MIC help James W. Chantler

[Guest]

Hi all, I recently started researching the military service of my great Grandfather James William Chantler, I've found his Medal Index Card although I am having some difficulty figuring out the meaning of and deciphering some of the text.

 

In particular I would be very grateful for any help figuring out what is found below the medal section (Please see attached image):

1. The meaning of the 2 lines of printed text beginning "T.P.WAR.RWSURREY.TFM..."

2. The meaning of the Handwritten line below this "T.E.FF.AO. 148 of 1920"

3. If possible the text and meaning of the Handwritten line in the "Theatre of War first served" in row, which has been crossed out.

Many thanks for any help,

Tim

[tullybrone]

Hi,

 

Welcome to the forum.

 

It’s not the best quality image but it appears that your great grandfather was a Territorial Force Soldier (likely pre war enlistment by his Regimental Number) and was entitled to the British War Medal and the Victory Medal.

 

Additionally he was entitled to the India General Service Medal on account of his active service during the 1919 Afghan War. 

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_Anglo-Afghan_War

 

I believe 1/4th Queen’s were the only Battalion of the Regiment to have the Afghanistan 1919 Battle Honour.

 

He appears to have been awarded the Territorial Efficiency Medal (rather than Territorial Force Efficiency Medal) which suggests that he continued in service when the Territorial Force was reconstituted as the Territorial Army in 1920. This award may be recorded in the London Gazette?

 

if you could include his Regimental Number and Regiment name in your topic title you will likely attract the interest of a Royal West Surrey expert who may be able to provide more detail. As a starting point here is a link to the Regimental detail on the Long Long Trail which shows that 2 Queens TF Battalions served in India.

 

http://www.longlongtrail.co.uk/army/regiments-and-corps/the-british-infantry-regiments-of-1914-1918/queens-royal-west-surrey-regiment/

 

 

Good Luck.

 

Steve

 

Edit to Add.

 

There is a free access period to U.K. Ancestry Thursday 8th until Monday 12th November so you should be able to look for his service record or records of men with numbers near to him so you could draw an inference from their movements.

 

 

Edited 7 November , 2018 by tullybrone

[rksimpson]

Hi

 

Read through this- it will help - http://www.longlongtrail.co.uk/soldiers/how-to-research-a-soldier/campaign-medal-records/how-to-interpret-a-campaign-medal-index-card/

The last line crossed through - # refers to the 2nd stamped line and says IGS India Queens Rifles 16} issued India - which is I presume overridden by the stamped text

 

regards

 

Robert 

[clk]

Hi Tim,

 

Welcome to the Forum.

 

Unfortunately, I didn't see any service file for your great grandfather, and would guess that (unless he served post 1920) it was one of those lost as the result of a fire in WW2. His medal roll records show that he was entitled to the Territorial Force War Medal; and the British War and Victory Medals. I don't think that Ancestry has the rolls for the India General Service Medal, so I can't post a link for you.

 

James had 2 service numbers - 1785 and 200393. That is because he was a Territorial Force soldier, and the TF were renumbered in 1917. His 200393 number falls within the number block (200001 to 240000) that was allocated to the line units of the 4h Battalion - see previous link. Allowing for 'drop outs' the medal roll indicates that the men were renumbered sequentially based on their previous 4 digit numbers. Looking at just a few men from the 4th Bn that do have surviving papers, you appear to get...

 

1742/200367 Burrows - joined 28.4.1913

1782/200390 Holdsworth - joined 16.6.1913

1785/200393

1820/200414 Boreham - joined 19.2.1914

1827/200419 Gamble - joined 23.3.1914

 

It seems likely then that James was a pre war territorial, joining mid 1913

 

In the early part of the war, due to their general 'terms and conditions', TF men didn't have to serve overseas. However, as James was awarded the Territorial Force War Medal, it would seem that he volunteered to so by signing the  Imperial Service Obligation by the end of September 1914 ( - the end date qualifying date for TF men to be entitled to the medal). However, under the 'rules' he wouldn't have served in a 'theatre of war' until after 1915, as if he had the TFWM entitlement would have be negated/offset by the award of a 14, or 14/15 Star Medal award.

 

The medal rolls shows that James served overseas with the 1/4th (i.e. 1st Line, 4th) Battalion. When he first joined up, there was only the 4th Battalion, (subdivision) line units (i.e. 1/4 - 1st line, 4th Bn; 2/4 - 2nd line, 4th Bn; 3/4 - 3rd line, 4th Bn; and 4/4 - 4th Line, 4th Bn) didn't exist. The Battalion line structure was created after the outbreak of the war, for the 4th Battalion see the Long, Long Trail here.

 

From my understanding, to have qualified for the British War and Victory Medals, a man would have had to have served in an active theatre of war. It seems like the 1/4th Bn spent their time in India, which generally wasn't considered as such. That leads me to ill informed speculation that he/the battalion may have served at some time in the 'frontier regions of India' (theatre code 6G), which would have given an entitlement, or if whilst still officially a 1/4 man, he qualified by serving with another unit. I also wondered if as the 1/4 Bn went to India in October 1914 (as a 'non' theatre) that wouldn't entitle him to a Star medal, and didn't consequently negate his entitlement to his TFWM award.

 

Hopefully a Regimental specialist will be able to make some informed comments.

 

Good luck with your research.

 

Regards

Chris

 

 

[Guest]

Sorry I've only just realized I didn't thank any of you properly, but my family and I found your insights really helpful and it was lovely to find out a bit more about one of our ancestors in the same year as the centenary. What a great community and thank you once again.