Private John W Ellis (1st battalion Hertfordshire Regiment, 1837)

[Bingoid]

Hi. A work colleague has brought in his grandfather's WW1 medals (as he knows i'm interested in such things) hoping I could help him with research. Unfortunately, I haven't been able to find very much, bar finding 2x medal index cards on the IWM Lives of the First World War website. I was hoping one of you lovely people might be able to help more? The medals are a set of three that include a 1914 clasp and are for a Private J (he told me 'John'), W, Ellis of the 1st battalion Hertfordshire Regiment, service number 1837. The IWM has mis-transcribed his initials as T W Ellis. The linked medal card I found shows a second service number of 265162 for the Bedfordshire and Hertfordshire Regiment. All my work colleague knows is that his grandfather stayed in after the war, was a drum major and died around the early 1970's in Hertford. He recalls a family member saying that he might have been gassed. If anyone can find anything else apart from his medal cards that gives more info on his service, or can identify his middle initial, that would be much appreciated? Thanks

[jonbem]

Medal roll on Ancestry says

Name:T W Ellis

Military Year:1914

Rank:Private

Medal Awarded:1914 Star

Regiment or Corps:Hertfordshire Regiment

Regimental Number:1837

Sub Unit:1/1st Battalion

 

but for BWM & VM

Name:John William Ellis

Military Year:1914-1920

Rank:Private

Medal Awarded:British War Medal and Victory Medal

Regiment or Corps:Bedfordshire and Hertfordshire Regiment

Regimental Number:265162

Sub Unit:(T.F.)

Previous Units:1st Herts. 1837 Pte.

Edited 10 January , 2019 by jonbem

[PRC]

The County of Hertfordshire didn’t run to a Regular Army Battalion, so the 1st Battalion, Hertfordshire Regiment was a Territorial Force unit affiliated with the Bedfordshire Regiment. Mobilised for home defence on the outbreak of war, the men were then given the option to volunteer for overseas service. Those that didn’t taken this option were filtered out into a second line unit to cover home defence and as a training unit for those waiting to serve overseas.

 

Hence the unit going overseas became the 1st/1st. topped up by volunteers with previous military experience, and that staying at home the newly formed 2nd/1st.

 

See https://www.longlongtrail.co.uk/army/regiments-and-corps/the-british-infantry-regiments-of-1914-1918/hertfordshire-regiment/

 

The 1st/1st landed in France on the 6th November 1914. The Medal Index Card for T.W. Ellis, 1837 Hertfordshire Regiment shows actually he landed in France on that day, so unless that’s a coincidence sounds like he went out from Day 1. This would make it likely that he was either a pre-war Territorial or a time-expired Reservist who had volunteered. Men being trained from scratch seldom got out there so quickly.

 

The Battalions War Diary has been transcribed and can be read here.

http://bedfordregiment.org.uk/Hertsrgt/hertsrgt.html

 

He qualified for the 1914 Star along with the 1915 clasp for this early part of his service.

 

If you know the areas he has connections to, I’d always suggest try the local papers. It can be a bit of a needle in a haystack but it can turn up some real gold nuggets, particularly if a man was well known in an area or had extensive family. Local County Archive will normally hold copies although usually what you can get your hands on is a micro-filmed copy. Otherwise most genealogy sites have access to online newspaper archives, either as a bolt on or as part of a premium subscription. Usually they are providing a back-door link to the British Newspaper Archive which can you subscribe to directly. However, if you are in the UK and a Library member you can normally access the British Newspaper Archive onsite for free. Given the appalling automated transcription I’d recommend try the Library access first.

 

BTW - if he stayed in after the war for any length of time his records may still be held at the Ministry of Defence. There are some threads here with lists of records held and how to access them - see

If his service records don’t appear to have survived there, and you have the time and patience, it can be a worthwhile exercise to try and track down the men with service numbers nearby to get some idea of when he might have enlisted and the early war time path he might have followed. If the Medal Rolls in Ancestry are in service number order then that’s relatively simple, otherwise it’s a tick and bash job.

 

Hope that helps,

 

Peter

[Neil 2242]

He appears in a casualty list, admitted 11 General Hospital Boulogne, 17 Feb 1915

 

 

[Bingoid]

thanks so much to those that have responded. Your knowledge never ceases to amaze me!

[jimweal]

Sorry to jump in on this thread, but if anyone has access to 11 General Hospital Boulogne casualty lists (Neil?), could they please see if there is any information concerning a Thomas Edward Weal (8484  2nd Essex), who was wounded at Ploegsteert on 21,10.1914, and died in 11 General on 21.11.1914, a month later!.  Obviously admitted some time in between, but I don't know when, or suffering with what sort of injuries.  Love to know more.  Also, are there any pictures of the Imperial Hotel?  (11 General, I think?)  Would be much appreciated.

Jim Weal.

[PRC]

Jim,

 

Suggest you ask a Mod to move this into a thread in it's own right. Neil hasn't visited the forum since February 2019, so you may have more luck  with getting a response if it's a standalone enquiry.

 

Cheers,

Peter