli Centenary Turkish Archives Research Project", a note states that he was killed during the month of August.

Does anyone know the date of his death?

 

Major Mustafa Rakim. His exact born/death date is unknown, but he survived the war. He was Deputy CO of 15th Regt during the 19 May offensive. He was sent to Iran-Iraq Front with his regiment after Gallipoli, and taken prisoner on 30 Oct. 1918. Returned to Turkey after two years in captivity. Participated in Turkish War of Liberation. Retired in 1925.

 

OC of 1/18th -his name was also Mustafa- assumed the command of the regiment until Mustafa Rakim's arrival. Not sure if he was KIA in August, his name is not included in Turkish Ministry of National Defence (MSB) KIA rolls of 50.000+ names.

 

Mustafa Kemal's order about replacement:

 

 

"5- Major Mustafa Bey, former commander of Fifteenth Regiment, has been appointed to the 18th Regiment Command. The First Battalion Commander Major Mustafa Efendi* will assume the position of the Deputy Regimental Command until the said person arrives."

 

*= It sould've been "bey" instead of "efendi." 

 

These two not to be confused with CO of 15th Regt. Major Ibrahim Sükrü, KIA during the Battle of Lone Pine and OC of 1/13th Regt. Maj. Mustafa Asim KIA on 4 May 1915. 

 

On 2 Mart 2019 at 09:22, Jeff Pickerd said:

The Turkish attack on the 3rd LH Bde trenches at the Nek on the night of 29th/30th June would appear to have been carried out by the 1st, 2nd & 3rd Battalions of the 18th Regiment. A ,.

 

This attack was made by 1st (on left near Monash Valley) and 2nd (on right near the trench No.18) Bns. 3rd Bn kept in reserve. Especially the 1st Bn suffered heavily in this attack. See Maj. Mustafa's first report after the operation started:

 

 

Date: 17/4/331 (30/6/1915)
Time: 1 am

From: Cesarettepe (i.e. Turkish Nek) 

 

To 19th Division Command

1- The Second Battalion attacking on the right has captured the first and second line trenches of the enemy.

2- The three companies of the First Battalion attacking on the left have also entered enemy trenches.

3- A machine gun have been captured from the enemy.

4- The Third Battalion has begun reinforcing the attack.

 

Here is the part of Mustafa Kemal's report to CO of 3rd AC (Northern Group) Esad Pasha:

 

Date: 17/04/1331 (30/6/1915)

Time: 10 pm

From: Northeast of Hill 180 (i.e. Baby 700)

"As for the attack of 18th Regiment: The regiment started attacking at 0:20 am from Mehmed Çavuş (Sergeant Mehmet) Trenches and the trench No.18, within the area between the gully in north of Cesaret Tepe and Kömürkapi Dere* which is located in the east of Cesaret Tepe. The signal for the beginning of the attack was firing of a star shell. Field guns at Conkbayiri and mountain batteries in southeast of Hill 180 kept the Yükseksirt (i.e. Russell's or sometimes The Nek) under fire. The Second Battalion of the regiment on the left and First Battalion on the right approached enemy's first line without difficulty, and entered the enemy's H trenches at once. They also captured and occupied the second line. The enemy soldiers who couldn't escape from the aforementioned trenches were annihilated, and our soldiers established themselves there. (...) However, the secondary obstacles which blocked the rear of captured enemy lines prevented the development of the success. Moreover, the soldiers had become very battered due to fierce bombing and rifle & machine gun fire the enemy had opened. Situation become gentle due to incompetency in using the reinforcements and the fact that a part of the soldiers were unable to move forward when they caught by the enemy fire. This situation remained unchanged until 4 am. Later on, the soldiers in the advanced positions, who could not be reinforced in due time and had been under the enemy's fierce fire, were unable to maintain their positions, and retreated. Thus, a necessity occured to give up the occupied position. The fighting ceased, and the regiment got back its previous situation since the disorganization and casualties and the daybreak did not allow us to continue the attack.

 

The men fought bravely, and maintained their good morale. The amount of casualties was not reported by the regiment, but the number of wounded at Medical Coy's casualty clearing station is 343. The death toll is unclear. The enemy's casualties estimated to be heavy.

 

In Second Battalion, a captain and a first-lieutenant killed; a lieutenant wounded; a lieutenant and a third-lieutenant are missing. In First Battalion, a captain wounded. In Third Battalion, a captain and an officer cadet wounded. Now the regiment is holding its original positions."

 

*= It should've been "Korku Dere" (i.e. Monash Valley)

 

A page from original report:

 

 

On 2 Mart 2019 at 09:22, Jeff Pickerd said:

Does anyone know if the 18th Regiments war diaries have been translated  and able to give such information?

 

 

Not translated, unfortunately. We have only 19th Div's and 27th Regt's diaries translated, and they're sufficient to a certain extent for now. I heard that the Dardanelles Fortified Zone Command is next. There is immense amount of material in ATASE Archives, but they're annoyingly jealous (this does not mean that the documents are closed to researchers/historians, despite claims to the contrary). Still I'm hopeful for the future.

 

My sources for the reports, orders, officer informations etc.

 

-Çanakkale Muharebelerinde 19. Tümen Cerideleri, 4. Cilt (25.5.1915 - 29.6.1915) s.220. Genelkurmay Askerî Tarih ve Stratejik Etüt Daire Başkanlığı Yayınları, Ankara, 2017 / 19th Division War Diaries of Gallipoli Campaign, vol.4, (25.5.1915 - 29.6.1915) p.220. Department of Military History and Strategic Studies (ATASE) Press, Ankara, 2017

 

-Çanakkale Muharebelerinde 19. Tümen Cerideleri, 5. Cilt (29.6.1915 - 22.7.1915) s.6. Genelkurmay Askerî Tarih ve Stratejik Etüt Daire Başkanlığı Yayınları, Ankara, 2017 / 19th Division War Diaries of Gallipoli Campaign, vol.5, (29.6.1915 - 22.7.1915) p.6. Department of Military History and Strategic Studies (ATASE) Press, Ankara, 2017

 

-Çanakkale Muharebelerinde 19. Tümen Cerideleri, 5. Cilt (29.6.1915 - 22.7.1915) s.19-20. Genelkurmay Askerî Tarih ve Stratejik Etüt Daire Başkanlığı Yayınları, Ankara, 2017 / 19th Division War Diaries of Gallipoli Campaign, vol.5, (29.6.1915 - 22.7.1915) pp.19-20 Department of Military History and Strategic Studies (ATASE) Press, Ankara, 2017

-Toker, Hülya (2017). Çanakkale Muharebelerine Katılan Komutanların Biyografileri (2’nci Baskı) Genelkurmay Askerî Tarih ve Stratejik Etüt Daire Başkanlığı Yayınları, Ankara / Biographies of the Officers Participated in Gallipoli Campaign (2nd Edition). Department of Military History and Strategic Studies (ATASE) Press, Ankara

 

-https://www.amazon.com/yıllık-harbin-kadrosu-1912-1922-Balkan-Birinci/dp/9751605059

 

-Turkish Ministry of National Defence Gallipoli Rolls

 

 

Edited 4 March , 2019 by emrezmen
Additions

[Jeff Pickerd]

Merhaba Emrez tesekkur ederim,

 

Your reply to my questions is just fantastic, I congratulate you for your depth of research and generosity in sharing this information from the Ottoman archives with us all, I am eternally greatful. There Is now the task ahead of me to correct and add to much of my work on 29/30th June and 7th August, but that is exactly what I was asking for., again my many thanks.

 

regards,

Jeff

[Guest]

Mate,

 

Can I say thanks for the details.

 

The problems with so many men having the same names is a problem with Ottoman records, Mustafa being one of many comman names at that time.

 

Lets start with what I have;

 

"Lt.-Colonel Abdulkadir (b. 1874). He was a Turkish officer from Damascus. Wounded on 13 June, only a day later his regiment took over the trenches, and lost his on 20 June. There are some details in Bean's official history (vol.2 p.308) about his death, but their accuracy is highly doubtful"

 

I agree Bean does not give any names, I don't see this death from wounds as Lt Col Abdulkadir of the 18th Regt?

 

Erickson (Gallipoli the Ottoman Campaign) shows the change of command during Aug 1915 of a Maj Mustafa KIA to LtCol Abdulkadir, so it could not be him?

 

You seam to say the reverse?

 

Possibly it was the Maj Mustafa 18th Regt who took Temp/command who was killed and not the Maj Mustafa from the 15th Regt.

 

Either way why the change over in Ottoman records from a Maj Mustafa KIA to LtCol Abdulkadir shown in Erickson?

 

LtCol Abdulkadir is shown a commander during Sept to Dec 1918 of this Regt so he must not have been killed?

 

I 'll get back to this

 

S.B

Edited 3 March , 2019 by stevebecker

[Guest]

Mate, 

 

Sorry I was called away

 

to continue;

 

"Maj Mustafa Asim Bey 13th Regt KIA 4 May 1915"

 

Yes I show

 

Mustafa Asim Efendi    57th Regt 6Co    Lt    KIA 1915    KIA 1915 from Erzincan
Mustafa Asim Bey    13th Regt -1Bn    Maj    KIA 4-5-15    
 

But if the Maj Mustafa Bey     18th Regt  KIA 9-8-15 is the Maj Mustafa Asin Bey are the one or someone else, its hard to confirm?

 

I also have two Capts called Mustafa killed at Gallipoli.

 

S.B

[emrezmen]

Dear friends, sorry for the late reply. Thanks for your comments. Learning a lot here as a young buff. I'm more than happy to see your interest not only in Allied side of the story, but also in Turkish side.

 

On 04/03/2019 at 01:16, stevebecker said:

Erickson (Gallipoli the Ottoman Campaign) shows the change of command during Aug 1915 of a Maj Mustafa KIA to LtCol Abdulkadir, so it could not be him?

 

You seam to say the reverse?

 

On 04/03/2019 at 01:16, stevebecker said:

Either way why the change over in Ottoman records from a Maj Mustafa KIA to LtCol Abdulkadir shown in Erickson?

  

LtCol Abdulkadir is shown a commander during Sept to Dec 1918 of this Regt so he must not have been killed?

 

Personally I'm a big fan of Erickson's works, but they're not perfect. For example note that Erickson, in his book, didn't show Capt. Kadri, the most known loss at Kiretch Tepe for the Ottoman side, as "KIA". You can find some grave inaccuracies even in Palestine chapter of his amazing book "Ordered to Die." 

 

The 18th Regt Command position changed hands two times in total throughout the campaign. Let me put things in order:

 

From beginning to 13 June: Lt.-Col. Abdulkadir, the original commander, KIA. 

From 13 June to 14 June: Maj. Mustafa, originally OC/1st Bn.

From 14 June to end of the campaign: Maj. Mustafa Rakim, ex-Deputy OC/15th Regt.

 

As I said, Mustafa Rakim survived the war. This is his retirement document dated 1925:

Source: Toker, Hülya (2017). Çanakkale Muharebelerine Katılan Komutanların Biyografileri (2’nci Baskı) Genelkurmay Askerî Tarih ve Stratejik Etüt Daire Başkanlığı Yayınları, Ankara / Biographies of the Officers Participated in Gallipoli Campaign (2nd Edition). Department of Military History and Strategic Studies (ATASE) Press, Ankara

 

On 04/03/2019 at 01:16, stevebecker said:

Possibly it was the Maj Mustafa 18th Regt who took Temp/command who was killed and not the Maj Mustafa from the 15th Regt.

 

Not really. I've also found some details about 1/18th Commander Maj. Mustafa. I just realized that he was the same person with the officer who was appointed to 47th Regt. Command after Ahmet Tevfik's death during the Battle of Lone Pine. He survived Gallipoli, and was sent to Palestine. These details (in Turkish) are from his personel file held in Turkish Ministry of National Defence (MSB) archives:

 

Source: Toker, Hülya (2017). Çanakkale Muharebelerine Katılan Komutanların Biyografileri (2’nci Baskı) Genelkurmay Askerî Tarih ve Stratejik Etüt Daire Başkanlığı Yayınları, Ankara / Biographies of the Officers Participated in Gallipoli Campaign (2nd Edition). Department of Military History and Strategic Studies (ATASE) Press, Ankara

 

Other sources like On Yillik Harbin Kadrosu (The Roster of Ten Years of War) confirm this. He is shown as OC/47th Regt for the period between September-December 1915.

 

I think it is now clear that 18th Regt lost only one CO throughout the campaign and it was Lt.-Col. Abdulkadir. This is his short bio:

Source: Toker, Hülya (2017). Çanakkale Muharebelerine Katılan Komutanların Biyografileri (2’nci Baskı) Genelkurmay Askerî Tarih ve Stratejik Etüt Daire Başkanlığı Yayınları, Ankara / Biographies of the Officers Participated in Gallipoli Campaign (2nd Edition). Department of Military History and Strategic Studies (ATASE) Press, Ankara

 

There are 15 Ottoman regiment COs in total killed at Gallipoli. We have sufficient data about their biographies, places and dates of death etc. We also know where four of them (Mehmet Halit, Yusuf Ziya, Ahmet Tevfik and Hüseyin Avni) were buried . I'm putting the full list here:

 

1- CO/14th Regt. Major Ismail Hakki 
2- CO/15th Regt. Maj. İbrahim Şükrü 
3- CO/16th Regt. Lieutenant-Colonel Hakki
4- CO/17th Regt. Maj. Hüseyin Hilmi 
5- CO/18th Regt. Lt.-Col. Abdulkadir 
6- CO/20th Regt. Lt.-Col. Mehmet Halit 
7- CO/21st Regt. Lt.-Col. Yusuf Ziya 
8- CO/25th Regt. Lt.-Col. Ali Nail 
9- CO/33th Regt. Lt.-Col Ahmet Şevki 
10- CO/39th Regt. Maj. Ali 
11- CO/41st Regt. Lt.-Col. Ahmet Fuat 
12- CO/45th Regt. Lt.-Col Mehmet Refik 
13- CO/47th Regt. Maj. Ahmet Tevfik 
14- CO/55th Regt. Maj. Hasan Tahsin 
15- CO/57th Regt. Lt.-Col. Hüseyin Avni

 

Regards,

Emre

 

 

 

 

[Guest]

Mate,

 

A big thank you again wonderfull details there, nice to clear this up.

 

Mate can you confirm or any details to these men?

 

1- CO/14th Regt. Major Ismail Hakki (i show him as Ismail Hakki (Oktürk)    CO 14th Regt    Maj    KIA 10-8-15 at Suvla or KIA 28-8-15) can you confirm date?
2- CO/15th Regt. Maj. İbrahim Şükrü  (I show  Ibrahim Sukru     CO 15th Regt - 1914 to 8-15    Maj     KIA 7-8-15 at Lone Pine)
3- CO/16th Regt. Lieutenant-Colonel Hakki (I show Ahmet Hakki Bey     CO 16th Regt - 1915 to 8-15    LtCol    KIA 23-8-15)

4- CO/17th Regt. Maj. Hüseyin Hilmi

(I show him as either Hasan Bey     CO 17th Regt - 7-15    LtCol    KIA 11-7-15 at Kerevizdere or Hüseyin Bey     CO 17th Regt - 7-15    Maj    KIA 12-7-15

 

6- CO/20th Regt. Lt.-Col. Mehmet Halit (I show Mehmet Halit Bey    CO 20th Regt - 4-15     Maj    WIA 9-8-15 DoW 11-8-15    from Üsküdar/Istanbul) graduated 1892 Balkan Wars )
7- CO/21st Regt. Lt.-Col. Yusuf Ziya (I show Yusuf Ziya Bey     CO 21st Regt - 1915    LtCol    WIA 9-8-15 DoW 11-8-15)

8- CO/25th Regt. Lt.-Col. Ali Nail (I show Kisiklili Nail Bey     CO 25th Regt - 1915    LtCol    KIA 7-8-15)
9- CO/33th Regt. Lt.-Col Ahmet Şevki (I show Ahmet Sevki Bey     CO 33rd Regt    LtCol    KIA 29-4-15)

10- CO/39th Regt. Maj. Ali (I show the only commander as Nur el Din Bey     CO 39th Regt - 1914     LtCol but he was not killed?)

11- CO/41st Regt. Lt.-Col. Ahmet Fuat

(I show him as either Fuat Bey    CO 41st Regt - 1915    LtCol    KIA 13-9-15    reported killed at Gallipoli or Ibrahim Fuad Bey     41st Regt -    LtCol    KIA 13-9-15    LtCol Ibrahim oglu Fuad Bey KIA

12- CO/45th Regt. Lt.-Col Mehmet Refik (I show Mehmet Refik Bey    CO 45th Regt -     LtCol    KIA 6-6-15 )

13- CO/47th Regt. Maj. Ahmet Tevfik (I show Tevfik Bey     CO 47th Regt -    Maj    KIA 7-8-15 at Lone Pine possibly Maj Ahmet Tevfik Bey KIA 21-7-15 at Gallipoli)
14- CO/55th Regt. Maj. Hasan Tahsin (I show the only commander as Abderhaman Bey    55th Regt    LtCol and Tevfik Bey    55th Regt 1916     Maj to LtCol) can you confirm details?
15- CO/57th Regt. Lt.-Col. Hüseyin Avni (I show Hüseyin Avni Bey (Ariburnu)     CO 57th Regt - 4-15     Maj or LtCol    KIA 13-8-15    born in Manastir date?  Ali oglu Hüseyin Avni Bey KIA 13-8-15 at Gallipoli born at Manastir/Bitola Macedonia post war family name "Ariburun"
 

The 57th Regt shows a number of deaths of possibly Commanders?

 

Mehmet Emin Bey     57th Regt    Maj    KIA 1915    from Mersin

Ömer Fevzi Bey    57th Regt    Maj    KIA 1915 from Isparta
Hamli Bey     57th Regt -     Maj    KIA 13-8-15    (not infentified)? possibly Hüseyin Avni Bey (Ariburnu) 
Sevki Bey     57th Regt    LtCol    KIA 1915 from Elbistan

Also other commanders I have like possibly some of these are Bn commanders and not Regt commanders?;

 

Ali Rifat Bey    14th Regt - 4-14 to 8-15     LtCol    KIA 10-8-15 at Suvla 
Mohamed Muhtar Bey or Mehmet Muhtar Bey    142nd Regt -     LtCol    KIA 22-12-15
Vedat Bey    Fire Regt    Maj    KIA 13-4-15

Cheers

 

S.B


 

 

Edited 8 March , 2019 by stevebecker

[gilly100]

The 18th Regt attack across The Nek on 29/30 June 1915 seems to have been a heavy attack that was knocked back with great loss to the Ottoman forces.

I have from 9th Light Horse - 1 KIA and 8 WIA and 8th Light Horse - 6 KIA and 12 WIA as a result of this attack.

7 Ottoman POW's taken with a reported 54 dead, and later 255 bodies counted, although I don't know how this latter figure was arrived at.

 

It would be the 8th and 10th Light Horse that would, only little more than 5 weeks later, receive similar in their ill fated charge.

How you doing Jeff and Steve? Still plugging away I see!

Ian

[emrezmen]

Sorry for late reply again, Steve. It's a little bit off topic but I've tried my best.

 

On 08/03/2019 at 03:05, stevebecker said:

1- CO/14th Regt. Major Ismail Hakki (i show him as Ismail Hakki (Oktürk)    CO 14th Regt    Maj    KIA 10-8-15 at Suvla or KIA 28-8-15) can you confirm date?

10 August is accurate. According to "On Yillik Harbin Kadrosu" (https://www.amazon.com/yıllık-harbin-kadrosu-1912-1922-Balkan-Birinci/dp/9751605059) he was KIA only two days after taking over the command of the regiment. 

 

On 08/03/2019 at 03:05, stevebecker said:

3- CO/16th Regt. Lieutenant-Colonel Hakki (I show Ahmet Hakki Bey     CO 16th Regt - 1915 to 8-15    LtCol    KIA 23-8-15)

 

Yes, the full name is Ahmet Hakki. Death date is actually 24 August 1915 according to his personal file and MSB rolls.

 

A pre-war photograph of him:

 

On 08/03/2019 at 03:05, stevebecker said:

4- CO/17th Regt. Maj. Hüseyin Hilmi

 (I show him as either Hasan Bey     CO 17th Regt - 7-15    LtCol    KIA 11-7-15 at Kerevizdere or Hüseyin Bey     CO 17th Regt - 7-15    Maj    KIA 12-7-15

Not Hasan. This is a common bum steer and related to a ridiculous myth which will take so much time to tell atm. It was Major Hüseyin Hilmi. KIA on 12 July during the Second Battle of Kerevizdere (5e combat du Kérévés Déré or Action of Achi Baba Nullah). Here is a war-time photo of him:

 

On 08/03/2019 at 03:05, stevebecker said:

10- CO/39th Regt. Maj. Ali (I show the only commander as Nur el Din Bey     CO 39th Regt - 1914     LtCol but he was not killed?)

 

Well, I'm a little bit confused with this. According to Burhan Sayilir (in this book https://www.amazon.com/Tarihe-Sigmayanlar-Burhan-Sayilir/dp/9944931535) Major Ali was the commander of 39th and KIA on 26 April. I was able to find his name in MSB records indeed, but interesting enough there is nothing about his unit. Only "1" written in "company" section. He was a major, and it's not usual for a major to command a company in Ottoman army.

Sayilir's info is highly doubtful here because it is certain that Maj. Hüseyin Nurettin was the commander of the regiment from the beginning. Then, obviously it was a mistake to include Maj. Ali in the list. He was probably temporary commander of the regiment for some time and KIA on 26 April. Further research needed. I apologize and update the total number as 14 for now.

 

So you're right, it was Lt-Col. Nurettin (Hüseyin Nurettin Özsu - below is a photo of him in his later years), but he wasn't KIA. 

 

 

On 08/03/2019 at 03:05, stevebecker said:

11- CO/41st Regt. Lt.-Col. Ahmet Fuat

(I show him as either Fuat Bey    CO 41st Regt - 1915    LtCol    KIA 13-9-15    reported killed at Gallipoli or Ibrahim Fuad Bey     41st Regt -    LtCol    KIA 13-9-15    LtCol Ibrahim oglu Fuad Bey KIA

Ibrahim oglu Ahmet Fuat Bey. According to my sources (Biographies of Officers Participated in Gallipoli Campaign, p.177 + https://www.amazon.com/42nd-Regiment-Gallipoli-Ahmet-Diriker/dp/177532530X) he was killed by a bullet in the head at Şüheda Tepe (just north of Ravin de la Mort) while observing a newly dug French sap on 14 Sept. 1915. The gully to the  north of Ravin de la Mort named after him as "Fuatbey Dere". Here is a photo of him (from Harp Mecmuasi/Ottoman War Magazine):

 

 

On 08/03/2019 at 03:05, stevebecker said:

13- CO/47th Regt. Maj. Ahmet Tevfik (I show Tevfik Bey     CO 47th Regt -    Maj    KIA 7-8-15 at Lone Pine possibly Maj Ahmet Tevfik Bey KIA 21-7-15 at Gallipoli)

Major Ahmet Tevfik (b.?) was KIA on 7 Aug. 1915, the second day of Battle of Lone Pine. His grave is somewhere around southeastern corner of Lone Pine Cemetery. See Turkish Ministry of National Defence (MSB) record below:

 

 

A pre-war photo of him:

 

On 08/03/2019 at 03:05, stevebecker said:

14- CO/55th Regt. Maj. Hasan Tahsin (I show the only commander as Abderhaman Bey    55th Regt    LtCol and Tevfik Bey    55th Regt 1916     Maj to LtCol) can you confirm details?

Major Hasan Tahsin (b.1872) was KIA on 21 Aug. 1915 near Gaziler Tepesi which is located around 500 m norheast of Quadrilateral (just north of İl Dere). See his MSB record:

 

 

On 08/03/2019 at 03:05, stevebecker said:

15- CO/57th Regt. Lt.-Col. Hüseyin Avni (I show Hüseyin Avni Bey (Ariburnu)     CO 57th Regt - 4-15     Maj or LtCol    KIA 13-8-15    born in Manastir date?  Ali oglu Hüseyin Avni Bey KIA 13-8-15 at Gallipoli born at Manastir/Bitola Macedonia post war family name "Ariburun"

Born in 1871 according to information written on his grave.

 

On 08/03/2019 at 03:05, stevebecker said:

Mehmet Emin Bey     57th Regt    Maj    KIA 1915    from Mersin

Ömer Fevzi Bey    57th Regt    Maj    KIA 1915 from Isparta
Hamli Bey     57th Regt -     Maj    KIA 13-8-15    (not infentified)? possibly Hüseyin Avni Bey (Ariburnu) 
Sevki Bey     57th Regt    LtCol    KIA 1915 from Elbistan

Mehmet Emin was to be commander of the regiment in Palestine. So wasn't killed at Gallipoli.

 

Ömer Fevzi became OC/1st Bn after Maj. Ahmet Zeki (guide of C.E.W. Bean in 1919) assumed command of 21st Regt on 12-13 August. He wasn't KIA. There is only one "Ömer Fevzi" in MSB records. A lieutenant from 25th Regt:

 

This is from Burhan Sayilir's book (again) "57. Alay".

 

It it must be Hüseyin Avni Bey since there is no such name as "Hamli" in Turkish.

 

And Lt.Col. Sevki Bey was CO of 33rd Regt. KIA on 29 April 1915 at Legge Valley/Karayörük Deresi. He's seen in the middle in this pre-war photo. On the left, OC/1st Bn. Maj. Ali Faik, KIA on 30 April, only 1 day after Sevki.

 

As a sad detail, Ali Faik's brother Lt. Mehmet Fevzi from 77th Regt, 1st Bn, 2nd Coy also killed only 5 days later.

 

 

On 08/03/2019 at 03:05, stevebecker said:

Also other commanders I have like possibly some of these are Bn commanders and not Regt commanders?;

 

Ali Rifat Bey    14th Regt - 4-14 to 8-15     LtCol    KIA 10-8-15 at Suvla 
Mohamed Muhtar Bey or Mehmet Muhtar Bey    142nd Regt -     LtCol    KIA 22-12-15
Vedat Bey    Fire Regt    Maj    KIA 13-4-15

Lt-Col. Ali Rifat was not killed, but dismissed from command on 8 Aug. His successor Maj. Ismail Hakki was to be KIA in two days (see above).

 

I found only Senior Capt. Ahmet Muhtar. Commander of 6th Coy/25th Regt. 142nd Regt was not at Gallipoli.  

Fire Regt was at Gallipoli, but I can found only one Vedat in the records and he's not an officer. See:

 

 

 

Edited 17 March , 2019 by emrezmen
Additional information

[Guest]

Mate,

 

Thank you again.

 

39th Regt I show these officers with that Regt;

 

39th Regt - Nur el Din Bey 1914 (shown Erickson)  LtCol Hüseyin Nurettin (Özsu) 4-15 (shown Erickson) Maj Kazim Bey 5-15 & (shown Erickson)  LtCol Hüseyin Nurettin (Özsu)  7-15 to Maj Kamil Bey date of command unknown (PoW 4-8-16)

 

3Bn/39th Regt - Maj Sevket Bey

Bn/39th Regt- Maj Ihsan Bey 

3Bn/?Co -Capt Sükrü Fuat Effendi    

 

As to where Maj Ali fits into this I can't find, but as he was killed during the Kum Kale fighting I could not find any others there at that time.

 

The gap in command for LtCol Hüseyin Nurettin (Özsu) between May 1915 is unknown, Maj Kazim must have been the 2ic or a Bn commander to be T/Commander during May and June 1915

 

My history on this man is limited 

 

Hüseyin Nurettin (Özsu)     CO 39th Regt - (shown Erickson 4-15 rtn 7-15 and CO 17th Regt between 9 to 12-15 at Gallipoli) to CO 31st Regt 9-16 to CO 3rd Div 3-17 to 3-18 to CO Amman Div

 

born 1879 in Istanbul died June 9, 1937) AKA Hussein Nureddin 1312-P. 256 or 1313-P.256 Graduated 1898 to Maj 1911 Turco-Italian War of 1911-12 & Balkan Wars to LtCol 1914 to Col 1917 & War of Independence 7th Div & 17th Div to Maj Gen 1922 

 

I had thought he replaced Hüseyin Hilmi Bey 17th Regt after his death 12-7-15, but Erickson doesn't show that move till Sept 1915?

 

Cheers

 

S.B
 

 

Edited 18 March , 2019 by stevebecker