RNAS Armoured Cars at Gallipoli

[Biggles]

G'day mates,

 

I'd like to know more about the use of RNAS Armoured cars in Gallipoli. When, where and how did they get ashore? 

I'm also interested in the cars and crews themselves. They have a crew of three, would that be one officer (aka Commander) and NCO driver and gunner? 

Any photos of the cars and their crews in Gallipoli?

 

Thanks, chaps.

Caleb

[Biggles]

Umm, something went real wrong when trying to post this topic. Why the heck did it post three times?

Sorry about that.

[Biggles]

8 minutes ago, Dai Bach y Sowldiwr said:

Dunno .

Perhaps you could delete the other two?

Done.

Now back to subject.... Armoured cars.... anyone?

 

Edited 27 June , 2017 by Biggles

[michaeldr]

There is a good article on the RNAS Armoured Cars at Gallipoli written by Stephen Chambers (Krithia on this forum) which appeared in Len Sellers' magazine RND, issue No.4, March 1998, pages 295 – 310.  
The 24 issues of Len's magazine RND can be purchased today in disc format from the Crystal Palace Foundation here: http://www.crystalpalacefoundation.org.uk/shop/world-war-one-two/royal-naval-division

 

Eight cars came ashore in May and were based near Pink Farm. Four cars took part in the early stages of the Third Battle of Krithia on 4th June 1915, however the idea of using them to tear a pathway through the Turkish wire was not a success. 
Later in June it was decided that those cars still on their transports should be sent to Egypt, and in August they were followed by those which had previously landed at Helles.

 

In contrast to the armoured cars themselves, the men, machine guns and motor cycles of the RNAS Armoured Car Division played an active part in the Gallipoli campaign from the earliest days until very nearly the end. On the 25th April 1915 they manned their machine guns on the bow section of the River Clyde, providing covering fire for the infantry attempting to land at V Beach. They were active again during the First & Second Battles of Krithia and all the way through the campaign, even manning their machine guns on Kiretch Tepe Sirt during the Suvla offensive

Edited 28 June , 2017 by michaeldr

[David Filsell]

I have just received for review Stephen Spelling's new book which may be of interest/help, The Wooden Horse of Gallipoli, about the SS River Clyde. It contains considerable material about the deployment of the RNAS  AC Div on the ship and during the landing.

Only just started on it, but it seems  an extremely well research, written and illustrated work about a ship we generalists know something about, but not very much in detail. An early comment, but interestingly while not offering Hunter Bunter any great plaudits  it does note his antipathy to the landings and, once  ordered to get on with the job. his desire simply to do his duty as ordered to his best ability. 

[bts1970]

One of my Purton interests, Geoffrey Charlton Paine Rumming. I got the image some years ago, not sure who to credit for it, although i believe that a quick google search will find it freely available to view anyway

 

RUMMING, Geoffrey Charlton Paine.

 

Enlisted: (Royal Navy, for period of hostilities) 27/10/1914.

Age given: Born Purton 02/12/1888.

Occupation: Assistant and runner / Miller in Calne.

Address / Next Of Kin, family details: Calne. Son of William and Mary Nellie Rumming. (photo: North Wilts Herald).

 

Royal Navy Medal rolls (Geoffrey Rummings medal set was sold in 2007 for £15000).

British War Medal, Victory Medal, 15 Star, Conspicuous Gallantry Medal, Mentioned In Despatches, Medaille Militaire.

 

Extracts from: Service record (RNAS). London Gazette.

F/813                    Royal Naval Air Service (F prefix stands for Fleet Air Arm).

 

27/10/1914           Pembroke III, 01/04/1915 President II (accounting base for RNAS personnel).

 

A Mechanic 1^st class initially as an engineer; at a later date he was transferred to armoured cars when he would have been promoted to Petty Officer Mechanic.

 

25/04/1915           Gallipoli, V beach, Cape Helles.

 

Geoffrey was with No 3 Armoured Car Squadron at the Gallipoli landings. There he was onboard the SS River Clyde during the landings on V beach. The landing did not go as planned and there were many wounded soldiers in the water requiring assistance.  Petty Officer (PO) Peering seeing this called for help and was assisted by numerous 13 platoon, D Company, Anson Battalion members as well as CPO Rumming.  They joined Sub Lt Arthur Tisdall in carrying out numerous journeys to rescue soldiers in the water and stranded on rocks. He later recalled; “There were four men in the boat, the late Sub Lt Tisdall, a black bearded PO, a seaman and myself. We got 3 wounded in the boat on the first trip and 4 in the second trip. Beyond getting a few bullet holes in the boat above the waterline, the first trip was quite successful. On the second trip Sub Lt Tisdall and myself clambered over a spit of rock to get to the men lying higher up. We got shot at and lay down for a time. As we were lifting the last wounded man into the boat I got hit again in the back. We had taken the boat a little further ashore, and when we went to push of again found her grounded. When we did eventually succeed in getting off Lt Tisdall and myself were unable to climb into the boat and so we hung onto the side as the other 2 men keeping as low as possible rowed back to the River Clyde”. On this trip back Tisdall and another man were wounded.  The small party had tried for over an hour to recover as many men as possible from under the Turkish machine guns. One of the witnesses to this action was Lt Cmdr Wedgwood, Rummings CO who was a close friend of Winston Churchill, recommending CPO Rumming and another CPO (Russell) for the Victoria Cross. This was not awarded but they were awarded the Conspicuous Gallantry Medal instead, Sub Lt Tisdall was awarded the VC; he was later killed in action on the 6^th May.

  

The letter sent by Lieutenant-Commander J. C. Wedgwood, to Winston Churchill read: ‘The wounded were still crying and drowning on that awful spit. Lieutenant Tidsdall, R.N.D., took a boat, one of the Clyde’s sailors, and one of my men, Rumming. They got four men aboard before Tidsdale and the sailor were shot and wounded. Hiding behind the side of the boat they walked and swam it back. I saw one of the wounded stretch out his hand, stroke Rumming as he hung on to the side, the most pathetic thing I have ever seen. Rumming volunteered to go ashore again with me in the dark and stood (on the dead) for another three hours on the horrible spit under occasional fire. I have officially recommended both him and J. H. Russell for the V.C.’

 

Another account of the landings from The Official History of the War in the Air reads: “At ‘V’ beach the direct landing from the tows was attempted at 6.53 a.m. and, about the same hour, the River Clyde was run aground. When the tows were within twenty yards of the shore the sea began to hiss with Turkish bullets. Few boats survived this twenty yards, and then but a handful of their occupants got through the unbroken entanglements under a murderous fire to the shelter of a low sandy escarpment which backed the foreshore. The rest, dead or wounded, drifted helplessly in their open boats ... Commander Unwin at once took a party into the water and toiled in the bullet swept sea in an attempt to get the lighters into some sort of position. Meanwhile, the armoured car machine-gun detachment in the bows of the collier averted a complete disaster. They raked the Turkish trenches and machine-gun posts with such accuracy and persistence that the Naval party in the water were able to continue their work for a full hour until, once again, they had got the hopper into position. Their fire prevented any attempts to rush the few survivors who were hanging on to their position on shore. At eight o’clock, with the hopper once more in place, a party of the Munsters was led out from the River Clyde, but the whole Turkish fire was concentrated on them and all the fire of the maxims proved insufficient to cover their journey to the beach ... All day the machine-gunners in the River Clyde kept up their duel with the enemy marksmen; not a gun went out of action although in at least one casemate every man of the gun’s crew was wounded. Commander Unwin, suffering from slight wounds and exposure as a result of two long sojourns in the water, had pushed off alone from the collier in a lifeboat at 9.30 a.m. to bring in wounded who were lying on a spit of rock near the beach ... At half-past ten a further attempt to bring in the wounded was made in a boat manned by three men, including Petty Officer G.C.P. Rumming of the armoured car squadron. By the time the boat was loaded up with its wounded, Rumming’s two companions had been hit, and the tow-line to the boat had been cut in half. Undaunted, Petty Officer Rumming took the line and maneuvered the boat back to the ship ... When at last the sun dipped on that flawless Sunday evening, the bridge to the beach was finally completed and the surviving soldiers in the River Clyde were able to get ashore. The machine-gunners remained on board the collier for the time being, but could do little in the dark to help the infantry who fought all night. They refused to accept a rest. For three hours Lieutenant-Commander Wedgewood and Petty Officer Rumming worked waist deep in water to assist the wounded back to safety.”

 

04/06/1915           During the attack on Krithia Geoffrey was severely wounded in the cranium, admitted to Base Hospital and later invalided home.  

 

Geoffrey was serving as a spare driver and second maxim hand in Lieutenant Hon. Francis McLaren’s car: It was in this attack that the Air Service armoured cars were used for the first time on Gallipoli. Four cars had been landed on 26^th May and four more on 3^rd June, and were housed in specially prepared deep dug-outs. The cars were manned by two sections of Numbers 3 and 4 Squadrons. The eight armoured cars moved off along the three roads under heavy shellfire as the infantry assaulted. On the left track the two cars were held up at the firing line by an unbridged trench and eventually returned to the main road. On this road, it proved impossible to get across the bridge over the front line. Two of the cars in attempting to do so were partly ditched and were at once shelled. It was only on the right road that the cars reached the Turkish front line, but here again they were held by a high stone-faced parapet. When it became clear that the cars could do nothing to help the advance, they were withdrawn. Three officers, including Lieutenant-Commander Colmore, and  Petty Officer Rumming had been wounded, and the cars had suffered minor damage from shellfire. They had done what they could, but the conditions were against them, and Sir Ian Hamilton decided that as long as trench warfare persisted there “could be no further use for armoured cars on the peninsula”.

 

16/04/1915           London Gazette announces Conspicuous Gallantry Medal (CGM at this time was only available to

                              members of the Royal Navy and Royal Marines).

06/08/1915           London Gazette announces Mentioned in despatches, 16/08/1915 London Gazette announces award of the C.G.M. The                                          recommendation - contained in Vice-Admiral de Robeck’s despatch. 

03/10/1915           Discharged from RNAS due to wounds received at Gallipoli.

 

Deemed to have been Enlisted: 02/03/1916.

Called up for service: 27/07/1916, Lincoln.

Age given: 28 years 246 days.

Occupation: Miller and merchant.

Address / Next Of Kin, family details: Holbeach, Lincolnshire. NOK listed as William Thomas Paine Rumming, Calne.

 

On re-enlisting he declared his previous Service with the RNAS and declared his wish to serve with the Machine Gun

Corps (MGC) due to the disbandment of the Armored car sections.

 

64969                    Machine Gun Corps.

 

03/08/1916           Joined the 9^th Scottish Cadet Division, Ayrshire.

11/04/1917           Returned to unit, MGC training unit, Grantham.

11/07/1917           Discharged from training on medical grounds (Epilepsy), no longer physically fit for War Service.

                             Address given on discharge, Quermeford, Wiltshire. He returned to his father’s mill.

  

Death / Burial / Memorial details.

Died on the 4^th November 1917. Buried in CALNE (CURZON STREET) CEMETERY, Grave reference A3. Geoffrey is also remembered on the War Memorial in Calne.

 

In late 1917 on his death a local newspaper recorded that: “It was in this attack that Chief Petty Officer Rumming was badly wounded, a piece of shrapnel passing though the top of his skull. He was carried by a brother officer into another car and taken to the dressing station, and was, we understand, the first wounded man to enter the operating theatre. He was afterwards sent to England and underwent treatment at Chatham. Owing to the wound he was eventually discharged from the service. He felt this very much indeed, as he was most anxious to be helping his country in her hour of peril. He could not rest contented in civilian life, and tried again to enter the forces, being eventually accepted as a cadet at Gales, Ayrshire, on 2^nd July 1916. However the strain of training proved too much and he was again discharged at the end of June 1917. He never really recovered from the effects of his wounds, and passed away, as stated, on Sunday week.”

 

00/04/1918           Awarded the French Medaille Militaire, by a warrant dated in Paris in April 1918.

12/12/1919           Letter issued regarding the eligibility for Geoffrey to receive the award of Naval Kings certificate. for RNAS. Certificate to be sent to NOK. (2 certificates issued. RNAS and MGC).

 

Evidence for inclusion on the Purton Parish list: National Archive details (RNAS and Service / Pension records). 1901 Census Keynsham, Somerset.

Edited 28 June , 2017 by bts1970
layout problems

[Biggles]

Wow! What a lot of fantastic information. Thank you, chaps.

 

What would be the ranks of an armoured car crew? The commander would be an officer no doubt. What about the rest?

 

Cheerio,

Caleb

 

[Guest]

One if the commanders of one of the cars has a memorial plaque in StAndrews Church ,StAndrews church

James Boothby formerly if the Scots Guards

 

[seaJane]

Surgeon Frederick James Humphrys, RN, died 5 Sep 1915. His medals are held in the library where I work.

https://kingscollections.org/warmemorials/st-thomas-hospital/memorials/humphrys-frederick-james

[RRAC]

Apologies for reviving a dead thread, but this illustration addresses the initial question regarding how the armoured cars made it to shore.

RRAC

[aconnolly]

Thanks RRAC - Great photo - can you tell me the origin -book or newspaper?

Andrew

[RRAC]

Andrew,

The image is from "The Graphic" October 16, 1915:

RRAC

Edited 2 January by RRAC

[aconnolly]

Many thanks - fascinating!

Andrew