Is there a monument to the animals who died?

[Marilyne]

19 hours ago, Hedley Malloch said:

Horses and pigeons are well covered memory-wise. But sadly there are no memorials to the elephants conscripted onto the Western Front.

 

ELEPHANTS on the Western Front???

Tell me more!!!!!!

 

My Bataillon's insignia is the elephant, originally of the 4th Bn Heavy Transport!

 

 

17 hours ago, DavidOwen said:

The purple poppy is actually a purple cornflower but often referred to as the former. Be careful as the originator's agenda has seriously morphed away from the original concept. A certain online auction site does have examples for sale which do support the original ideals and help wildlife charities into the bargain.

 

Thanks for the warning, I'll pass it on to Lil' Sis!!

 

M.

[Guest Ricard 51]

Surely the animal memorial at Pozières is simply a stunning example of touchy feely emotional incontinence. It's so appallingly awful that even the local gipsies will not go near it!  Bonsoir a 

tous.

[kenf48]

11 hours ago, Marilyne said:

ELEPHANTS on the Western Front???

Tell me more!!!!!!

 

My Bataillon's insignia is the elephant, originally of the 4th Bn Heavy Transport!

 

 

M.

 

The photograph above is probably this elephant Although working in France it's something of an enigma but is believed to have been given to the German Army by a circus owner to assist in the war effort.  It was known they were very sensitive to artillery fire therefore this animal was kept well behind the lines as the pictures demonstrate. The British used  an elephant named Lizzie, from a similar source on the home front https://www.sheffield.ac.uk/nfca/researchandarticles/lizzieelephant

and here, again being used instead of horses

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Z3_nIY85P4

Newsworthy in a human interest, away from the war, kind of way there was no real effective or organised deployment.  (Going even further off topic arguably the most effective use of elephants in war in the twentieth century was in the Burma Campaign in WW2).

 

Ken

[Marilyne]

Great info!!

Thanks a lot!!

 

M.

[BIFFO]

One to tunnelrs deffo  mice and presumably canaries Scottish war memorial Edingbro castle 

[Dever Mayfly]

Is ther something with the Army Remount Service as well? Over 20,000 soldiers looked after the horses, mules and other beast of burden.  It would make sense if they were commemorated together, but I don't know where this might be.

[Dragon]

Here is one to the Alaskan dogs who worked in the Vosges. This is at Breitfirst (1280m) near Joffre’s Route des Crêtes and is dedicated to the 1ère and 2e SECA (sections d’équipages canins d’Alaska) who were stationed in kennels at le Tanet and Breitfirst. They carried supplies to the soldiers and evacuated the wounded in very challenging conditions.

I think it looks a bit uncoordinated, but I admire the sentiment.

 

Gwyn

 

 

 

 

[Ghazala]

Chipilly on The Somme

[Guest Ricard 51]

Just maybe those behind the awful memorial at Pozières to the creatures that perished in conflict will consider the countless millions of lice so cruelly burnt at the end of a lighted cigarette or squeezed to death so brutally between the fingernails of some poor long suffering Tommy!.On verra. Bonne nuit à tous.

[nigelcave]

Yes, but - it is a divisional memorial really (58th [London] Division) principally, though it incorporated a water trough for horses (which is now gone) and has a plaque commemorating the various other nationalities involved in the 8th August attack, viz French and the Canadian and Australian Corps. Someone might know if that was a later addition. A similar, but much less fancy, horse trough memorial is to be found in Le Cateau (66th [East Lancs] Division), now repurposed for flowers.

 

 

Edited 16 February , 2019 by nigelcave

[nigelcave]

On 11/02/2019 at 17:00, Michael Thomson said:

On a side note, am I correct in saying that the only cavalry charge of the First Battle of the Somme was undertaken by an Indian unit in an attack on High Wood? 

So far as I know, yes. On the other hand there was another one on the Somme in 1918.

[AOK4]

All there is to know about "feldgraue Jenny", as the elephant was known: https://www.flickr.com/photos/48587537@N07/13899157624/in/photostream/

 

Jan

[Marilyne]

On 14/02/2019 at 17:17, Dragon said:

Here is one to the Alaskan dogs who worked in the Vosges. This is at Breitfirst (1280m) near Joffre’s Route des Crêtes and is dedicated to the 1ère and 2e SECA (sections d’équipages canins d’Alaska) who were stationed in kennels at le Tanet and Breitfirst. They carried supplies to the soldiers and evacuated the wounded in very challenging conditions.

I think it looks a bit uncoordinated, but I admire the sentiment.

 

Gwyn

 

 

GREAT INFO !! 

 

Just learned something!! 

Did not know that section existed. 

 

M.

[Steven Broomfield]

On 14/02/2019 at 23:23, nigelcave said:

 A similar, but much less fancy, horse trough memorial is to be found in Le Cateau (66th [East Lancs] Division), now repurposed for flowers.

 

 

 

There's one in Winchester, Hants, too, but in memory of the horses of the South African campaig, 1899-1902. It, too, is now a flower bed but looking rather unloved, with a fin collection of weeds round it.

[Michael Thomson]

Thanks everyone for the fascinating replies. The use of elephants is very interesting and I can believe that they would have needed to be kept far back from the front lines.

 

From the little that I know about elephants (mostly African elephants though I believe Asian elephants are similar), these animals are extremely sensitive to sounds and vibration so artillery fire would probably terrify them. 

 

 

[NigelS]

On 14/02/2019 at 23:23, nigelcave said:

 A similar, but much less fancy, horse trough memorial is to be found in Le Cateau (66th [East Lancs] Division), now repurposed for flowers.

 

 

 

50 minutes ago, Steven Broomfield said:

 

There's one in Winchester, Hants, too, but in memory of the horses of the South African campaig, 1899-1902. It, too, is now a flower bed but looking rather unloved, with a fin collection of weeds round it.

 

There's also one commemorating Great War  horses & dogs  at Lake on the Isle of Wight which, as it carries the dedication: 'BE YE MERCIFUL - TO THE HORSES AND DOGS WHO ALSO BORE THE BURDEN AND HEAT OF THE DAY 1914 - 1920', thoughtfully allows for post Armistice service.  IWM War Memorials Register: https://www.iwm.org.uk/memorials/item/memorial/21808 (Using the 'Animal Memorials' link against 'Commemoration' under 'Memorial Details' in this record finds other  Animal memorials in the UK, both pre and post the Great War including one located in Birmingham to the memory of: 'JACKO A MONKEY KILLED WITH FRIGHT CAUSED BY A ZEP THAT CAME OVER ONE NIGHT 1917.' previously discussed in the  'Monkey died in air raid'  thread, to which I'll add the details)

 

NigelS

[Hedley Malloch]

On 14/02/2019 at 00:06, kenf48 said:

 

The photograph above is probably this elephant Although working in France it's something of an enigma but is believed to have been given to the German Army by a circus owner to assist in the war effort.  It was known they were very sensitive to artillery fire therefore this animal was kept well behind the lines as the pictures demonstrate. The British used  an elephant named Lizzie, from a similar source on the home front https://www.sheffield.ac.uk/nfca/researchandarticles/lizzieelephant

and here, again being used instead of horses

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Z3_nIY85P4

Newsworthy in a human interest, away from the war, kind of way there was no real effective or organised deployment.  (Going even further off topic arguably the most effective use of elephants in war in the twentieth century was in the Burma Campaign in WW2).

 

Ken

There were at least two elephants conscripted by the Germans into service on the Western Front, Nelly from The Hagenback circus in Hamburg, and Jenny from the zoo in the same city. They were used in forests around Avesnes-sur-Helpe clearing the timber and in farming. They formed part of a parade through that town on the occasion of the Kaiser’s birthday in 1915 passing in front of the astonished French citizens. Their use is a good sign of the extent to which the Germans were forced to improvise following the failure of the Schlieffen Plan.

The Germans used them throughout the war and left them behind when they retreated in 1918. They were retired to a zoo in Paris where they continued to live until the 1930s.

History has not recorded whether or not Nelly first packed her trunks before she said goodbye to the circus.

 

Edited 16 February , 2019 by Hedley Malloch

[kenf48]

Well as we’ve strayed from the OP to memorials to the animals in the UK we should perhaps mention what is believed to be the first at St Judes Hampstead.  The inscription on the bronze plaque is especially poignant.

http://stjudeonthehill.com/the-war-horse-memorial/

 

Ken

 

[Marilyne]

Coming back to the matter of the huskies on the Vosges... I realized there is a graphic novel series on them. The project was top secret and it's only due to the tenacity of their descendants in researching the archives that they managed to filter out the complete series.

There has also been a documentary film on ARTE in  2012: "Nom de Code: Poilus d'Alaska"

Looking for the novels and I'll tell you all about it!

 

 

 

M.

[Dragon]

Thanks for that. There is an article in Les Saisons d'Alsace, # 58, September 2013,  called Poilus d'Alaska and I do have a couple of other articles but I can't remember where I've put them.

 

I walked up le Tanet (where some of the dogs were kennelled) last September. It's known for its bleakness and the exposure to winds. The vestiges of the French observatory remain. The second view looks across to Reichackerkopf.

 

Gwyn