Help ID trench at Ainse May 1918

[DAVE HALL]

Hi

My Gt Uncle Pt 37748 G F TOMLIN was killed at Ainse on 27th May 1918 whilst serving with the 6th Leicestershire. some where between Cormicy and Cauroy (North of Rheims)

I am visiting the battle site and his memorial, in July and wonder if you could help identifying a trench map of the time that shows the trenches etc mentioned in the war diary of that time or help in some other way with their exact locations

 

Particularlly- Tr du Esternay (near Cormicy)

and locations of Tenaille de Guise, Hirsch Wood and the  Battn's "D" camp near Chalons le Vergeur

 

Additionally do you know of any way of identifying which company G F Tomlin was attached to in 6th Leicestershire.

 

Many thanks

 

 

David Hall

[Howard]

I had a look but my collection but did not find any with trenches on. Sorry.

You need the Berry-au-Bac SW or SE sheets.

 

Howard

 

[PJS]

Sorry, I do not have anything that far South of the Aisne. Generally speaking, the British troops that fought in this battle had not been there long and took over French positions. Consequently, many of the locations in the War Diaries reference French trenches and command posts that don't appear on the British War Diary maps. You "may" be able to find map coordinates for the locations that interest you in the Battalion, Brigade or Divisional War Diaries and trace locations that way. I did this for the 1/Sherwoods and it's a lot of work but it did eventually allow me to find several places that were not shown on the official maps.

 

I would also suggest that if you do not get anything within the next 24 hrs or so that you post your request to the following existing thread:

https://www.greatwarforum.org/topic/44335-aisne-chemin-des-dames-battle-may-june-1918

 

Peter

[DAVE HALL]

Many Thanks Peter and Howard

 

Do you know if there are French maps available anywhere

 

David

[Howard]

They must be somewhere. It is worth a look, the Berry-au-Bac ones I have a little to the North are very good, they are labeld NE (in French) which implies the SE and SW sheets exist.

 

Howard

[CROONAERT]

Here's the Tenaille de Guise for starters...

 

Dave.

[DAVE HALL]

Hi Croonaert

 

Many thanks, you sent me 2 larger map areas last year, apologies I wasn't very efficient in my analysis then

 

Looking at the lager area, the above map was taken from, I can now see the cut off end of a trench name "r n a y"  which I am hoping is Epernay as it would be in the right place.

 

This partial word is located at the bottom right of the map section just below the word "le" of le fond de Cormicy, do you have the southern section that continues this trench please with the full name printed and the complete line of the trench

 

Are these maps available anywhere for viewing

 

I have plotted some of these trench on a modern aerial map and hope to walk the area in July.

 

Kind Regards

 

David Hall

[CROONAERT]

5 hours ago, DAVE HALL said:

Looking at the lager area, the above map was taken from, I can now see the cut off end of a trench name "r n a y"  which I am hoping is Epernay as it would be in the right place.

 

This partial word is located at the bottom right of the map section just below the word "le" of le fond de Cormicy, do you have the southern section that continues this trench please with the full name printed and the complete line of the trench

 

 

 

Yes... that's Esternay… I do also have a map showing the full length of that trench (dating from Feb 1917), but the trench is unnamed on it. Would that be of any interest?

 

 

Edited 9 June , 2018 by CROONAERT

[CROONAERT]

5 hours ago, DAVE HALL said:

Are these maps available anywhere for viewing

 

 

If you mean online, then the only place that has any significant amount of French trench maps available for viewing that I can think of are within the online French war diaries (Memoires des hommes website) but these can be a little hit or miss for maps and you can spend many fruitless hours trawling them for maps if you are after one for a particular spot. You'd also have to be aware of the French formation that may have been in the area at a particular time. My own website illustrates a few hundred extracts from various sources including my own collection.

 

Offline, then there are actually quite a few locations and archives within France that hold decent collections. In the UK, there are a few at the National Archives and, I presume, at the IWM (Howard would know better than me what they have there). There are also, of course, my filing cabinets, but that archive is off limits to general public viewing!!! 

 

PS. I've sent you (via PM) an extract showing the whole length of Esternay trench, by the way

 

Dave

Edited 9 June , 2018 by CROONAERT