peregrinvs Posted 18 November , 2018 Share Posted 18 November , 2018 Hi, Pictures attached of a recent acquisition: a 1st type 1914 Pattern haversack. Unfortunately it's been 'shoulderbagged' at some point by removing the rear tabs and bottom buckles. (I'm currently toying with the idea of having it restored) There's a fairly clear 'R Lanc' marking inside the flap which I believe is for the Royal Lancaster Regiment. There's also a fainter number which looks like '986' or maybe '886'. I was wondering if any Ancestry or similar searching experts would like to have a stab at trying to put a name to the previous owner? There's also an 'AD' marking that may or may not be a clue. I was also wondering if anyone has any tips on gently cleaning it? The front leather tabs are fairly dry and cracking in places. Cheers, Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
battle of loos Posted 18 November , 2018 Share Posted 18 November , 2018 good moning, Beautiful small pack. . my dream to find one regards michel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWF1967 Posted 18 November , 2018 Share Posted 18 November , 2018 (edited) 3 hours ago, peregrinvs said: Hi, Pictures attached of a recent acquisition: a 1st type 1914 Pattern haversack. Unfortunately it's been 'shoulderbagged' at some point by removing the rear tabs and bottom buckles. (I'm currently toying with the idea of having it restored) There's a fairly clear 'R Lanc' marking inside the flap which I believe is for the Royal Lancaster Regiment. There's also a fainter number which looks like '986' or maybe '886'. I was wondering if any Ancestry or similar searching experts would like to have a stab at trying to put a name to the previous owner? There's also an 'AD' marking that may or may not be a clue. I was also wondering if anyone has any tips on gently cleaning it? The front leather tabs are fairly dry and cracking in places. Cheers, Mark Nice pack. I posted photos of a 1914 L.Pack I acquired just the other day. I ran R. Lancs and both suggested No's through FMP without any luck. "Renaissance Wax" is recommended for the leather in another thread. Search for leather cleaning; a post by JMB points out the pros and cons of various leather treatments/conditioners. The bag itself I'd leave as found! Edited 18 November , 2018 by GWF1967 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrEd Posted 18 November , 2018 Share Posted 18 November , 2018 to rehydrate the leather then neatsfoot woil works well, be aware it does darken the leather a bit but most treatments do. I wouldn't clean the bag either! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
depaor01 Posted 18 November , 2018 Share Posted 18 November , 2018 A related question- I have a German ww1 belt that is dry and brittle. I am looking on this forum but see many differing views on what one should do with it. Regarding Neatsfoot oil, I've read here that it not only darkens the leather, but also damages stitching. I'm still looking for an answer for dry leather. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GRANVILLE Posted 18 November , 2018 Share Posted 18 November , 2018 Anything you put on dried leather is going to affect it's tone, but this is not to its detriment, and I personally would prefer to see the tone altered to know that the leather was in better condition than when found. I was recently given a Sam Browne which was dry and had traces of mildew in parts. I melted some brown shoe polish and applied it warm so that it would soak in. It polished up a treat. To keep the change of tone to a minimum, I could have used some neutral polish, but didn't have any to hand. The main thing is to get something well into the leather so as to 'feed' it. David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
depaor01 Posted 18 November , 2018 Share Posted 18 November , 2018 Neutral polish I'd be happy to use and to be honest my gut feeling is that if the product is made for leather, then it shouldn't do any harm... until someone comes along to advise against it! I can open a new thread rather than hijack this one. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave1418 Posted 18 November , 2018 Share Posted 18 November , 2018 Neatsfoot oil does rot the stitching, try a light rub of warm water and baby shampoo then clean off. Whilst still damp rub in a good leather feed such as fieblings. I have on occasion used olive oil to clean off the dirt and it also makes it more supple regards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrEd Posted 18 November , 2018 Share Posted 18 November , 2018 yes neatsfoot can rot stitching. I have only used it on new leather items i have made, but if the thread was older then yes that definitely possible. olive oil is a good suggestion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wainfleet Posted 19 November , 2018 Share Posted 19 November , 2018 Do not use Renaissance Wax on the leather! It's great for some things but not for that. Oil of any sort is also a pretty insensitive way to "conserve" antique leather. I use Cellugel, which is used by library conservators to stabilise old book bindings and will stop red rot in its tracks. Pretty much anything else you use will either darken the leather, make it sticky or give it a waxy finish that eventually dries out and flakes off without actually doing the leather any particular good. Cellugel is not cheap but it's very good and the only thing fit for this purpose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Haselgrove Posted 19 November , 2018 Share Posted 19 November , 2018 Mark, I agree with Wainfleet, especially if red rot is present. I used Cellugel, at Wainfleet's suggestion, on a helmet liner that had red rot and it has worked perfectly. However, having looked at your pack, which by the way is very nice, I question why you might want to treat the leather at all? The leather looks to me to be in good, stable condition and, if displayed/stored carefully, should not deteriorate. Obviously it is up to you but keep in mind that items that are treated are quite often devalued as far as other collectors are concerned. Regards, Michael. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peregrinvs Posted 23 November , 2018 Author Share Posted 23 November , 2018 Thanks for everyone's input. I have decided for the time being to leave it alone, other than going over the canvas with a brush which did remove a little loose dirt and dust. I already have a 3rd type haversack, so it doesn't 'need' to be complete: https://www.greatwarforum.org/topic/226129-1914-pattern-haversack/ You may be interested to learn that it came with a leather shoulder strap - which proved on investigation to be a 1914 Pattern pack strap that had had the buckle end cut off + some extra holes added. As it is semi-expendable, I put some Pecards on it to see what effect it had on the leather = it's more flexible, but the points where it was connected to the buckles on the haversack are still fairly stiff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMB1943 Posted 23 November , 2018 Share Posted 23 November , 2018 http://nautarch.tamu.edu/CRL/conservationmanual/File7.htm With reference to desiccated, brittle leather this link is to methods of conservation of leather recovered from archaeological sites. Note the use of hexane (a petroleum distillate) for the preparation of the BML recipe. The use of white spirits (petroleum distillate) alone to remove possible Cosmoline or wax residues suggested by me for leather was criticized recently in the thread "Help With P1907 Scabbard Cleaning". Any treatment applied should be based on two considerations, 1) the equipment was not intended to last 100 yrs, 2) is the equipment for use in a re-enactment scenario, and should be functional OR a purely display use, 3) if a display, is it required to look good? I do know the urge of the "look good" feeling, because I have de-rusted a WW1 Brodie helmet and have been fence-sitting for several months mulling over the current lustre-less brown shell (which does not look "good") and the possibility of applying an oil-based green enamel paint to make it look bright & with a slight gloss. Regards, JMB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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