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Droocoo

Australian in the Royal Navy?

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Droocoo

Hi all,

 

Pte 575 John Sloan 27th Bn AIF stated on his enlistment papers, that he had served 2 1/2 years in the Royal Navy prior to him joining the AIF in 1915.

 

Would anyone be able to find a record for this previous service? I do not profess to be at all proficient in researching RN service

 

Thank you in advance,

 

Andrew

 

image.png.d3c5f2573881b33527c7c54bb4f460e9.png

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little bob

Unable to find a record for a John Sloan born in Ireland. However have found John Sloan born in Glasgow 26 October 1885, joined the Royal Navy 31 August 1905. Stoker 1st Class , his last ship being H M S Encounter part of the Australia Squadron. On 8 November  in Sydney he ran (deserted)  Wonder if there is any connection.

 

Bob

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Droocoo

Bob,

 

Sloan’s military record with the AIF consists of a series of drunken offences and AWOL’s. Do you think that he may have enlisted under false pretences?

 

Kindest Regards,

 

Andrew

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Wexflyer
Posted (edited)

Could you post what you make out for the details of the next-of-kin, in red?

The supposed Irish address is unfamiliar and suspicious looking to me.

(Nit pick: why do you say he was an Australian in the Royal Navy, when he was not an Australian when serving with them?)

 

Edited by Wexflyer

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little bob

Andrew

Had another look for records and by spelling his name Sloane have come up with a chap born in Dublin 23 May 1899, another possible.

 

Bob

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Wexflyer
Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, little bob said:

Andrew

Had another look for records and by spelling his name Sloane have come up with a chap born in Dublin 23 May 1899, another possible.

 

Bob

 

Surely way too young!

 

Irish Genealogy website shows 55 "John Sloan"s born in Ireland between 1880 and 1890!

Edited by Wexflyer

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Wexflyer

There is a John Sloan of approximately the right age living in Dublin in 1901, born Scotland.

John Sloan, 1901 Census, Dublin, Ireland

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little bob

Oops finger trouble date of birth should have read 23 May  1889.  (Exit stage left)

 

Bob

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Droocoo

Thank you Wexflyer and Bob,

 

The address in red reads "Mrs ?(Mullen), Lower Killen, ?(Hulny) Bridge, Ireland"

 

May be noted that he had a tattoo on his right fore-arm on enlistment. Here are his details

 

Kindest Regards,

 

Andrew

 

image.png.b4a8dbecaf49949af6d8496f85cfc4d4.png

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Wexflyer
Posted (edited)
24 minutes ago, Droocoo said:

Thank you Wexflyer and Bob,

 

The address in red reads "Mrs ?(Mullen), Lower Killen, ?(Hulny) Bridge, Ireland"

 

 

Andrew

 

image.png.b4a8dbecaf49949af6d8496f85cfc4d4.png

 

 

This shows that he was Catholic - which also fits with the fellow in the 1901 census in Dublin, in my previous post.

Can you make out the words in red, directly above "Ireland"?

Edited by Wexflyer

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Droocoo

Wexflyer,

 

Yes it does fit with that

 

Is it "Newry"

 

 

image.png.6b502e30c58d36e0b4d22b1e6de65b74.png

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Droocoo

The details of his NOK further on in the papers,

 

image.png.11169f3e0b6e366c7874c3f073ef8846.png

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Droocoo

And the plot thickens....it seems as though on another form, his correct name was stated as "Patrick McGinnity". Dated a long time after the war 13/5/40 

 

 

 

image.png.56abaf5fdc9d4cf68ce107e667c5fdd5.png

 

This form lists him as living at 214 Arden Street, North Melbourne

 

image.png.4acdefc7888c5386582bfc50929e34b5.png

 

 

 

 

 

 

image.png

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corisande

He is certainly going to a lot of trouble to hide his identity

 

I cannot find him in Irish Birth records under Patrick McGinnity/McGinty nor as Mullan

 

I cannot get him in Irish census in 1901 under any of these names

 

One can say that he has knowledge of Co Louth, Black Rock and Flurry Bridge are not places that you would put down unless you knew of them

 

At a guess I would say his mother was Ann Mullen, but I cannot establish her either :angry:

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little bob

Records at the National Archives, Royal Navy ratings service records 1853-1928 , show no record for Patrick McGinnity  or McGinty . The plot thickens.

 

Bob

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corisande

His Aus Service Record shows he dies 13 Mar 1941.

 

Victorian deaths shows age 60, ie born 1881 !

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stevebecker

Mate,

 

The Royal Navy men appear in ALH records from time to time.

 

Like;

 

BIDMEADE    Harold Morgan    315    Pte    03 LHR    RHQ AAMC Medical Orderly WIA 2-9-15 dysentry & shock at Quinns Post (G) att 7 San Sect 6-16 to 1 LHTR 10-16 disch 14-6-17 MU Ex A Sect/3 LHFA (94) DNE (Boer War 5 VMR (1197) WIA 21-8-00 accident at Biviaan's Poort & 2 ACH (690) AKA Harold Morgan Rose) (Royal Navy deserted) different name from mother Mary Bidmeade nee Rose (CMF 1 year) 
 

Just some others

 

AIKEN    Frederick William    22981    Spr    Sig GSR    tos 1 LH Sig Sqn 11-18 att 2 LH Sig Troop 4-19 rtn 5-19 married before emb (Royal Navy 10 years & RAN 2 years) 
ALLEN    James William    987    Spr    4 LH Sig Trp    HQ 8-15 (G) to Cpl 4 Div Sig Co 3-16 to Sgt 3-17 prom 2/Lt F&B Ex 1 Div Sig Co DNE AKA James William Cox (British Royal Navy HMS "Artheusa" 2 years)
ARMSTRONG    William Lincoln    2357    Pte    ICC    9R to 18Co/4Bn ICC 7-17 to CSqn/14 LHR 8-18 (Boer War Royal Navy)
ASHFORTH    Edward McKellow    17561    Spr    1 Div Cav Sig Sqn    1R Mesoptamia Tos Basrah 6-17 to Cpl 8-17 to 1 Wls Sig Sqn 5-18 (British Royal Navy RNR 3 years)
BAILEY    James Henry    20008    Pte    AAMC GR    June 1918 R tos 4 LHFA 8-18 (British Royal Navy 3 years)
BARBER    Sidney    506    Cpl    2 LH Sig Troop    HQ to Sgt Sig Sect 2-15 att Hamilton's GHQ 4-15 landed with 29 Div at Cape Helles rtn 5-15 to Troop SM 8-15 (G) to CSM 5 Div Sig Co 3-16 prom 2/Lt 5 Div Sig Co 11-16 F&B married Elsie Gilboy at Brentford UK Sept 1917 (British Royal Navy 6 years)
BROWN    Thomas    1011    Pte    8Bn    CCo evac to hosp (dysentry) 8-15 rtn 12-15 (G) to 2Co/1Bn ICC 2-16 WIA 19-4-17 R/leg/buttock shot at 2nd Gaza rtn 6-17 to L/Cpl 11-17 to T/Cpl (from Morris) 12-17 to Cpl 4-18 to 14 LHR 7-18 RTA 1914 leave (British Royal Navy 4 years) 
BUCKLEY    George Thomas    1613    Pte    7 LHR    12R Tos 12-15 to 12Co/3Bn ICC 7-16 WIA 23-3-17 L/Leg shot at 1st Gaza to 11Co/3Bn 5-18 to 15 LHR 7-18 (British Royal Navy 1908) 
BUTLER    Frank Robert    47    Pte    11 LHR    MG Sect att MG Sect/02 LHR 8-15 (G) disch 6-2-17 MU (British Royal Navy 5 years)
BUXTON    Frank Edgar    273    2/Cpl    1 Sqn AFC    C Flight batman? N/R WIA 7-7-16 R/hand accident amputated fingers to War Chest Fund London UK 9-16 to Cpl 30 Trg Sqn RFC Shawbury UK 6-17 to Sgt 6 Trg Sqn AFC 1-18 to ARS 1 Wing 1-18 to Flt Sgt 3-18 to Chief Mech 12-18 (British Royal Navy 14 yeas) later WWII 
CARROLL    William James    69    Pte    01 LHR    MG Sect to 1 LH Bde HQ (41) 7-15 att 1 Div HQ 11-15 WIA 9-12-15 head shrapnel at Old No 3 Post (G) WIA 7-6-16 hand injury bomb near Tel el Kebir disch 29-12-16 (British 14th (King's) Hussars) 3 years and Royal Navy Res 5 years)
CARTER    James    705    Pte    03 LHR    2R tos A Sqn 4-15 (G) to L/Cpl 1-17 (British Royal Navy 8 years)
CHAPMAN    Frederick    17954    Spr    1+2 Fld Trps    Tos ADS 7-17 to 1 LH FSE 3-19 att 6 LHR 4-19 rtn 6-19 Ex Pte FCo/1Bn AN&MEF (707) to Rabaul disch 18-1-15 (British RFA 3 years (1907-10) and Royal Navy 2 years (1910-12) 
COMBER    John Henry Thomas    3336    Pte    ICC    12R to 18Co/4Bn ICC 12-17 to HQ/4Bn 5-18 to 14 LHR 7-18 (British Royal Navy 13 months)
COOKE    Arthur William    493    Pte    02 LHR    C Sqn (G) to T/Cpl (from staines) 12-15 att WFF to Cpl 5-16 to Sgt 13Co/3Bn ICC 7-16 to Yeomanry Depot 11-16 to 42 Div Dtls 11-16 to 4 ADBD 1-17 to 49Bn 1-17 prom 2/Lt 8-2-17 to hosp (trench feet) 4-17 rtn 7-17 to hosp (prostatitis) 5-18 F&B RTA 1914 leave (British Duke of Edinburgh Own Volunteer Rifles TF 2 years and 1 year Royal Navy) brother Robert 2 LHR
COOKE    Robert Edgar    494    Pte    02 LHR    C Sqn WIA 3-11-15 R/arm shell shrapnel at Old No 3 Post (G) disch 26-4-16 AKA Robins Edgar Cooke (British Duke of Edinburgh Own Volunteer Rifles Cape Colony 2 years and 1 year Royal Navy) brother Arthur 2 LHR
CUSACK    Sidney Claude    20546    A/Sgt    Lt Motor Wls Sig    D Troop Mesoptamia Tos Cpl Basrah 3-18 to 1 Wls Sig Sqn 3-18 to A/Sgt 2-19 revert 5-19 to NME UK telegraphy (British Royal Navy 12 years)
DAVIS    Joseph Oswald    19386    Pte    14 AGH    3R to AAMC Trg unit 1-18 (British Royal Navy 18 months)
DICKSON    Thomas    2311    Pte    11 LHR    18R Tos C Sqn 9-17 EX AB Dvr 13R/RANBT (485) deserted 25-4-16 (Ex 26R/05 LHR (3259) DNE AKA Thomas Grahame Dickson (British The Highland Light Infantry 5 years to Royal Navy 3 years) 
DONALD    Thomas William    1084    Pte    1 Remts    4 Sqn disch 7-12-16 MU (British Royal Navy 18 years) real age 59 son Horace 15Bn KIA
FARQUHARSON    Edgar Richard    17118    Spr    1 Wls Sig Sqn    7R to Mesoptamia Tos Basrah 1-17 to Dvr 12-17 (British Royal Navy 2 years)
FOLEY    Lawrence    2370    Pte    05 LHR    16R DNE disch 26-6-16 MU relist 2/AM AFCR 3 special draft (2694) to AFC Trg depot Wendover UK 4-18 to A/Cpl 5-18 to AIF depots UK 9-18 (British Royal Navy 5 years) AKA Lawrence Llewellyn Foley
FOSTER    Thomas Arthur Benjamin    19237    Spr    LH Sig Svc    Special Reinf tos W Corps Sig Co 4-18 to 2 LH Sig Sqn 7-18 (British Royal Navy 7 years)
FRENCH    Frederick Charles    132    Pte    12 LHR    A Sqn remained in Egypt att AKS 9-15 rtn 3-16 to hosp (burns accident not stated) 4-16 to ADS 8-16 rtn 7-17 (B) to hosp (lumbago) 1-18 RTA MU disch 22-11-18 (British Royal Navy Reserve 4 years)
GIBBS    Ernest Albert    156    Sgt    1 Sqn AFC    A Flight driver att 17 Sqn RFC 4-16 to Flt/Sgt A Flight 6-16 CdeG (F) & MID - reasons not stated to 8 Trg Sqn AFC UK 4-18 to Chief Mech 5-18 (British Royal Navy 10 years)
GLOVER    James Cutshaw    961    Arm/Sgt    6 LHR    RHQ (G) disch 4-9-16 MU enteric (British Armourer PO 2nd class Royal Navy 9 years)
GOULD    John Anthony    16874    Pte    ACFA    NTOS to TC&DC 9-17 to 2 LHFA 1-18 later WWII (British steward Royal Navy 3 years) 
HALL    James Wincote    2116    Pte    7 LHR    14R att AProvC Anzac Police Cairo 4-16 tos 7-16 to S/Smith 1 LH FSE 7-16 rtn S/Smith A Sqn 12-16 to B Sqn 1-17 to ADS 1-18 (British Royal Navy 9 years & Boer War Roberts' Horse & Badens Powells Horse 2 years)
HAMMELL    Wilton    14561    Dvr    AASC R Div LH LofC    27R May 1917 to AASC Dtls UK 10-17 to 23Co 3 Div Trn 8-18 F&B to APayC AIF HQ UK 1-19 moved to USA 1921 (British Royal Navy 3 years) 
HAMPTON    Henry    1955    Pte    2 Remts    7 Sqn disch 19-6-16 (British Royal Navy 3 years)
HANNAH    Robert Kennedy    239    Pte    12 MG Co    2R to Res Co 7-16 tos 13Co/3Bn ICC 7-16 WIA 28-3-18 L/arm and chest shot reported 5 killed and 21 wounded in fighting around Hill 3039 at Amman RTA wounded (British Royal Navy 12 years) 
HAWKINS    William Christopher Loftus    5087    Dvr    3 LH Bde Trn    12Co AASC remain Egypt to 1 LH Sig Sqn 3-16 to L/Cpl 10-17 to 2/Cpl 10-18 to UK leave (British Royal Navy Aux 3 months)
HEARN    William Henry    3661    Pte    01 LHR    33R to AMC 2 ASH 3-18 to 4 LHFA 5-18 RTA MU old wound Ex 3R/4Bn (1560) Tos 5-15 WIA 6/9-8-15 L/thigh bomb shrapnel in fighting at Lone Pine (G) disch 17-8-16 relist (British Royal Navy 3 months) author "Sentinel's Weights Right System of Selection and Staking"
JENNS    Stanley Cresswell    258    Batman    05 LHR    RHQ batman (G) att 2 LH Bde HQ 5-17 to 3 LH Bde HQ 10-17 to Spr "D" Field Troop & Bridge Trn 6-18 (British Royal Navy 10 months) 
KEELAN    William    773    Pte    05 LHR    3R tos A Sqn 7-15 (G) died fractued skull in motor accident hit by car driven by Mr C Garrett at Tylers Hill Abbey Wood near Woolwich Kent UK buried Woolwich Cemetery London UK married Elizabeth Coskry at Kirkeudbright Scotland 12-10-15 (British Royal Navy and The King's Own Scottish Borderers TF 4 years)
KELLY    David    44    Pte    05 LHR    MG Sect to L/Cpl 8-15 (G) to 25Bn 9-16 to Pte 31Bn (44a) 10-16 WIA 15-3-17 L/arm, R/thigh & L/buttock bomb during patrol work to see if Germans had withdrawn from R1 Trench to Bapaume F&B (British Royal Navy 2 years)
LAMB    Edwin de Villiers        2/Lt    6 LHR    16R to 2 LHTR 6-16 tos 11Co/3Bn 7-16 to T/OC 14Co/3Bn ICC 5-17 to HQ/1Bn 10-17 to Adjt Port Said rest camp 11-17 to 14 LHR (NTOS) 7-18 to hosp (bronchitis) 1-19 RTA MU relist Lt Special Service AIF To DAAG AIF HQ UK 10-19 later CBE (British Royal Navy 1 year) (Boer War South African Field Force & Cattle Rangers ) 
 

Cheers


S.B

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Droocoo
Posted (edited)

Hi all,

 

Is there any way of ever nailing down his real name?

 

Perhaps the passenger arrivals, but given that he has not turned up under any of the last names that are associated with his service papers, I am at a loss really.

Interesting to note that a few of the light horse men had Royal Navy service previously.

 

I am not entirely sure how to proceed here

 

Kindest Regards,

 

Andrew

Edited by Droocoo

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