Jump to content
The Great War (1914-1918) Forum

Remembered Today:

Captain Austin Patrick Hudson


Mark Hone
 Share

Recommended Posts

I am putting the finishing touches to the Centenary obituary of this old boy of Bury Grammar School and St Bees. A Gallipoli veteran, he was killed during Third Ypres serving with 1/5th Lancashire Fusiliers and is commemorated on the Tyne Cot Memorial. However there is some confusion surrounding the date and circumstances of his death. His date of death according to CWGC is 31st August but on SDGW 1st September. His obituary in the Lancashire Fusiliers annual ( written by another BGS old boy, Bob Butcher MC) claims that he was killed by a shell which also accounted for another officer and several men but fellow officer George Horridge, quoted in 'Hell's Foundations' by Geoffrey Moorhouse, claims that Hudson was shot through the head and fell on top of him.  

Any help in untangling this mystery would be much appreciated. 

l1499323086.jpg

Edited by Mark Hone
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks. Very interesting. Yes , it's him. He was working in London in 1911 and living in a YMCA 'residential club' in Lambeth but had transferred to the Bank's Manchester office by the outbreak of war.

Edited by Mark Hone
Link to comment
Share on other sites

If you go up the tree link you will see an image of the brass plaque with his name on at the BofE

Edited by Mark1959
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Some other possible references

 

Ancestry..

Soldiers Effects Register records death as 31 Aug 1917 -  Mrs Violet Ellen Hudson

MIC - death 31.08.1919 ???

Find my Past...

He is included on The Roll of Honour 03 Nov. 1917 'The Sphere, London' - reference to Gallipoli only

08 Sept 1917 'Lancashire Daily Post' - killed by a shell Aug. 31st

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 Hi Mark,

 

For official purposes, the National Probate Calendar has his death as being on 1st September 1917. It says that the grant was made by virtue of a will, so funds permitting you should be able to get a copy of that. The will, death certificate, and appropriate battalion/brigade war diaries may help to clarify. I wonder if Violet married into royal descent.

 

Hudson.jpg.4c152d5990c6e0d988cc12a1ee1b0d1a.jpg

 

Regards

Chris

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks. Incidentally,  Austin's mother Violet Hudson, named above, was the sister of Lt Col John Henry Dauber RAMC, who died in the sinking of HMS 'Royal Edward' in August 1915, en route to the Gallipoli campaign:

http://www.ramc-ww1.com/profile.php?cPath=333_630_675_681&profile_id=12166&osCsid=20475dec6287f35dcbe52202f4cec8c0

Edited by Mark Hone
Link to comment
Share on other sites

A first hand account by George Horridge in the IWM archive makes it all clear. Hudson was killed by a shell while involved in a ration party on the night of 31st August/1st September.  A shell killed him, Lieutenant Thomas Mashiter and five men. I note that this account has been reprinted in the latest 'BBC History' magazine although they manage to mangle the spelling of Mashiter's name.

Edited by Mark Hone
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 years later...

Mark Hone, I am not sure whether you are still following this topic, but I joined this forum about 3 weeks ago (my first post https://www.greatwarforum.org/topic/281198-accidental-shooting-of-an-officer/ explains about my grandfather's diary - soon to be published, all being well!).

As you will infer from my GWF identity, my grandfather was in the Lancashire Fusiliers. He was in the 2/5th from October 1914 until he was wounded on the Somme in September 1916, then re-assigned to the 1/5th on his return to the Western Front in June 1917.

He was also a Bury Grammar School boy, which I believe will be of interest to you.

He mentions that he knew several men in the 1/5th when he joined them in June 1917. These included Pat Hudson (you will note that my grandfather refers to him by his middle name, not as "Austin"), who I now realise was a Bury Grammar School boy. 

My grandfather's account of the incident when Pat Hudson was killed reads:

It was a bad night for the 1/5th. When the ration parties arrived, the Coy parties came down to draw rations at the Dump. Unfortunately rather a large party collected, and the Boche opened fire. The first shell happened to be a good ranged shell and burst on the party. Capt A.P. Hudson and Lieut T.A.G. Mashiter were killed, in fact they were almost blown to bits. Horridge had a marvellous escape. Three or four men were also killed and several wounded.

I don't subscribe to the BBC History magazine, so I don't know what account George Horridge gave of the incident, but it is bound to be more detailed that my grandfather's as he was directly involved. Having said, that my grandfather probably got his account from George Horridge himself as George was another man in the 1/5th whom he mentions knowing before he joined the battalion.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thank you. I would be interested in any information you have to add to my Roll of Honour entry for the man I now know was called Pat Hudson. This includes all the information I compiled about him, including the full text of George Horridge's original account (which tallies with your grandfather's) and the probable location of his death. I have written detailed entries for all 98 old boys on the Bury Grammar School War Memorial for our School Archives website, which also includes digitized versions of the school magazine 'The Clavian' and School Yearbook, which no doubt contain several references to your grandfather. He will also have an entry in the admissions registers, which have not yet been digitized. With these, we shall be able to reconstruct his school career. Was he a former OTC Cadet? As ill luck would have it, I cannot direct you to the archives website at the moment as it has just gone offline. I trust that it will be restored soon. Your grandfather undoubtedly knew several other old boys who died in the war, including former School Captain Lt. John Hartington MC, who left school in December 1914 for a Commission in 2/5th LF. In early 1916 he was transferred to 164th Company, Machine Gun Corps, won the Military Cross at Gueudecourt in September 1916 (possibly the action in which your grandfather was wounded?) and was fatally injured during a German artillery barrage on Ypres on 13th July 1917. He is buried at Lijssenthoek. His sword and Military Cross are currently on display at the Fusilier Museum in the 'Stories of Fallen Swans' exhibition which forms part of the school's 450th anniversary commemorations. Sadly, of course, the museum and exhibition are currently closed. Other old boys served in 2/5th, including Lt. Tom Floyd , author of 'At Ypres With Best-Dunkley', but probably after your grandfather's time in the battalion. 

Edited by Mark Hone
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Mark,

Thank you for replying to my post.

My grandfather was Norman Hall (born 1892) and I think it very likely that he was in the OTC at school, as he certainly was when he went to University.

He mentions the names of many people in his diary, only two specifically on the footing that they were fellow pupils at BGS, but I now know  that others (such as Pat Hudson) were also fellow alumni. Sadly, those whom it is now most easy to identify as fellow pupils are those who didn’t survive. He does mention John Hartington, though did not know him well (he would have been 3 or 4 years his junior at school), and lost touch after he moved to the Machine Gun Company. He does not mention Tom Floyd, though he does mention Best-Dunkley (I realise that the latter was not ex-BGS).

I only recently discovered that at the time lockdown began there was an exhibition relating to four ex-BGS pupils in progress at the Lancashire Fusiliers' Museum. I have been liaising with the Museum over the last couple of years as the intention is that my grandfather’s book should inter alia be offered for sale in their shop on the footing that the Museum will retain any profits on those sales, but probably never mentioned to them that my grandfather went to BGS. Do you know what the intention is with regard to that exhibition when restrictions end? Is it intended that it will resume from where it left off, as it were, and perhaps be extended, or is there a programme of other exhibitions planned which will go ahead as scheduled?

I look forward to looking at the school archives website when it is up and running again.

In the meantime, do you mind if I use your personal email to correspond further about the Bury Grammar School angle, as I am aware that this will not be of interest more generally to members of this forum?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks for this. Unfortunately, I do not know what the intention is for the 'Fallen Swans' exhibition when the museum reopens. It was supposed to be on for most of 2020, as part of the school's 450th anniversary celebrations and had only opened a month before the lockdown. The four former pupils featured in the exhibition are: Lt. John Hartington MC (Lancashire Fusiliers attached Machine Gun Corps), Captain of Bury Grammar School 1914, died of wounds July 1917; 2nd Lt. Robert Hardman, 5th Special Brigade RE, killed on the First Day of the Somme attempting to carry a wounded comrade to safety; Lt. Colonel Thomas Henry Boardman DSO, founder member of the school's Cadet Corps in 1892, killed outside Ypres August 1917 and Captain Tom Cartman MC, Manchester Regiment 1914-18, who died in the sinking of the 'Arandora Star', which was carrying internees and  POWs under guard to Canada, in July 1940. All were former members of the school's OTC/Cadet Corps. 

Edited by Mark Hone
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Re John Hartington

My grandfather first mentions having seen Hartington (and others) "for the first time" in Southport on 16/04/15, two days before the Battalion moved down to Bedford en route for France, which suggests that he didn't recognise him from school. He .lists him as being in "B" Company of the 2/5th LF when they embarked for France on 03/05/15, at which point he was a 2nd Lieutenant. On 21st June, when the Battalion was in training in France, he mentions enjoying a "bathing parade" with him and others in a canal near Arques, when they were all swimming from an old barge. He has a photograph of him with 3 other members of "B" Company (by then renamed "X" Company) taken (I believe) in August or September 1915 at Senlis. The last time that my grandfather mentions him is on 25/01/16, in the context of having been transferred to the newly formed Machine Gun Company, after which he lost touch with him.

Re: Pat Hudson

I should have said in my last post that my grandfather's diary will not add much to what you already know of Pat Hudson, as he mentions him for the first time when he joins the 1/5th LF on 22/06/17, at which stage Pat was in a different Company (“A” Company), and, of course, he was unfortunately killed less than 6 weeks later. In the intervening period my grandfather mentions having dinner with him and other friends (at least one also from BGS) a couple of  times, but I am afraid this will not contribute anything of importance to your knowledge concerning him.

Regarding the exhibition, I will contact the Museum about this.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...