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themonsstar

Allied PoW

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themonsstar

Does  anyone know how many allied PoWs were captured at Gallipoli and are there any lists for them

 

Thank you for your time.

 

Roy

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themonsstar

Cheers Charlie

 

I was looking for the hole number of PoWs captured.

 

Thank you for the link

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Maureene

There are some statistics on page 329, although difficult to read as the page needs to be rotated.

Statistics of the Military Effort of the British Empire during the Great War, 1914-1920 

https://archive.org/stream/statisticsofmili00grea#page/329/mode/1up

 

There appear to be very few. I think this was because most potential prisoners were killed immediately, and never became POWs.

 

Cheers

Maureen

 

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charlie962
1 hour ago, Maureene said:

most potential prisoners were killed immediately

A selected few (for reasons I don't know) were kept alive and ended up in Turkish PoW camps. But not for the majority.

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emrezmen

Dear Roy,

 

There are some lists available. In 2009, Turkish General Staff published testimonies, letters and lists of Allied soldiers captured during the campaign, in a book of two volumes.

 

These lists are annoyingly complicated and some names are missing. As a result of that, my source may not reflect the exact number of POWs. Moreover, there are some horrible typos. Some of the names can be difficult to understand. This is because lists are transcribed/translated mostly from handwritten documents in Old Turkish (or English).

 

IMG_5008.JPG.dbddda1e8e45150ea86fbd689f25de1b.JPGIMG_5012.JPG.51f349007149837f956b60e59c56aff4.JPGIMG_5013.JPG.c1d396fc88846f2e7c93c8953d255744.JPGIMG_5014.JPG.a6ec82766a734aca6f5a7297863b7909.JPGIMG_5016.JPG.cf057872f09e1c2e3e8dbdb4dd70cff4.JPGIMG_5043.JPG.0f72813f1b6437751ad45b4c3048c876.JPGIMG_5042.JPG.3f581639d6d7bb869f0bde28d25747ef.JPGIMG_5041.JPG.aec9c6a798ecb5e98c71e57507cd3fcb.JPGIMG_5040.JPG.b68107fb11879e36211526dc46ad6dad.JPGIMG_5017.JPGIMG_5018.JPGIMG_5038.JPG.5789733b186b96c36571a567e5265c27.JPGIMG_5037.JPG.7a08f1495f542bd04eb4bb4855fa1e27.JPGIMG_5036.JPG.8ba4881dd3cfbba988411e8e022571f7.JPGIMG_5034.JPG.0e308c2874e0c4bcdeda011fa6dd37d9.JPGIMG_5032.JPG.e49883f18f8cb4cd49adad2b333f308c.JPGIMG_5031.JPG.e76606f72e70ee418aa08df65e86a523.JPGIMG_5030.JPG.e84e054f03d222e6169581a3d327d4e9.JPGIMG_5028.JPG.3a4fc879ebe6e9f0cf0d7b9f5bb10c78.JPGIMG_5027.JPG.73d613e27a2dab1e63aad0e4b07e2eac.JPGIMG_5026.JPG.0e8496820dfdffbf1a133c2138307a80.JPGIMG_5023.JPGIMG_5025.JPG.733c0fd1ce1c7e928fcfc77c299fcb1f.JPGIMG_5022.JPGIMG_5020.JPG.246f4f26f8a7f22376d411b99ec59944.JPGIMG_5019.JPG

 

 

Another, simpler version: (Some names may be missing)

IMG_4997-499.jpg.3f43e0610cad7e2c2f7b486e6e02c727.jpg

IMG_5001-503.jpg.d0e615f370509cddc2c93d16e14e2f82.jpg

IMG_5004-506.jpg.a164ce69675013470922d57acc3a5787.jpg

IMG_5049-550.thumb.jpg.cc5a9fb8c498b2f22bf59bb858835a95.jpg

IMG_5051-504.jpg.5440a2af22705a7ace250b93caedd22f.jpgIMG_5046-5047-horz.jpg.6a418e79aefa268afcfd47dfdcf649e8.jpg

IMG_5051-504.jpg.5440a2af22705a7ace250b93caedd22f.jpg

 

Source:
IMG_5044.JPG.d7de331bc8c5fdab75c84895f8034eff.JPG

 

And figures from official source that suggested before in post #4. 

 

aaa00.jpg.9c30148e2dae06b4b6ff93dcd26083e4.jpg

aaa4.jpg.4b80a7f5a4993891bfc306c4804df4ff.jpg

aaa2.jpg.9d01bdc48d026ef0af982dea7dd75a60.jpg

aaa3.jpg.f197293a28b47160e5c32bbb7d7329c6.jpg

aaa.jpg.386c37f3dfcf9472ffba5dd0fe36892b.jpg

bbb.jpg.3590a41783640f77e905f939fb828ca0.jpg

 

 

Edited by emrezmen

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charlie962

Well done Emrezmen for finding those detailed Rolls.  By taking a couple of names off them and comparing to the ICRC database I see there are listings in the range R5531-R5542 which are probably all Gallipoli men. Again around R5900 where their place of capture is given. Not easy to tie up due to mis-spelling and ICRC misfiling but looks practical to try and compile an fairly accurate list of these depressingly small numbers.

 

Just taking a random example from the long list above:

Mathew Lennon, 6th Bn R Dublin Fusiliers, died 29/11/15 ( source SDGW): -(died as a PoW per Casualty Lists)

 

 

in the above long list:5aeeea0d5cb6f_GallipoliPoWLennonM1.JPG.cb0d7193d091f0096bf2bf514717f7cd.JPG

but not on the short list ?

 

 

on ICRC: as captured Anafarta 12/8/15 and died 29/11/16 R6429 (also on list R5542 as Leunon)     

             5aeeeb31db9bc_GallipoliPoWLennonM2.JPG.6ace06426e22a8d55de65bcbbcdb2a27.JPG

 

Charlie

 

edit. Checking back the other way, Grimes CW, Cpl 15/Norfolks on  R6429 above is on long listing above as

          5aeeee9358f74_GallipoliPoWGrimesCW1.JPG.cee7b3670c72448ada5f81071cb45fc6.JPG

but I couldn't see him on short listing?

 

He is on SDGW as William charles Grimes, 322, 1/5 Norfolks, died 12/9/15

 

It would be interesting to know what documents the 'long listing' in the 2009 Turkish General Staff publication was compiled from. What are the reference numbers in the 'short listing' ?

     

Edited by charlie962

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emrezmen
16 hours ago, charlie962 said:

 

in the above long list:5aeeea0d5cb6f_GallipoliPoWLennonM1.JPG.cb0d7193d091f0096bf2bf514717f7cd.JPG

but not on the short list ?

 

edit. Checking back the other way, Grimes CW, Cpl 15/Norfolks on  R6429 above is on long listing above as

          5aeeee9358f74_GallipoliPoWGrimesCW1.JPG.cee7b3670c72448ada5f81071cb45fc6.JPG

but I couldn't see him on short listing?

 

It would be interesting to know what documents the 'long listing' in the 2009 Turkish General Staff publication was compiled from. What are the reference numbers in the 'short listing' ?

 

The short list contains only the names of those who have statements in the book. It's kinda "Table of Contents" part and those numbers are just page numbers. Sorry for not mentioning about that.

 

The detailed list was compiled from documents held in ATASE (Askerî Tarih ve Stratejik Etüt Başkanlığı/Directorate of Military History and Strategic Studies) Archives at Ankara. Originally they're all Old Turkish.

 

An example from original Old Turkish lists:

 

IMG_5060.JPG.5eaf358fb0798f0ed016a21bb84e4e04.JPG

 

And a little bit of reference list for prisoner statements:

 

IMG_5063.JPG.6b74fa0a6aa074c4ccdc68d02da5803a.JPG


 

 

 

 

Edited by emrezmen

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charlie962

Thanks for that.

Charlie

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b3rn

I haven’t read this book but have read the thesis on which it is based. Worth tracking down.

Kismet: the story of the Gallipoli prisoners of war by Jennifer Lawless.

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themonsstar

Thank you all who have contributed to the post.

Here some of the British Pow Index  from the Documents and one of the statements this one is from Maj Herbert Alfred  Brett 4th Bn Worcestershire Regiment.

 

 

PoW Index 2.JPG

PoW Index 3.JPG

PoW Index 4.JPG

PoW Index 5.JPG

PoW Index 6.JPG

PoW Index 7.JPG

PoW Index 8.JPG

PoW Index 9.JPG

PoW Index 10.JPG

PoW Index 11.JPG

PoW Index 12.JPG

PoW Index 13.JPG

PoW Index 14.JPG

PoW Index 15.JPG

Pow Index.JPG

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