ZIL Posted 5 September , 2018 Share Posted 5 September , 2018 I am currently researching a lance sergeant fron 1st battalion grenadiers guards ,for relatives, who died of wounds 8:5:16 at Lifssenthoek Military Hospital.The 1st’s wat diary shows them in trenches at Rifleman or s Farm.Other locations mentioned are Railway Wood and Muddy Lane. my knowledge of this area is limited but looking on maps there is a Rifle Farm up from Hellfire Corner,also Railway Wood is a little higher up. I believe Muddy Lane was a coms trench from the wood to the rear. Is the Rifle Farm the same as Riflemans? Or am I in the wrong location. any help would be appreciated. thanks again ZIL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaxD Posted 5 September , 2018 Share Posted 5 September , 2018 There is a sketch map in the Brigade diary which calls it Rifle Farm and looking at the orders I'd suggest it is what the battalion called Rifleman's Farm and has the other locations too. Max Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZIL Posted 5 September , 2018 Author Share Posted 5 September , 2018 Thanks MaxD, Must admit didn’t look,in the Brigade Diary. You learn!!!!! Thanks again..this will be great for the relatives. much appreciated, Zil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaxD Posted 5 September , 2018 Share Posted 5 September , 2018 If it helps further: https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/side-by-side/#zoom=15&lat=50.8517&lon=2.9213&layers=101464642&right=BingHyb The trenches aren't right as the map is from 1917 but if you overlay the sketch map it should give an idea. Max Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZIL Posted 5 September , 2018 Author Share Posted 5 September , 2018 Thanks again Max, Absolutely superb.... Regards, Zil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fattyowls Posted 5 September , 2018 Share Posted 5 September , 2018 (edited) Hi Zil I'm attaching a couple of snaps to give you a sense of the ground as it is now. The first is Rifle Farm from the edge of Railway Wood looking back towards Ieper; the farm buildings are on the left and the cars are following the line of the railway line down to Hellfire Corner which is just behind the farm. The Cloth Hall, the cathedral and and Sint Jacob are in the centre. The second one is a panorama from where the Liverpool Scottish Memorial now stands just along from the RE Grave, about 300m from where the other one was taken. This is looking south towards the Menin Road and shows the area of Muddy Lane (apologies for being able to see the join). Rifle Farm is just off to the right of picture. Pete. Edited 5 September , 2018 by Fattyowls Church Tower id howler Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZIL Posted 5 September , 2018 Author Share Posted 5 September , 2018 Thanks Pete, Great photos....really helpful. They tie in well with Max’s post Regards, Zil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fattyowls Posted 5 September , 2018 Share Posted 5 September , 2018 No problem Zil, it's nice when any of my rubbish random snaps come in handy for someone. Just to complete the set this is the view from Perth (China Wall) Cemetery looking up to Railway Wood and the RE Grave which gives more of a sense of how dominant the ground was and why it was so heavily fought over. Rifle Farm is just to the right of the big single tree breaking the horizon on the left of the picture. Pete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZIL Posted 5 September , 2018 Author Share Posted 5 September , 2018 I can assure you they are not rubbish...they give great detail of the lie of the land...the trees etc grow back etc but still very informative. Thanks again. Zil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaxD Posted 6 September , 2018 Share Posted 6 September , 2018 Splendid pics Pete. Max Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cnock Posted 6 September , 2018 Share Posted 6 September , 2018 Rifle Farm, 5th June 1917 regards, Cnock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaxD Posted 6 September , 2018 Share Posted 6 September , 2018 Splendid Cnock - rotating it shows how good the brigade sketch map was! Also goes to illustrate the futility. The sketch was done in May 1916, your pic over a year later. Max Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cnock Posted 6 September , 2018 Share Posted 6 September , 2018 Max, yes You are quite right! Cnock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZIL Posted 6 September , 2018 Author Share Posted 6 September , 2018 Clock that’s absolutely superb...I agree entirely with Max....the relatives will be really grateful. Thanks again, Zil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZIL Posted 6 September , 2018 Author Share Posted 6 September , 2018 Cnock, My sincere apologies for the spelling on the last....machines !!!!! regards, Zil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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