Jump to content
Free downloads from TNA ×
The Great War (1914-1918) Forum

Remembered Today:

Why no grave? Coldstream Guards


danikagrace

Recommended Posts

Hi all, my husband is trying to find out more about his great uncle after a recent very moving trip to Ypres with my family. 

 

Here's what we know so far: 

John Deegan - 1st Bn. Coldstream Guards 10353 died 08 October 1914 aged 23. He is recorded as "Killed in action" and is commemorated on La Ferté-sous-Jouarre Memorial to the Missing. 

 

However when studying the war diary for 1st Bn. (page attached) it doesn't record any "action" that day and only records 12 men as dead/missing in the relevant time period, however cwgc shows 19 of 1st battalion dead in the same timeframe. This has left us very confused!! Can anyone with better understanding shine any light?? 

Others in the same Bn. who died at the same time are buried at Braine Communal Cemetery, does this mean it is possible John is buried there as a soldier 'known unto God'? 

 

We would also love to know when he enlisted if that's possible to find out?

 

Thank you so much in advance for the help or guidance, it's greatly appreciated! 

30850_A000435-00823.jpg

8810c8b2b7bc43783b82ecd9ab20b8e9.png

Screenshot_20180330-194536.png

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I can help with enlistment, the Soldier’s effects register on Ancestry, shows that John enlisted on 6 September, 1913, and a the time was employed as a ’town carter’.

 

Mark

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ahhh thank you so much Mark! So he enlisted before the war? That makes sense as to why he was shipped out so early. I wonder what he was doing in the army (if anything) before the war, and if there was any 'talk' of impending war in Sep 1913... (apologies to all for my ignorance, I'm new to war history and have much to learn!)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The area where your man was killed is such a relatively small area & was pounded by shell fire for the next 4 yrs many graves were destroyed later & no trace found of them. Those men who were buried in marked graves & still found were the lucky ones. The whole time of Oct. 1914 was a confused chaotic time for the troops there & things almost gave way several times & much of the old regular army was destroyed in the fighting there.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As Loader says above, many battlefield graves were destroyed. The lucky ones were found, some cases where two graves were close and two sets of body parts found its not uncommon to find two names on a headstone.

the war diary would only give names of officers as casualties, the rest being noted as  nco's or or's (other ranks).

as the diary does not list action you say, it's possible he died of wounds he received  the previous day 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

In the 25th of November, 1914 newspaper the 21st of October casualty list is published.

 

Deegan is listed as "Killed", not Died of Wounds or Died.

 

His date of death could be an administrative one, as in the first roll call (some days after an action) the battalion held.

 

Cheers,
Derek.

Edited by Derek Black
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thank you so much @Derek Black @chazand @Loader that's all so interesting. So he likely was buried but there was no grave to come back to by the end of the war, that makes sense, so harrowing. 

In the relevant time period the war diary records the "daily bombardment" of shell fire affecting their trench only "slightly"... Maybe he was one of the 7 recorded as killed in the diary during this 'slight' daily bombardment period?! 

 

We're still confused as to why the cwgc records more deaths in that couple of weeks in 1st Bn. than the war diary does, but I take it that could be all part of the chaos and confusion you mentioned? 

 

@Derek Black which newspaper are you referring to? Is it available by subscription online anywhere?

 

Thanks again all 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The diary was lost at some point during 1914 hence errors

 

Contemporary Coldstream records show him as killed .  There is also a other  with a very similar name, J DEGAAN killed in the CG in 1914 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi,

 

Date of entry to France 26th August 1914 suggests he was part of the the 1st Reinforcement draft to 1st CG - likely joining the Battalion on or about 4th September. My gf has same date of entry and joined 2nd CG 4th September 1914.

 

Steve

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 3 weeks later...

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...