TEW Posted 1 December , 2018 Share Posted 1 December , 2018 21 hours ago, TEW said: Barry, At present it looks as if only the 1st Bn were in the area in the right time frame. That may change! As Julian has pointed out there are roughly 41 Sgts in a Battalion. If we start looking at all Sherwood units in France at the time that's going to be 720 Sgts. rather than 41 to hunt through. TEW TEW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Inspector Posted 1 December , 2018 Share Posted 1 December , 2018 Hi Tew Yes got the message, thanks. From the searches I've done can anyone say which Bn. those men were in? Regards Barry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TEW Posted 1 December , 2018 Share Posted 1 December , 2018 Andrew Harwood WO2 4331. Notts and Derby. BWM/Vict medal roll has him as 1st Btn. But NB I don't think a WO2 wore 3 stripes. Still a possible contender as he may have been appointed WO2 after the photo. Andrew Wise A/WO2. 3035/265792. Looks as if he arrived in France as a Private, no unit given, ended up with 1/7th and an Acting WO Class 2. No idea if he wore stripes or not. 1914 Star rolls for Sherwoods are arranged by battalion so it would be straight forward to go through the pages picking out Sgts. Then of course eliminate any that died, wounded/discharged, transferred, gained commision, were demoted before Feb 1918. That won't account for any that Cpls. etc promoted to Sgt. later on or Sgts. from other battalions transfered as replacements. Needles and Haystacks come to mind! TEW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TEW Posted 1 December , 2018 Share Posted 1 December , 2018 Just looked though diary for 2/8th Sherwoods and on 30/1/1918 they disbanded but sent 153 ORs & NCOS to 1st Battalion. They are going to be a number of disbandments end of Jan 1918 with men moving about a lot. Which is going to add to the number of possible Sgts. TEW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Inspector Posted 1 December , 2018 Share Posted 1 December , 2018 Hi TEW 3 hours ago, TEW said: Needles and haystacks come to mind! TEW Just what I put in my PM to Sue! Thanks for checking Regards Barry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurel Sercu Posted 1 December , 2018 Share Posted 1 December , 2018 Sorry if I am interfering to add something that may have become irrelevant after previous postings.. Only to say that when I associated the name of the farm with the hamlet "Schaapbalie" (my posting #71 page 3) I was (very) wrong. In the Abeelestraat in Poperinge there was indeed a brickery with that name Schaballie from approx. 1885 to 1970. In 1900 the owner Alphonse Schaballie had a small "kasteel" (chateau) built. It was at / near "Rekhof". Photo can be attached if desirable. Aurel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTracer44 Posted 1 December , 2018 Share Posted 1 December , 2018 That was the sort of info I was seeking, if it could be proven this was the farm, then this could make it easier to pinpoint the Battallion concerned. Den Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TEW Posted 1 December , 2018 Share Posted 1 December , 2018 Don't think adding a location for the farm is interfering, sounds crucial to me! I'm still double checking Sherwood battalion locations for Jan-Feb 1918 and hoping only 1st battalion is the only possible candidate. TEW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurel Sercu Posted 2 December , 2018 Share Posted 2 December , 2018 I can't find the exact location so far of the brickery. But it sure must have been the "Abeelseweg". This shows the small chateau ("chalet") before the war. (Mind you, the text with it shows "Schabaillie" but I am almost sure that it should be "Schaballie", as on the postcard. I must say that this "Schaballie" is a surname I had never heard before. Maybe it is common in the Poperinge area, but not (I think) in or near Ypres.) https://westhoekverbeeldt.be/ontdek/detail/781339de-bbc5-11e3-8421-fb28f27197af Aurel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTracer44 Posted 2 December , 2018 Share Posted 2 December , 2018 I will be in Ypres and Poperinghe on Wed next could I be of help with this maybe go to the Museum at both places. Den Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurel Sercu Posted 2 December , 2018 Share Posted 2 December , 2018 This is where the brickery was. The main road from right side to bottom side is the Abeelseweg The railroad is where now the Frans-Vlaanderenweg is - southeast of which is Lijssenthoek Cemetery. (Map 22 May 1918) Sorry if location has alreadby been mentioned before. I haven't read the whole topic (yet). Aurel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suesalter1 Posted 2 December , 2018 Author Share Posted 2 December , 2018 Thanks Aurel. You're so good at pinpointing locations. I'm sure you're bang on the money with this one. Sue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sotonmate Posted 2 December , 2018 Share Posted 2 December , 2018 An interesting thread you have here ! Read it all quietly this morning while puppy sleeps on my lap ! All I can offer is a small smoke bomb - CCS land (REMY SIDINGS) wasn't so far away, could the Sergeant have been a patient there, maybe nearing the end of a recuperating period, and thus from any of several SF units. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTracer44 Posted 2 December , 2018 Share Posted 2 December , 2018 4 hours ago, Aurel Sercu said: This is where the brickery was. The main road from right side to bottom side is the Abeelseweg The railroad is where now the Frans-Vlaanderenweg is - southeast of which is Lijssenthoek Cemetery. (Map 22 May 1918) Sorry if location has alreadby been mentioned before. I haven't read the whole topic (yet). Aurel Good work Aurel, I can have a beer instead now. Den Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JulianR Posted 2 December , 2018 Share Posted 2 December , 2018 Having looked at the two maps, the one above that Aurel supplied and the one showing the 1st Bn positions, I am inclined to think that the 1st Bn positions are too far away for it to be feasible for the Sgt to be going there to collect rations. That is assuming I have got the right locations on both maps. Having looked at the original photo again, are all the girls in some sort of uniform, the different types perhaps indicating their grade. if Belgian civilians did work in CCS, then as Sotonmate suggested perhaps it is the CCS at Remy Sidings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurel Sercu Posted 2 December , 2018 Share Posted 2 December , 2018 Den, Time for a beer ? Not yet. Maybe when you are there you can find out if I am correct when I think that the distance (former) Brickworks (Abeelseweg, housenumbers 97-99 now) to Lyssenthoek Cemetery indeed is 1.4 km (as the crow flies). :-) Did I read it correctly that the "farm" was where now Lyssenthoek Cem. is ? And that this farm was near the brickworks? (Is 1.4 km not a little too far to be 'near' ?) If only I could find a trench map with Schaballie Farm, or a prewar photo ... Not that it would solve all the problems ... Aurel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurel Sercu Posted 2 December , 2018 Share Posted 2 December , 2018 Julian, " the one above that Aurel supplied " That reminds me ... In my posting #89 I forgot to mention my source (re the location of the pre and post war brickworks). This one : https://inventaris.onroerenderfgoed.be/erfgoedobjecten/30899 Aurel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTracer44 Posted 2 December , 2018 Share Posted 2 December , 2018 3 hours ago, Aurel Sercu said: Julian, " the one above that Aurel supplied " That reminds me ... In my posting #89 I forgot to mention my source (re the location of the pre and post war brickworks). This one : https://inventaris.onroerenderfgoed.be/erfgoedobjecten/30899 Aurel Hello Aurel I have been able to find from your source location of the house on google maps, it looks as though the old brick works is now a scrap metal yard and just opposite is a road Boescheepsewg, (think that’s right) which links up with Frans- Vlaanderenweg, which if you turn west on will take you past Lijssenthoek Cemetery, and am I right in thinking Remy Sidings was Opposite, as a person living at a time when most people only had a cycle or motorcycle this all seems near to me, but as I leave Poperinge on my way to Dunkirk I will do measurements and generally have a nosy about. Also a trip to Museum to see if I can locate more evidence of Schabaille Farm. And then a beer. Den Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurel Sercu Posted 3 December , 2018 Share Posted 3 December , 2018 Den, Don't do anything dangerous imitating a crow in its flight! After all there is the much needed beer afterwards ! :-) Remy Sidings ... I must confess I do not know where exactly it was. (Somehow I think though : not opposite. Maybe between the cemetery and the Frans-Vlaanderenweg ?) As to Schaballie ... The abandoned pit of the brick factory apparently afterwards was used as a garbage dump. Not anymore, having a greener destination. And ... mind the spelling. (Said the retired nitpicker/teacher.) It's just that when searching (on the internet or elsewhere) that the spelling may be important. On the other hand I think that even people here may have an incorrect spelling, as the name is not really common. And indeed, on serious websites I found the wrong spelling. (And I myself have to be careful. Also because we have a name in the area Debaillie, which may cause confusion.) Detail : I may have referred to a small castle (on postcards named a 'chalet') Schaballie, saying or suggesting it was nearby. It was not. It was in the centre of Poperinge (Rekhof). Aurel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sotonmate Posted 3 December , 2018 Share Posted 3 December , 2018 Aurel I'm having a beer, Cornish with a tang of cream ! Your map is useful as it seems to zero in on the connurbation that was Remy Sidings, lost of little squares that must have made up the various CCS structures (see Square 22 b and d, and Square 23 a and c) and right alongside the railway line, hence Sidings ! Happens to be close to your blue ring as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TEW Posted 3 December , 2018 Share Posted 3 December , 2018 I've double checked all the Sherwood Foresters diaries and I still think 1st Bn. is the closest. The conception dates I used initially to look through the diaires did not take into account if the baby was early/late. The 1st Sherwoods were in billets in Poperinghe 18th Jan - 25th Jan. And a few extracts from earlier posts, hope Sue doesn't mind. But we still don't know if the baby was conceived in Poperinghe or the 'Schaballie' place. During the First World War, an 18-year-old refugee girl with her family in the Belgian town Poperinge (back of the front Ypres Salient) meets a British soldier of a regiment stationed in the area. Only an uncle testified that he saw the baby come out of the barn where he was born, wrapped in towels, before he went back to the farm house where the family lived (Schaballie Farm Poperinge). Her grandmother's name was Marie Vansteenkiste and she was a Belgium refugee. The family were staying on a farm between Abele and Poperinge called Schabaille. I believe this is an area, but she says the farm was close to a brick factory and is now the site of Lissenthoek Cemetery. TEW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTracer44 Posted 4 December , 2018 Share Posted 4 December , 2018 Arrived Ypres been away from WiFi going into town so will do some research here then if no results, going to Poperinge tomorrow Wednesday and hopefully find out about Schaballie Farm. Den Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suesalter1 Posted 4 December , 2018 Author Share Posted 4 December , 2018 Thank you Den, Have a great stay in Ypres. Sue/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTracer44 Posted 4 December , 2018 Share Posted 4 December , 2018 Hello all, a reasonably successful afternoon at the Knowledge Centre in Cloth Hall, the gentleman who I spoke with, luckily was from Poperinge and familiar with the area and the surname Schaballie as synonymous with the brickworks and according him was the owner so confirming what Aurel posted in #81 and #94, further evidence that this is the correct location is an area adjacent named as Bommelaar Park on google maps was the original brick pits where the Clay came from but in recent times has been filled in and made into a green area, this I believe Aurel mentioned in #94 so coroberated. So we now have the problem was this the place Annie mentioned as a farm, we now know it was owned by a Schaballie or was there a farm as well, owned by the same man or by a relative, possibly a little way off towards Lijssenheok, all conjecture at this moment. Tomorrow I will make the journey to Poperinge and do some investigations, the gentleman at Ypres suggested speaking to the Blacksmith close to the old Brickworks, as he was confident he would know some history of the area and the family, wish Aurel was here to speak the language! Other info, apparently the area west of Poperinge was where refugees were located at that time, on farms and the like. just to add, myself and wife will be going to the Menin Gate later, looks to be a good evening weather wise. Den Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurel Sercu Posted 4 December , 2018 Share Posted 4 December , 2018 Den, So you must have seen Dries. I'll be seeing him tomorrow. "Refugees" ... Yes, I have already wondered where Marie Vansteenkiste was from. She may (must) have fled to the Poperinge area either in Sept.-Oct. 1914, from elsewhere in Flanders, or on April 1915 ifliving nearer (just (north)east of the Ypres area. Anyway, I have already been through the Birth certificates of my Province West-Flanders which are on line, hoping to find hers etc. But with such a common name, and not even knowing if she was from our Province West-Flanders, this really is a needle in a haystack. And as to the Birth Certificate of the baby ... This was 1918, and as it is a problem to find the pre-war certificates (which are far from complete), it goes without saying that 1918 is very problematic. Who knows ... Poperinge authorities may be helpful.I'm afraid I can't ... Aurel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now