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The Great War (1914-1918) Forum

Remembered Today:

Machine Gun Corps tactics 1917


RammyLad1

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According to the L.L.T., by 1917, the machine gun was used to provide additional protection during an attack by indirect fire over the heads of the advancing troops. Would this have been from a Vickers gun rather than the lighter Lewis gun?  Also would the Lewis gun be carried with the infantry advance and at the front of the attack?

 

Duncan 

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Duncan

The MGC did use indirect fire, for both offensive and defensive purposes, from at least July 1916, when Lt-Col. Graham Seton-Hutchison's 33rd MGC fired off over a million rounds in one session (there are links on the site to this). 

 

The Lewis gun took over the Vickers gun role in the battalions, but it was used in various tactical ways and was not usually used in the front of an attack, as far as I know. Its use changed over time and lewis gunners often comprised the whole of a Battalion section.

 

Mike

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Thanks Mike. The war diary of the 55th Company Machine gun corps on 12/10/17 mentions that 16 guns took part in an attack in conjunction with the 55th Infantry Brigade. This made me wonder if the more mobile Lewis gun was carried forward at the same time as the infantry attack.

 

Duncan 

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I've seen evidence of indirect firing plans in MMG war diaries. The one attached from 24th Battery. Setting up pre planned fire on the  rear of the German lines. In this case was timed to fire on the supply road and entrance to the German communication trenches minutes after a mine detonation and artillery barrage would prompt a flurry of activity in that area. This seems to have been a common use of the motorcycle units as being mobile they inserted by roads behind the British lines and set up to fire often at extreme range over both British and German lines. The war diary indicates they scouted and chose the firing points some days earlier, and drew up their own plan (I've superimposed that over the trench map and current Google view).

map.jpg

trench map complete - Copy.jpg

firing plan.jpg

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3 hours ago, RammyLad1 said:

Thanks Mike. The war diary of the 55th Company Machine gun corps on 12/10/17 mentions that 16 guns took part in an attack in conjunction with the 55th Infantry Brigade. This made me wonder if the more mobile Lewis gun was carried forward at the same time as the infantry attack.

 

Duncan 

Hi

 

By 12/10/17 the Lewis gun is on issue at one per platoon and is an infantry weapon, by about mid 1918 it is on issue at 2 per platoon, 36 per battalion, with four at battalion HQ for AA use.  It is not really a MGC weapon but one of the infantry's.

 

Mike

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David, thank you for the detailed reply. I would think that this would be from a static position, possibly Vickers guns.

Mike, thanks for your reply. The chap in question was killed on that day and is recorded as being in the 55th Company machine gun corps (Infantry). 

 

Duncan 

 

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I heard a WW1 US veteran speak of his MG Battn. in 1918. They recd orders to lay their guns on certain compass heading & elevation & to fire until all ammo exhausted or orders to cease fire had been recd. He said they did as ordered & fired for a length of time til the cease fire order came. Later that day they moved forward & came to a sunken road filled with enemy bodies. Their CO told them that was the target they had been firing on by compass & this was the result. He had a steel helmet he took from a body as a souvenier & said they used indirect fire a few more times before the end of the war. He said they fired thousands of rounds that day & it must have literally rained bullets on the enemy troops.

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  • 1 year later...

A fascinating article, I have never seen the figure questioned before. I was very aware that he was a fascinating if controversial individual. For a quick overview of the man himself it's worth checking out his Wikipedia entry. Not least also he has been accused of acting as a paid propagandist ( PR man) for Hitler and the Nazi party prior to WW 2, when we were at peace, although I have seen any proof of the assertion.

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19 hours ago, David Filsell said:

A fascinating article, I have never seen the figure questioned before. I was very aware that he was a fascinating if controversial individual. For a quick overview of the man himself it's worth checking out his Wikipedia entry. Not least also he has been accused of acting as a paid propagandist ( PR man) for Hitler and the Nazi party prior to WW 2, when we were at peace, although I have seen any proof of the assertion.

David

 

Thanks for your comments about the article I’m glad it’s of interest. I’ve done some wider reading around his later life and there’s a lot of complexity to him which we wanted to avoid directly in this article as there are at least facts to discount this event rather than just counter-political views. 

 

For those that are picking this up on the old thread, but it does mention the one million rounds above, this is the link to the information on the article: https://vickersmg.blog/2019/08/13/one-million-rounds-fired-in-12-hours/

 

There is also a lot more information on machine gun tactics and the Machine Gun Corps on the wider site.

 

Richard

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Richard

Very wise to avoid his after life. I am told he has a daughter who is very quick to leap on the unfaithful!

Thanks again

David

Edited by David Filsell
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