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Conchita

Can anyone Tell me as much information as possible about the markings on this Shell casing

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Conchita

I found an Old 4.5 Howitzer shell casing in my fathers shed (he had been using it as an ashtray) which i am sure he got from his father, i managed to clean it up and it has all sorts of markings on it, so feel free to treat me as a complete Novice.
Apologies for the Brightness of the Light in the middle of the shell (but it does not obscure any markings) it was the best i could get it to show up all the markings in one photo.

i include 2 of the middle part (yes i did say a complete novice lol)

I think i understand the 2 upper and lower holes in the center of the casing is to take out the central piece, but not sure what the slightly two smaller holes are for.

so the things i would like to know are: what EACH marking on it may mean, i tired looking up the two on the right but coming up with not much  information.
many thanks in advance for as much info as you can throw my way

01.jpg

02.jpg

03.jpg

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Michael Haselgrove

Hi Conchita,

Welcome to the Forum.  You have a 4.5" Howitzer cartridge manufactured in 1916.  The A. & J.M.A. MFG CO. marking is the manufacturer of the cartridge namely the Albert & J.M Anderson Mfg. Co. U.S.A.  In respect of the central piece, that is the primer, it was manufactured in March 1916.  The initials M.W.T. / E.A. are the manufacturer which was Marconi Wireless Co., Marconi Works, Chelmsford. 

No doubt others will come up with more information. 

Hope this is of interest.

Michael. 

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Conchita
Posted (edited)

so the Casing was made in the USA and then shipped to the UK and then the Primer put in? or did they ship them out to where they were fighting and then put them together?
how can it be so precise of the month and year of Primer Manufacture is that the 3/16 at the bottom?
and thanks for the information, its getting really interesting.

 

also i cleaned this up with Wire wool, is there a right way or a wrong way to clean casings?

Edited by Conchita

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MikB

The two small marks adjacent to the spanner slots in the primer are dot-punches - a common technique in many branches of engineering to stop threaded components coming unscrewed accidentally. It's done with a hammer and coned centre-punch, and peens a bit of metal from each component into the other, as well as distorting the screw thread. I don't know, but I'd think it more likely it was done to the fired case to keep its primer in place for sale as a relic/souvenir/memorabilium.

 

I think there was a continuous trade in unfilled cartridge cases and shell bodies from the US for filling and assembly here in Blighty.

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Conchita

keep coming with the Info, this is sooo interesting :thumbsup:

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depaor01
54 minutes ago, MikB said:

I think there was a continuous trade in unfilled cartridge cases and shell bodies from the US for filling and assembly here in Blighty.

The Lusitania's manifest for her last voyage listed 1,250 empty artillery shells which would back up that assertion.

 

Dave

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MikB
9 hours ago, depaor01 said:

The Lusitania's manifest for her last voyage listed 1,250 empty artillery shells which would back up that assertion.

 

Dave

 

Yes, and the undisguised presence of American maker's marks on such items should establish that there was no attempt to conceal this traffic.

 

Nevertheless neither the passengers on Lusitania nor the U-boat crew that sank her had any knowledge of that cargo.

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depaor01
32 minutes ago, MikB said:

 

Yes, and the undisguised presence of American maker's marks on such items should establish that there was no attempt to conceal this traffic.

 

Nevertheless neither the passengers on Lusitania nor the U-boat crew that sank her had any knowledge of that cargo.

Agreed on both counts. My post was simply to elaborate on yours. 

Dave 

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wmfinch

Does the '11' stamped on the Primer denote that it was filled at National Filling Station No 11 at Abbey Wood in London?

 

Just a thought .

 

V/R

 

Wayne

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Conchita
Posted (edited)

thank you all for the ongoing Information.

still not 100% sure exactly where it came from, i do know my father had it in his Shed and that he got it from his father who also used to keep it in his shed (at least it likes sheds lol) but where he got it from i have no idea as he was always collecting stuff.

 

what suddenly hit me is my Great Uncle Died 14th July 1916 which is 4 months after the primer was put in this Shell Casing.

 

Walter Percy Baker.png

Edited by Conchita
Thinking of possibly somehow Getting this info and shell info together (not sure if Engraving on the shell would be the right thing to do)

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Conchita

is there any way of dating the shell like the Primer?
was thinking that Lot number might be some information (but seeing as war records have a tendency to not be available, might not be in luck)

also what does the n01 over II mean? is this a version number of the primer?

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14276265
Posted (edited)

The shell fired with this cartridge would have had date, maker, material and inspection information stamped into the steel body, usually just above the driving band. Filling information - including date of filling - would then have been stencilled onto the painted body.

 

The primer is a No.1 MkII, made in March 1916 and filled in April at NFF 11, which is indeed Abbey Wood.

 

The punch marks on the circumference of the primer were done on insertion of the primer into the cartridge case at the Filling Factory. "Stabbing" as it is technically known is done to lock the primer in place by local distortion of the threads. It is an alternative, or in addition, to using Pettman cement.

 

 

 

265

Edited by 14276265
Stabbing explanation

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Conchita

Thanks for the extra info, i think the only thing i don;t know is the lot 94 meaning (am thinking its what batch it came from when made) was wondering is there any record of LOTs?

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