GordonW Posted 31 January , 2019 Share Posted 31 January , 2019 My friend has inherited a portrait of an ancestor and is trying to find out some facts, see attached portrait. Can anyone suggest what regiment he would have served in, possible rank? He was from a family which could afford a portrait to be painted. Family names could be either Saunders-Davies, or Prioleau. Many thanks, Gordon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Michelle Young Posted 31 January , 2019 Admin Share Posted 31 January , 2019 Black buttons and the cap badge suggests Rifle Brigade but I will wait for confirmation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CountryJohn Posted 31 January , 2019 Share Posted 31 January , 2019 Rifle Brigade cap badge for comparison CJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Michelle Young Posted 31 January , 2019 Admin Share Posted 31 January , 2019 There is a Prioleau on CWGC, Norfolks. That isn't a Norfolks badge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil 2242 Posted 31 January , 2019 Share Posted 31 January , 2019 Robert Ulrick Hamilton Prioleau? MIC confirms he was awarded the MC. Might help date the portrait if indeed it is him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stiletto_33853 Posted 31 January , 2019 Share Posted 31 January , 2019 (edited) Robert Ulick Hamilton Prioleau born 4 April 1892, educated Eton. 2nd Lieut. from Special Reserve 4/12/1912; Lieut. 16/11/1914;T/Capt. 5/1/1915, Captain 25/10/1915; T/Major 21/6/1916, A/Lt.-Col. 3/5/1917. Retired 1920. 1st Rifle Brigade 1912-14, Adjutant 12th Rifle Brigade, France 1914-16. Commanded a Service battalion of the Kings Royal Rifle Corps in France 1917-18. MC 1917, London Gazette, 1/1/1917 so New Years Honour List. Mentioned in Despatches. Died Newtonbarry, County Wexford 30/5/1955. Over to Mark for the KRRC battalion he commanded. Andy Edited 31 January , 2019 by stiletto_33853 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MBrockway Posted 31 January , 2019 Share Posted 31 January , 2019 (edited) Either Rifle Brigade or one the TF battalions that used the RB cap badge (various London Regiment, Leeds Rifle, Robin Hood Rifles etc.). All have minor differences from the regimental version, but none are likely to show up at the resolution of this painting. Looks like a green/black lanyard too, which is also compatible with RB. Bear in mind the portrait may not be Great War, though I'd saythis is most likely. Andy will no doubt advise whether Saunders-Davies or Prioleau are known to him as being RB. [Edit: aha - he just has! ] Mark Edited 31 January , 2019 by MBrockway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stiletto_33853 Posted 31 January , 2019 Share Posted 31 January , 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MBrockway Posted 31 January , 2019 Share Posted 31 January , 2019 (edited) 59 minutes ago, stiletto_33853 said: Robert Ulrick Prioleau born 4 April 1892, educated Eton. 2nd Lieut. from Special Reserve 4/12/1912; Lieut. 16/11/1914;T/Capt. 5/1/1915, Captain 25/10/1915; T/Major 21/6/1916, A/Lt.-Col. 3/5/1917. Retired 1920. 1st Rifle Brigade 1912-14, Adjutant 12th Rifle Brigade, France 1914-16. Commanded a Service battalion of the Kings Royal Rifle Corps in France 1917-18. MC 1917, London Gazette, 1/1/1917 so New Years Honour List. Mentioned in Despatches. Died Newtonbarry, County Wexford 30/5/1955. Over to Mark for the KRRC battalion he commanded. Andy The shame - caught being lazy when I knew the name was familiar Prioleau commanded 12/KRRC, my grandfather's original battalion! He was wounded by machine gun fire at the Battle of Langemarck on 16 Aug 1917. The battalion were reorganising at the First Objective about 3-400 yds short of LANGEMARCK, a little to the east of the AU BON GITE pillbox complex. This was immediately before the Sjt Cooper VC action. I'll get back shortly with some dates when he took command etc. Mark Edited 31 January , 2019 by MBrockway Wounded by MG not shell fire. Date corrected from WD data. Typo in Chronicle account corrected (3,400yds to 3-400yds!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stiletto_33853 Posted 31 January , 2019 Share Posted 31 January , 2019 (edited) Invalided out of the 12th RB sick 27/9/16, going overseas with the battalion. Last entry on this cropped sheet. Andy Edited 31 January , 2019 by stiletto_33853 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MBrockway Posted 31 January , 2019 Share Posted 31 January , 2019 Major Prioleau took command of 12/KRRC on 19 Apr 1917. He was confirmed in his appointment as acting Lt.-Col. on 12 May. The battalion's original commander Lt.-Col. A.I. Paine, CMG, DSO, took command on 02 Jul 1917, having been absent since the end of August 1916, however his stint was short (no explanation given in Bn war diary) and Prioleau once again resumed command on 23 Jul 1917. He was wounded 16 Aug 1917 at the Battle of Langemarck during very heavy machine gun fire while the battalion's attack was paused at the BLUE LINE approx 3-400yds short of LANGEMARCK. They were just reorganising before continuing the advance. The Adjutant, Capt T. Lycett, took over command,.then on 19 Aug, Major D. Gardiner, MC, took command. Here's the man's signature ... Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 31 January , 2019 Share Posted 31 January , 2019 I wonder whether his long illness before passing was connected with his wounding at Langemarck or his earlier invalidity as “sick”. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaySearching Posted 31 January , 2019 Share Posted 31 January , 2019 Irish Times 2nd June 1955 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MBrockway Posted 31 January , 2019 Share Posted 31 January , 2019 (edited) 28 minutes ago, FROGSMILE said: I wonder whether his long illness before passing was connected with his wounding at Langemarck or his earlier invalidity as “sick”. I'd say probably not ... [Edit: misread your post Frogsmile!! I had taken it that incomplete recovery from his earlier Blighty from 12/RB before joining 12/KRRC had been connected to his wounding! Not his final illness before his death in 1955 - my bad! Mk] The battalion was crossing flat ground with no cover and came under very heavy machine gun fire from many directions, some from the various concrete blockhouses including AU BON GITE (see the various Langemarck topics for maps and photos of same). Shortly after Prioleau was wounded, one of these blockhouses was captured by Sjt Cooper along with 40+ prisoners and seven machine guns. For this action Cooper was awarded the VC. This took place between 04:45hrs and 05:45hrs - dawn, but well before sunrise. They had crossed the STEENBEEK and advanced about 750yds to reach the BLUE LINE. The war diary states "we ... suffered many casualties to both Officers and men," This included two further officers killed, two officers wounded, and approx 100 casualties in the ranks. Mark Edited 31 January , 2019 by MBrockway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clk Posted 31 January , 2019 Share Posted 31 January , 2019 Hi Gordon, 9 minutes ago, stiletto_33853 said: Invalided out of the 12th RB sick 27/9/16 A possible (somewhat left up in the air) explanation, an MH 106 record which appears to read... First name: R Last name: Prioleau Age: 24 Rank: Major Regiment: Rifle Brigade Battalion: 12th Completed years of service: 6 Completed years of service in the command: 1 year, 3 months Admitted: Queen Alexandra's Military Hospital At Millbank Ailment: PUO [Pyrexia of Unknown Origin] Admission date: 28 Sep 1916 Days under treatment: 2 Discharge date: 29 Sep 1916 Transferred to: Goldsmid Hospital HIs MC index card... Image source: The National Archives: file WO 389/20 He appears to have had the admin number of P/60404 Image source: The National Archives - file WO 338/15/13 Which would appear to make him this man in an index of files held by the MoD. Regards Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FROGSMILE Posted 31 January , 2019 Share Posted 31 January , 2019 Pyrexia? Perhaps he had a bout of so-called 'Trench Fever', but I guess we will never know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Posted 31 January , 2019 Share Posted 31 January , 2019 3 hours ago, stiletto_33853 said: Edit typo: "...was the son of W.L.S.Prioleau of Pen y Lan, Boncath, S.Wales." Note to editors: Pen y Lan is a mansion variously described as being in the parishes of Llechryd or Llandygwydd in Ceredigion /Cardiganshire. Such places often used a suffix to their addresses - RSO (Railway Sorting Office). Even though Boncath is in Pembrokeshire, and not even the closest railway station, addresses in South Ceredigion often are suffixed by Boncath (plus or minus RSO). And then Boncath is mis-spelt! W.L.St.J. Prioleau appears to have been a career failed Conservative candidate in several general elections in the late 19th and early 20th century. I have found him in East Norfolk on a couple of occasions. Can't get much further away from Boncath... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stiletto_33853 Posted 31 January , 2019 Share Posted 31 January , 2019 (edited) Taken directly from the Rifle Brigade Chronicle of 1955. Sorry if the niceties of the Welsh addressing is incorrect, but hey, they had his papers. Andy Edited 1 February , 2019 by stiletto_33853 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clk Posted 31 January , 2019 Share Posted 31 January , 2019 (edited) Hi, I often get things wrong, but I don't quite understand. 4 hours ago, stiletto_33853 said: Invalided out of the 12th RB sick 27/9/16 4 hours ago, MBrockway said: Major Prioleau took command of 12/KRRC on 19 Apr 1917. 4 hours ago, MBrockway said: He was wounded 16 Aug 1917 at the Battle of Langemarck Does the evidence point towards that he was "invalided out", but subsequently returned? Regards Chris Edited 31 January , 2019 by clk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stiletto_33853 Posted 1 February , 2019 Share Posted 1 February , 2019 (edited) Looks that Way Chris, left the 12th RB 27/9/16 turns up commanding the 12th KRRC the following April. No mention of being invalided out of the Army, just invalided to the UK sick from the battalion. Edited 1 February , 2019 by stiletto_33853 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stiletto_33853 Posted 1 February , 2019 Share Posted 1 February , 2019 Recommended into the Regiment by Fortescue and Biddulph, two fine recommendations. Army Book 26 Nominal Roll and Candidates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MBrockway Posted 1 February , 2019 Share Posted 1 February , 2019 37 minutes ago, stiletto_33853 said: Looks that Way Chris, left the 12th RB 27/9/16 turns up commanding the 12th KRRC the following April. No mention of being invalided out of the Army, just invalided to the UK sick from the battalion. That's exactly how I read it too. Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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