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Remembered Today:

81st Siege Battery


Mike Cumming

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HELLO I AM RESEARCHING 

Name:  RICHARD BURT

Rank:    Lance Corporal (Bombardier)

Regiment/Service: 81st Siege Battery, Royal Garrison Artillery

Age: 19 years

Date of Death:  14 February 1918

Service No:  150332

Remembered with Honour:

Etaples Military Cemetery, France

Cannot find any information on where he may have been wounded (28th January 1918) or what the battery was involved in during January 1918 any information greatly appreciated.

Thanks 

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Mike,

The demise of Burt is not mentioned in the 81 Sge Bty war diary as it does not cover the period, ending in June17 (be careful as it’s the third on that list the first two being the 81 Brigade WD’s and not the Siege Bty). The Brigade the 81 Sge Bty came under at the time was the 48 Brigade RGA but again unfortunately there is no mention in that WD either. Just after the war a booklet was published “History of 81 Siege Battery RGA by Major H J C Gale.” It reads:

On Jan 6th the battery moved to Frezenburg…January 20th Bdr Burt was wounded and died in hospital on February 4th (sic).

That is the only mention and note the death date differs from that of CWGC and that of his wounding which you give.

What do the local newspapers proffer?

Rgds Paul

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31 minutes ago, ororkep said:

 The Brigade the 81 Sge Bty came under at the time was the 48 Brigade RGA

Rgds Paul

 My mistake, thanks for the correction Paul, I'm still learning!

Best wishes

David

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The History of 81 Siege Battery published by Major Gale was written by Gunner Sydney Hall.  It was apparently published without checking or final corrections to the proofs much to Hall's disappointment. The error in the date of death could well be one item that was overlooked.

 

Peter

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1 hour ago, petwes said:

The History of 81 Siege Battery published by Major Gale was written by Gunner Sydney Hall.  It was apparently published without checking or final corrections to the proofs much to Hall's disappointment. The error in the date of death could well be one item that was overlooked.

 

Peter

 

Not sure there is one correct fact in anything you have written. If there is perhaps you can inform me, and Paul, the reasons for your post. Perhaps you are thinking of "Battery Action".

 

Kevin

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Sorry Kevin and Paul if I have caused upset.

I am indeed quoting Gunner Hall from his diary published in "Battery Action" . 

I was referring to his account on page 379  in Chapter 32.  His personal account reads:

 

"Some months afterwards I wrote to the CO of 81 Siege Battery asking him what had happened to the Battery History on which I was engaged before I went on leave. I got quite a friendly letter from Major Gale wishing me success in civilian life and stating that my history had been published and how many copies I would like.

I sent for a couple of copies but was most disappointed when they arrived. It seemed that the proofs had never been corrected and consequentially there were quite a lot of mis-spellings particularly of the French names."

 

You ask for the reason for my post; I was trying to point out, perhaps awkwardly, that the date of death as recorded in the official records should be replied upon by the OP and could well have been either been recorded incorrectly in Hall's personal diary or miss- transcribed in the history that was published by Major Gale. 

 

I took Gunner Hall's first hand account as true and perhaps naively assumed it could be taken as read. He is certainly critical of some aspects of his service and some of his  commanders but overall his account rings true to me. 

It would certainly change my opinion totally if he turns out to be a fantasist claiming credit for a History written by someone else and would cast doubt on the entire contents of his diary!

 

Peter

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5 minutes ago, petwes said:

Sorry Kevin and Paul if I have caused upset.

I am indeed quoting Gunner Hall from his diary published in "Battery Action" . 

I was referring to his account on page 379  in Chapter 32.  His personal account reads:

 

"Some months afterwards I wrote to the CO of 81 Siege Battery asking him what had happened to the Battery History on which I was engaged before I went on leave. I got quite a friendly letter from Major Gale wishing me success in civilian life and stating that my history had been published and how many copies I would like.

I sent for a couple of copies but was most disappointed when they arrived. It seemed that the proofs had never been corrected and consequentially there were quite a lot of mis-spellings particularly of the French names."

 

You ask for the reason for my post; I was trying to point out, perhaps awkwardly, that the date of death as recorded in the official records should be replied upon by the OP and could well have been either been recorded incorrectly in Hall's personal diary or miss- transcribed in the history that was published by Major Gale. 

 

I took Gunner Hall's first hand account as true and perhaps naively assumed it could be taken as read. He is certainly critical of some aspects of his service and some of his  commanders but overall his account rings true to me. 

It would certainly change my opinion totally if he turns out to be a fantasist claiming credit for a History written by someone else and would cast doubt on the entire contents of his diary!

 

Peter

 

You may now be quoting Gnr. Hall's diary, but Paul was referencing The History of 81Sge Bty RGA by Major Gale. You wrote "The History of 81 Siege Battery published by Major Gale was written by Gunner Sydney Hall.  It was apparently published without checking or final corrections to the proofs much to Hall's disappointment. The error in the date of death could well be one item that was overlooked." Two completely different books. "Battery Action" was compiled/edited by Paul Cobb. The diary of Gnr. Hall I found very good, but was disappointed by the poor research by Paul Cobb identifying members of the battery (fairly easily found), and the poor acknowledgment of who actually wrote the diary on the front cover and even his choice of gun to be printed illustrate it.

 

Kevin 

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Kevin

Thanks for the reply. 

I found Gunner Hall's diary a very good read and for me helpful in understanding life in a Siege Battery.  I hadn't picked up on the lack of detailed research to individual battery members, even though there seem to be a fair number of end notes after each chapter; maybe this was a publisher's or editor's choice?

I have re-read the last couple of chapters of Battery action and by Hall's account he provided a completed  manuscript for the Battery History based on his diary and interviews with battery members to Major Gale in December 1918 just before going on leave.  He records that he was expecting to be given printer's proofs for final checking before publication but this did not occur.  What I do not know is how much the manuscript was added to and changed by Major Gale before publication; I have not read The History of 81Siege Battery so was wrong in attributing its authorship entirely to Hall as no doubt there is an introduction and preface by Gale outlining his own contribution. 

Apologies for drawing the wrong conclusion. 

It was certainly a shame that Sydney Hall's name doesn't make it to the front cover of Paul Cobb's book but at least he is mentioned on the back cover! 

 

(BL 6" MkVII gun on the cover rather than a BL 8" Howitzer or have I put my foot in again)?

 

Peter

 

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  • 3 months later...

Just to put the record straight, the family member who owns the manuscript and other items relating to this account was advised that Gnr Hall's name would be on the cover but they expressed an alternative view hence the text on the cover as published.

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