Fattyowls Posted 7 January , 2019 Share Posted 7 January , 2019 I've long been interested in the various WW1 veterans like Claude Rains who appear in some of the great Hollywood movies of the interwar period, and how many of them were former London Scottish. However information about their wartime experiences is sketchy and I sometimes wonder if what we do have bears the imprint of the studio publicist. The story of how Humphrey Bogart got his lip scar from a U-Boat shell splinter is the worst example of this I've come across so far, although the story of how Ronald Coleman dragged himself back from between Messines and Wytschaete on Halloween 1914 on his elbows to keep his face to the enemy is shall we say, heroic. I'm not saying it's not true of course. Claude Rains was presumably called up in February 1916, joined the Liverpool Scottish and one account suggests he lost most of the sight of one eye and his voice temporarily due to gas in November of that year. I've seen the location given as the Vimy Ridge and also have a recollection that Messines might be an alternative. He went back to blighty (Croydon actually) and rose to Captain and adjutant of his battalion, although which regiment is unknown. He is much mentioned on the forum, notably by the neredowells who frequent WiT? but info is as I say sketchy. Does anyone know where the gassing took place and which regiment he was with during the latter part of the war? Much appreciated, Pete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IPT Posted 7 January , 2019 Share Posted 7 January , 2019 There's a Temp Capt W.C. Rains, 13th Bedfordshire Regiment, being replaced as Adjutant in March 1919 - https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/31256/supplement/4111/data.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Posted 7 January , 2019 Share Posted 7 January , 2019 (edited) There is a service file at the NA for William Claude Rains, along with papers relating to several divorces: http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/results/r?_q=claude+rains Captain Claude Rains in uniform Edited 7 January , 2019 by Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Broomfield Posted 8 January , 2019 Share Posted 8 January , 2019 I'll ask my very good mate the Regimental Archivist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryBrook Posted 8 January , 2019 Share Posted 8 January , 2019 (edited) The British War Medal and Victory Medal Roll for members of 14th London Scottish later commissioned gives service numbers as 6842 (presumably Pte.) and Cpl. 512891, commissioned 10 May 1917. His first theatre of war was given as 1(a) from 21 June 1916 to 21 November 1916. "Discharged to commn. 13 (T. W.) Bn. Bedf. R. 10.5.17" He was gazetted as a temp. Lt., Transport Workers' Battalion, Bedfordshire Regt. 9 May 1917 https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/30074/supplement/4783 Promoted to temp Capt. 27 March 1918, appointed adjutant 8 October 1918, ceased to be adjutant 4 February1919, all 13th Bedfordshire Regt. Edit to add: Relinquished his commission on completion of service 1 September 1921 and retained the rank of Capt. Edited 8 January , 2019 by HarryBrook Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dai Bach y Sowldiwr Posted 8 January , 2019 Share Posted 8 January , 2019 His MIC is here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fattyowls Posted 8 January , 2019 Author Share Posted 8 January , 2019 Gentlemen, thank you very much for all of this; I was wondering if his commission was after his evacuation back to blighty and this confirms it. Some sources imply that he was a captain in the London Scottish. As to where he was injured and how I doubt if the war diaries would mention him by name but you never know. As I mentioned Vimy was mentioned in one article and I vaguely remember seeing something about Messines but that might be a figment of my warped imagination. For the most part the articles are by film buffs but some appear to be based on evidence; certainly the first sheet of his attestation papers is on-line. It might be a bit off topic but we could also throw in some of Claude Rains' greatest lines to keep us out of mischief...... Pete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David26 Posted 8 January , 2019 Share Posted 8 January , 2019 42 minutes ago, Fattyowls said: It might be a bit off topic but we could also throw in some of Claude Rains' greatest lines to keep us out of mischief...… Pete. Pete, I am shocked—shocked—to find that gambling is going on in here! David. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle George Posted 8 January , 2019 Share Posted 8 January , 2019 (edited) The attached is from ‘Claude Rains: An Actor’s Voice’ (2008), by David J. Skal and Jessica Rains (Claude’s daughter): According to this biography, Rains chose the London Scottish “in part because of its theatrical uniform and its self-bestowed, bloodthirsty sobriquet ‘The Ladies from Hell’” We are also told that, “ ... before his deployment to Vimy Ridge in the spring of 1916, he had already attained the rank of lieutenant.” Edited 8 January , 2019 by Uncle George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sassenach Posted 8 January , 2019 Share Posted 8 January , 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Fattyowls said: It might be a bit off topic but we could also throw in some of Claude Rains' greatest lines to keep us out of mischief...... I'm afraid Major Strasser will insist... Edited 8 January , 2019 by sassenach Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fattyowls Posted 8 January , 2019 Author Share Posted 8 January , 2019 Thanks lads, some of the classics there but to be honest pretty well all of Rains' dialogue as Louis in Casablanca is brilliant. My personal favourite is Louis to Rick after he has rejected the gorgeous Yvonne played by the gorgeous Madeleine Lebeau: "How careless of you throwing away women like that, someday they may be scarce". As for the except this looks like it is the source for much of what I've read; but while it correctly identifies that mustard gas was first used in the summer of 1917 from what has already been posted it looks like unless the Germans used it on Croydon it wasn't the cause of him loosing most of the sight of one eye. When you read the sentence it doesn't actually say it was mustard gas but the implication is there. The suggestion that he was a lieutenant at Vimy with the London Scottish is not what I expected either, but if true he might appear in the war diaries. I am in your debt UG. Pete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle George Posted 9 January , 2019 Share Posted 9 January , 2019 (edited) 11 hours ago, Fattyowls said: ... he might appear in the war diaries. I meant to post the link. Here it is: https://books.google.com/books/about/Claude_Rains.html?id=k54Y1HLqWDQC ”In one raid on German trenches, Rains captured a German sergeant-major, who was furious ... [the anecdote continues]“ I see the chapter’s title is ‘Marriages and Mustard Gas’. And I note your channelling Betjeman ... Edited 9 January , 2019 by Uncle George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fattyowls Posted 16 January , 2019 Author Share Posted 16 January , 2019 I took the revolutionary step of re-reading the boy Van Emden's 'Famous', specifically the chapters about Basil Rathbone and Nigel Bruce and realised that it was Bruce who was badly injured in the legs at Spanbroekmolen in early 1915. I suspect that is where I got the idea that Rains and Messines were somehow linked; it's called thinking on an empty mind. Pete. On 09/01/2019 at 08:48, Uncle George said: And I note your channelling Betjeman ... Mon oncle, can you enlighten me about my inner Betjeman? I never knew I had one, and I wonder if I have downloaded it by mistake. To be honest I would have hoped my antivirus software would have picked it up....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle George Posted 16 January , 2019 Share Posted 16 January , 2019 20 minutes ago, Fattyowls said: Mon oncle, can you enlighten me about my inner Betjeman? I never knew I had one, and I wonder if I have downloaded it by mistake. To be honest I would have hoped my antivirus software would have picked it up....... Your comment on Germans using mustard gas on Croydon put me in mind of this: http://www-cdr.stanford.edu/intuition/Slough.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fattyowls Posted 16 January , 2019 Author Share Posted 16 January , 2019 1 hour ago, Uncle George said: Your comment on Germans using mustard gas on Croydon put me in mind of this: http://www-cdr.stanford.edu/intuition/Slough.html Of course, poor Slough, bombed by Betjemin. that would be almost as bad as being visited by Ricky Gervais..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonraker Posted 28 July , 2022 Share Posted 28 July , 2022 More about Claude Rains (and Ronald Colman, Basil Rathbone and Herbert Marshall) here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fattyowls Posted 28 July , 2022 Author Share Posted 28 July , 2022 1 hour ago, Moonraker said: More about Claude Rains (and Ronald Colman, Basil Rathbone and Herbert Marshall) here I've just read the link on the other thread; much appreciated. Pete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilkley remembers Posted 29 July , 2022 Share Posted 29 July , 2022 (edited) @Fattyowls Like Claude Rains, Conrad Veidt who played Major Strasser had also served in the First World War. Veidt had enlisted into the German Army in 1914 and posted to the Eastern Front but was discharged as unfit for further duty in 1917. Interestingly, Veidt played the part of Captain Stanhope in a German version of R C Sherrifs ‘Journeys End’ called ‘Die andere Seite. Veidt was a passionate anti-fascist and left Germany for Britain and at the time of his death in 1943 (Casablanca was his last film) he was in fact a British citizen. Despite his famous part in Casablanca his greatest role was in the Expressionist masterpiece ‘The Cabinet of Doctor Caligari’, directed by Robert Wiene in 1920 and partly based on his experiences in WW1. Edited 29 July , 2022 by ilkley remembers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fattyowls Posted 29 July , 2022 Author Share Posted 29 July , 2022 26 minutes ago, ilkley remembers said: Conrad Veidt who played Major Strasser Brilliant IR, thank you; I knew that Veidt was an opponent of Hitler but I didn't know the back story. I've been mulling over an article about Rathbone for years based around the number of WW1 servicemen that appear in the classic Robin Hood with Errol Flynn. This opens a whole new front if I work in Casablanca. Pete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now