Steve1871 Posted 10 January , 2019 Share Posted 10 January , 2019 What is 11.P.5.111. I can not make letters and numbers different sizes, sorry, I know "P" is pioneer, would the 111 be the company or rack number? Thanks this on a 65/71 PFM scabbard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 10 January , 2019 Share Posted 10 January , 2019 (edited) 18 minutes ago, Steve1871 said: What is 11.P.5.111. I can not make letters and numbers different sizes, sorry, I know "P" is pioneer, would the 111 be the company or rack number? Thanks this on a 65/71 PFM scabbard Should be the weapon number. You mean that all numbers and letters are the same size? Edited 10 January , 2019 by trajan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve1871 Posted 10 January , 2019 Author Share Posted 10 January , 2019 No, sorry,my typing- all letters and numbers same size, do not no how make them different size on my phone as I type Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shippingsteel Posted 10 January , 2019 Share Posted 10 January , 2019 2 hours ago, Steve1871 said: What is 11.P.5.111. I can not make letters and numbers different sizes, sorry, I know "P" is pioneer, would the 111 be the company or rack number? 11 = Regiment, Unit or Battalion Number as the case may be P = Unit Type as the case may be ... in this case it is Pionier-Bataillon 5 = Usually Company number ... depends once again on unit type 111 = Weapon Number So that string would read Pionier-Bataillon Nr.11 , 5th Kompagnie , Waffe Nr.111 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 10 January , 2019 Share Posted 10 January , 2019 Thank you SS for your contribution! Steve, as I understand it, but others might correct me (and they will if I am incorrect!), before August 1914, each Pionier Batallion had three companies only. When mobilised with their reserves called up for service each batallion was divided (in effect) to form 2 sub-batallions of three companies each, consecutively numbered 1-6. So yours belongs to the 5th (Reserve) company of the 2nd batallion of the 11th Pionier Batallion - so this looks to me to be a war-time number. The 11.P., by the way, was properly known as the Kurhessisches Pionier-Bataillon Nr.11. The fact that you have a 65/71 PFM scabbard marked this way is not exactly unusual. The 98/05 was issued to regular units only before 1914, and secondary units (reserves, etc.) got what was available after August 1914! E.g., I have listed a Pfm 65/71 dated 1860 and marked as "15.P.5.55", another dated 1867 re-marked as "9.P.6.136" above a cancelled "E.A.8.132" (= Eisenbahn Abteilung 8, Waffe 132). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve1871 Posted 10 January , 2019 Author Share Posted 10 January , 2019 Thanks SS and Trajan, as alway's, you guy's are a great help! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve1871 Posted 10 January , 2019 Author Share Posted 10 January , 2019 Learning here 11.p.5.111 pioneers used battalion , not regiment designation, typical battalion had 3 base units plus reserve units to call up, so say a 6th company would be the 3rd company of the second battalion so saying 11.P.5.111 . Even when companies 4.5 and 6th are reserve companies of a second battalion. Companies are still read by their number = 11th Kurhessisches Pioneer Battalian ,5th Kompany weapon 111 Few things here, is Kurhessisches a town of some type where the unit . Regiment or battalion wS raised or long time garrisoned? On these unit markings, if a large "R" is not used, how do you know to use regiment or battalion? A existing regiment has a large, regular "R" but a new raised reserve regiment, say by drafting news conscripts would have a script type "R", so say ( make up here) 10th R(script ) .R 5th battalion, 6th company = 2 ms reserve company Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 10 January , 2019 Share Posted 10 January , 2019 1 hour ago, Steve1871 said: Learning here 11.p.5.111 pioneers used battalion , not regiment designation, typical battalion had 3 base units plus reserve units to call up, so say a 6th company would be the 3rd company of the second battalion so saying 11.P.5.111 . Even when companies 4.5 and 6th are reserve companies of a second battalion. Companies are still read by their number = 11th Kurhessisches Pioneer Battalian ,5th Kompany weapon 111 Few things here, is Kurhessisches a town of some type where the unit . Regiment or battalion wS raised or long time garrisoned? On these unit markings, if a large "R" is not used, how do you know to use regiment or battalion? A existing regiment has a large, regular "R" but a new raised reserve regiment, say by drafting news conscripts would have a script type "R", so say ( make up here) 10th R(script ) .R 5th battalion, 6th company = 2 ms reserve company On the numbering of Pionier units, yes, you are broadly speaking correct. Similar to a regiment they numbered the companies the same way, consecutively. But it is too late to go any further on this one tonight! Kurhessen was one of the small states taken into Prussia in 1871 (or earlier?) - it is the region around Kassel and is the basis of the modern state of Hessen-Kassel - yes, Germany is like the USA, organised on federal lines with semi-independent states! Large R always a Regiment, script R a reserve unit of the same regiment. BUT use of script R depends on the year of the marking - another subject! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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