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Richard W

German 230mm Trench Art Shell Casing

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Richard W

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Hi, all. I have a shell casing - I think - that is obviously German, but I don’t know much about what the impressions/stamps on the base are. Would someone be able to help me with some background/identification, please? I also don’t know what the significance of any of the ‘art’ engravings is, if there is any at all? It is 230mm in diameter and is undoubtedly cut down as it is only 230mm tall. Thank you in advance of any help, Rich

Edited by Richard W

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trajan

Others know better than I,to be going on with...  Is it necessarily cut down? I am wondering if it is from a naval piece - hence the Neptune/Poseidon. Or is it one of the other Olympian Triad? Lion naturally makes one think of GB... But I think a German naval piece would have a crown over an M on it...

 

"MAI 1917" is the manufacture date of this one, May 1917, and GSFP is for Geschoss Fabrik Spandau, where it was made. Not certain of the "64". I have an idea what the markings on the fize is but don't want to commit myself that far! The Sp 197 is, I bleieve, a Spandau inspector's mark.

 

Trajan

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peregrinvs

I think you may have a 21cm Mörser cartridge case. If so, it hasn't been cut down:

 

http://www.kaisersbunker.com/cc/cc10.htm

 

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Richard W

Wow, thank you for your fast response time, trajan, and for identifying the stamped markings. I actually don't know if it's cut down or not - I 'found' this plus several other trench art pieces in France this summer and I am trying to make some sense of all the markings, origins and engravings on them

 

I wondered about naval due to its size (and the engraving), but the lion threw me as I knew it was German in origin - is there 'trench art' on naval shells? I had wondered if it was one of the big guns, like 'Big Bertha' but it's obviously a smaller size than those 'fort busters', I think? Thank you, Rich

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Richard W
8 minutes ago, peregrinvs said:

I think you may have a 21cm Mörser cartridge case. If so, it hasn't been cut down:

 

http://www.kaisersbunker.com/cc/cc10.htm

 

That seems to be it. Fantastic!! Thank you so much, peregrinvs. No idea who would have decided this casing should be engraved upon though - although I am pleased it was - or why they chose to depict what they did. Cheers, Rich

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trajan
27 minutes ago, peregrinvs said:

I think you may have a 21cm Mörser cartridge case. If so, it hasn't been cut down

 

 

I knew I had seen somethingshort and dumpy like this somewhere! Thanks!

 

22 minutes ago, Richard W said:

Wow, thank you for your fast response time, trajan, and for identifying the stamped markings. ...

 

Happy to help, but still thinking on that fuze marking...!!!

 

16 minutes ago, Richard W said:

That seems to be it. Fantastic!! Thank you so much, peregrinvs. No idea who would have decided this casing should be engraved upon though - although I am pleased it was - or why they chose to depict what they did. Cheers, Rich

 

There's the rub! Sometimes impossible to work out why the engraver chose the scene they did. Does the Olympian god hold a trident ? That woud of course be Neptune / Poseidon and so a GB naval connection possible. If a thunderbolt or sceptre, more appropriate for Jupiter. Pluto held keys, if I remember rightly,

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Richard W

He doesn't appear to be holding anything - like a broken off, long leaf or stick, no prongs just as in photo - very odd, I agree. What is it about the fuse marking that is troubling you?

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trajan

Nothing especially troubling about the fuze marking - looks fine, but this is not my field after all and I can't work out what it means!:unsure:

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Richard W
11 minutes ago, trajan said:

Nothing especially troubling about the fuze marking - looks fine, but this is not my field after all and I can't work out what it means!:unsure:

Lol. As you can see, none of it's mine right now. Sadly

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peregrinvs
9 hours ago, trajan said:

Nothing especially troubling about the fuze marking - looks fine, but this is not my field after all and I can't work out what it means!:unsure:

It’s called a primer. According to the Treasure Bunker website:

 

The primer is the small 16mm Mörser (howitzer) pattern marked: Schlgzdschr. 14 (Schlagzündschraube 14 = Impact ignition screw 14).”

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trajan
6 hours ago, peregrinvs said:

It’s called a primer. According to the Treasure Bunker website:

 

The primer is the small 16mm Mörser (howitzer) pattern marked: Schlgzdschr. 14 (Schlagzündschraube 14 = Impact ignition screw 14).”

 

Thanks for that! I had assumed 'Schlag' but the only expression that came to mind was 'Schlagsahne'...! :blink:

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