arantxa Posted 12 November , 2017 Share Posted 12 November , 2017 Hi this is big and heavy its about the length of your hand and a half again it has a piece of paper says dropped by german aircraft APRILL Faversham 1915 it is also dated 1915 with german marks any idea its way to big for a fletchette and heavy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
depaor01 Posted 12 November , 2017 Share Posted 12 November , 2017 Could you post a pic of the marks? Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoppage Drill Posted 13 November , 2017 Share Posted 13 November , 2017 (edited) It may be thought to be too unnecessarily big and heavy to be an anti-personnel flechette, but it could be intended as an anti-materiel device. After all, a similar form of solid projectile (in the form of Armour Piercing Fin Stabilised Discarding Sabot) is still one of the two types of ammunition normally deployed in present day tank tactics. Edited 13 November , 2017 by Stoppage Drill Typo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolphin Posted 13 November , 2017 Share Posted 13 November , 2017 This doesn't identify the device, but whatever it is was dropped from an Albatros B.II from Feldflieger Abteilung 41, which crossed the coast at KIngsdown at 11.45 on 16 April 1915. On their way back from Sittingbourne, the crew dropped five incendiaries and, it seems, something else, over Faversham. Gareth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Bailey Posted 13 November , 2017 Share Posted 13 November , 2017 (edited) Faversham was home to a number of explosives works, grenade, depth charge and aerial bomb factories. Perhaps they hoped to set off stocks of completed munitions with this? It would be good for this to be shown in the town museum. More may come to light. Edited 13 November , 2017 by Gunner Bailey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beechhill Posted 13 November , 2017 Share Posted 13 November , 2017 Earlier threads reported flechettes going through men from head to toe. I wouldn't expect anything smaller or lighter than the op to accomplish that. /Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWF1967 Posted 13 November , 2017 Share Posted 13 November , 2017 39 minutes ago, Beechhill said: Earlier threads reported flechettes going through men from head to toe. I wouldn't expect anything smaller or lighter than the op to accomplish that. /Dan I think you'd be surprised. Here's one from a modern day anti personnel round. The flechette in the op looks much larger and heavier than any I've seen previously and is surely designed to penetrate more than civilians. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Bailey Posted 13 November , 2017 Share Posted 13 November , 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, Beechhill said: Earlier threads reported flechettes going through men from head to toe. I wouldn't expect anything smaller or lighter than the op to accomplish that. /Dan That would be the standard flechette. The one pictured must be 20 times heavier at least. In Vietnam the US used tiny mini bombs which were thrown out of helicopters by the bucketful. They would kill a man but were mainly designed the break an lorry engine on the Ho Chi Minh trail. Edited 13 November , 2017 by Gunner Bailey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbie56 Posted 13 November , 2017 Share Posted 13 November , 2017 Noticed this in a diary, possibly a reference to the item mentioned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wexflyer Posted 13 November , 2017 Share Posted 13 November , 2017 (edited) The modern small, light flechettes referred to here are explosively propelled to high velocity. That is what makes them lethal. If simply dropped from an altitude of a few hundred feet, as in the Great War, they would not gain nearly that much velocity. Flechettes that are simply being dropped need to be heavier. Edited 13 November , 2017 by Wexflyer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beechhill Posted 14 November , 2017 Share Posted 14 November , 2017 (edited) 12 hours ago, Wexflyer said: The modern small, light flechettes referred to here are explosively propelled to high velocity. That is what makes them lethal. If simply dropped from an altitude of a few hundred feet, as in the Great War, they would not gain nearly that much velocity. Flechettes that are simply being dropped need to be heavier. I agree. Even at terminal velocity the flechettes would need considerably more mass to penetrate men, equipment, and ... (allegedly) Horses(!). Khaki displayed a fine collection in this thread: Edited 14 November , 2017 by Beechhill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWF1967 Posted 14 November , 2017 Share Posted 14 November , 2017 (edited) 16 hours ago, Wexflyer said: The modern small, light flechettes referred to here are explosively propelled to high velocity. That is what makes them lethal. If simply dropped from an altitude of a few hundred feet, as in the Great War, they would not gain nearly that much velocity. Flechettes that are simply being dropped need to be heavier. Beechhill #15 Posted 14 April , 2016 I may have underestimated the effect of the flechette. I stand humbly corrected (and a little affirmed) with this quote: "... the thrumming of the engine was heard. When it was right over our heads it let fly a rack full of steel darts and they came clattering down into the village streets. One stuck into the pavement in front of our quarters. It was so deeply imbedded that not a man in the company could pull it out. These steel darts were from eight inches to a foot long, cut so that they would fall point downward. Dozens of them were contained in a single rack [...] They would go through anything they hit, but they were found to be too inaccurate and not so economical as explosives". "The Black Watch" , Joe Cassells http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/33278 Edited 14 November , 2017 by GWF1967 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Bailey Posted 14 November , 2017 Share Posted 14 November , 2017 16 hours ago, Wexflyer said: The modern small, light flechettes referred to here are explosively propelled to high velocity. That is what makes them lethal. If simply dropped from an altitude of a few hundred feet, as in the Great War, they would not gain nearly that much velocity. Flechettes that are simply being dropped need to be heavier. I doubt if a few hundred feet is correct. Far too vulnerable to small arms and Lewis gun fire. I would suggest 2000-5000ft would be more like it. This would be similar to the small mini bombs dropped in Vietnam who could go right through a human being or shatter an engine block of a lorry. I've got one somewhere. If I can find it I'll put up a photo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWF1967 Posted 14 November , 2017 Share Posted 14 November , 2017 From "Navy and Army" magazine. Jan 1915. "The Flechette. A steel arrow that will penetrate a man's body from head to foot" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
depaor01 Posted 14 November , 2017 Share Posted 14 November , 2017 That is a truly horrifying looking weapon. Were they banned? Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWF1967 Posted 14 November , 2017 Share Posted 14 November , 2017 50 minutes ago, depaor01 said: That is a truly horrifying looking weapon. Were they banned? Dave Ask a Palestinian! U.S. Vietnam era, anti personnel "devil's toothpick" flechette. 1 1/2" long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Bailey Posted 14 November , 2017 Share Posted 14 November , 2017 1 hour ago, GWF1967 said: Ask a Palestinian! U.S. Vietnam era, anti personnel "devil's toothpick" flechette. 1 1/2" long. Were these inside the 'Hive' artillery shells? Designed to fired into jungle and literally ripped everything to shreds at high velocity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWF1967 Posted 14 November , 2017 Share Posted 14 November , 2017 25 minutes ago, Gunner Bailey said: Were these inside the 'Hive' artillery shells? Designed to fired into jungle and literally ripped everything to shreds at high velocity. Yup. I'm told it was from a "beehive" round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunner Bailey Posted 14 November , 2017 Share Posted 14 November , 2017 I've had a look for mine but can't find it at present. But imagine a very small version of a WW2 500lb bomb about 2 inches long and that's what they dropped. Here's a link https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lazy_Dog_(bomb) John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arantxa Posted 26 February , 2019 Author Share Posted 26 February , 2019 Hello anyone got any new theories on the above its dated 1915 on fin the fin unscrews Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiegeGunner Posted 26 February , 2019 Share Posted 26 February , 2019 On 12/11/2017 at 21:15, arantxa said: it is also dated 1915 with german marks Could you post a close-up of the 'German marks'. It looks like a variation on an aerial flechette, designed to cause material damage. You say the fin unscrews, but is the body hollow? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NigelS Posted 26 February , 2019 Share Posted 26 February , 2019 5 minutes ago, SiegeGunner said: Could you post a close-up of the 'German marks'. It looks like a variation on an aerial flechette, designed to cause material damage. You say the fin unscrews, but is the body hollow? Thinking tangentially, if the body is hollow, could it have been to take messages for air to ground communication? Wouldn't explain why it would have been dropped on Faversham though, unless discarded in order to lighten the aircraft. NigelS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arantxa Posted 26 February , 2019 Author Share Posted 26 February , 2019 Hello its not very hollow..its quite heavy and I would have thought too heavy really for a plane for what it is..i then thought maybe a rope or string attached to it but no hole ..ive had it an awfully long time and it was from a family so its not been made up..ive just never seen anything like it and cant see why a plane would carry it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaeldr Posted 26 February , 2019 Share Posted 26 February , 2019 15 minutes ago, arantxa said: its not very hollow..its quite heavy and I would have thought too heavy really for a plane for what it is. There were bigger devices dropped by hand from aeroplanes see bottom LH illustration here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arantxa Posted 26 February , 2019 Author Share Posted 26 February , 2019 I will take some more pictures in a few days of the date etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now