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trajan

Medals of the Central Powers

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I saw a photograph once many yrs ago of a German Navy Admiral wearing his medals bar in a diagonal setting & wonder if it was "navy way" at some time in the past.

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Khaki
1 hour ago, Loader said:

I saw a photograph once many yrs ago of a German Navy Admiral wearing his medals bar in a diagonal setting & wonder if it was "navy way" at some time in the past.

That might be Felix von Luckner, wearing full dress uniform, I saw a couple of online photos of him wearing his medal bar diagonal style.

khaki

 

 

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trajan
12 hours ago, Khaki said:

I sometimes, 'well frequently' , wish that I had specialized in collecting, but I bounce around depending on what I have been doing, reading or watching, I suppose there is a classification for it, but no cure.

 

10 hours ago, Medaler said:

 

If it is any consolation, I follow that eclectic style too. ... As for SWMBO, I actually got her into collecting swagger sticks at one point.

 

9 hours ago, Kimberley John Lindsay said:

... Collectively, we would all get on famously together in our respective Dens (with or without wives in obeyance). We could talk about, and show each other, the pointy things, the cross-shaped things, the round things, and the hundred-year old pictures of those who - perforce - made it all possible. ... Personally, I have tried to specialize as much as possible ... Having said that, one inevitably buys an "out of bounds" item, and feels good about having done so! A recent example was a low-priced 1914-18 Pair and 37 Coro group to an Officer who married an aristocrat, became a diplomat, and lived to over 100 years of age...

 

So, yes, we all share that collecting bug, and the fun of researching the things as well that takes us out from our initial and narrower field of interest in GW matters! Sadly, living in a university-provided 2-bedroom flat with two boys and SWMBO, my "den" is simply a desk in a corridor leading to the balcony, with a chest of drawers for bayonets, a wall display of bayonets behind me, suitcases with bayonets stacked under the desk, and another smaller chest of drawers for GW photographs and medals...:( So, what with a Turkish salary as well, I have to be modest in terms of my collecting...

 

As for getting SWMBO interested in GW matters, she was overjoyed when I bought and showed her my single but fancy BB&C 'Gallipoli Star'! I thought she would then regale me with news of how one of her ancestors had been honoured with such a decoration, but no... She wanted to wear it as a "nice brooch"...:unsure:

 

Julian

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trajan
7 hours ago, Khaki said:

That might be Felix von Luckner, wearing full dress uniform, I saw a couple of online photos of him wearing his medal bar diagonal style.

 

Here you go, courtesy of: http://navymuseum.co.nz/worldwar1/people/count-felix-von-luckner/

 

The photograph that I saw though was a man in his civvies... But IIRC, he was in eventing dress, which w/could explain the diagoinal arrangement, as here.

 

 

APO-0002-Von-Luckner-portrait.jpg

Edited by trajan
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Medaler

Ref Von Luckner - There is no way that the regulations would allow that here - He has more medals than some collectors I know! Though I know nothing about German medals, even I can spot some pretty impressive stuff on display there. Every time somebody presented him with another one, his Tailor must have gone into hiding. I hope they are all still in existence somewhere and hopefully on display. Very impressive stuff, even to my uneducated eye.

 

Mike

Edited by Medaler
Spelling - AGAIN!

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bob lembke

Despite my father, atypically, talking frequently to me about his experiences in and about the GW, we only had two books about it; one about the Paris Gun, and the book about Luckner ("the Sea Eagle" -L. Thomas?). We read a lot, but there were few books about; we prowled the used book district in Manhattan when I was a boy; perhaps he took them back to trade for new used ones. 

 

He he said that he met von Luckner twice; once at a party in Germany, and after he came to the US in 1926 he ran into him on Manhattan's fashionable Park Avenue, walking someone's two poodles. (I hope he did not travel with two of his own poodles.) He was quite a society swell in the 1920's. 

 

He he got most of his medals for waging non-fatal war, sinking something like 14 ships and not even losing a ship's cat. In the 1920's most everyone was disgusted with the carnage of the GW. 

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Kimberley John Lindsay

Dear All,

Thanks for the Graf Luckner picture, taken post-1934.

He seems, unusually, to have missed out on the Hohenzollern Hausorden, but got pretty well everything else - including all the three Hanseatenkreuze. 

I have a signed (in pencil) portrait of him in a similar attire, but 1920s vintage. 

These stalwart types who "got everything bar the the kitchen sink" harks back to my current interest. I find it fascinating that the humble EKII - awarded to millions - none590c663764826_InternetImage1_w280h280.jpg.053c7b44d3b54e759573cf6e4ad8ddfe.jpgtheless takes an obviously coveted and premium place.

Kindest regards,

Kim.

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Kimberley John Lindsay

Dear All,

Here is a similarly-uniformed and be-medalled German naval officer:

Georg von Hase of the S.M.S. "Defflinger"...

Kindest regards,

Kim.590c6aa16e395_GeorgvonHaseoftheSMSDerfflinger.jpg.90b674e8051cedd0c29353b50650f3fb.jpg

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Kimberley John Lindsay

Dear All,

Harking back to my posts of 27 and 107, I attach rather better scans of the obverse and reverse of this - probably Imperial German officers' - Grosse Ordenschnalle.

In the meantime it is now in my possession, having made a "spot-on" bid (which I increased no less than three times! Comments would be welcome59174defc11b5_InternetImage1.jpg.cfb2e81471066b06d53ab9104172690c.jpg59174e22c2708_InternetImage2.jpg.6ebcd96c0929809f8eac0498cd9ceab3.jpg):

Eisernen Kreuz II Klasse (Prussia); Militärverdienstkreuz III Klasse mit Schwertern (Bayern); Friedrich August Kreuz II Klasse (Oldenburg); Allgemeines Ehrenzeichen 'Für Tapferkeit' (Grossherzog Ernst Ludwig von Hessen); Hanseatenkreuz (Bremen).

Kindest regards,

Kim.

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robins2

very nice group, what is the significance of the Key on the last medal, I was stationed in Soest/Iserlohn and that was the city symbol for Soest

 

regards

 

Bob R.

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Medaler

Thanks for that larger image Kim. A very attractive looking group they are too. As an observation from a primarily British collector, I am struck by how there is no real uniformity in the length that each individual award is hung. Any maker marks on that EKII ? - It looks to be a very nice example. It is also the first time I have ever really had a good look at the enamel work on an Hanseatic Cross.

 

We really do come at this form different ends of the spectrum, but I find your collection absolutely fascinating. You capture a different essence with your interests, but it is so compatible with, and indeed even complimentary to my own collection. To illustrate this, my own latest addition comes from a completely different direction. I am supposed to be on an economy drive at the moment, but this solo BWM turned up to an Arras casualty from the 8th Royal Fusiliers. My big problem was that it was too cheap miss, so I somehow managed to justify it to myself as money well spent. Never mind that I am on this economy drive in the first place purely because bargains keep turning up!

 

Warmest regards,

Mike

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depaor01
9 minutes ago, robins2 said:

what is the significance of the Key on the last medal

 

regards

 

Bob R.

It appears on the Bremen coat of arms, and also on the Beck's beer label!

 

Dave

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robins2
8 hours ago, depaor01 said:

It appears on the Bremen coat of arms, and also on the Beck's beer label!

 

Dave

thank you for the info

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trajan

According to: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bremer_Wappen the "Bremer Schlüssel" or "Bremen Key" has been the symbol for the city since at least 1229, and was chosen as St.Peter, who holds the key to heaven, is the patron saint of the place.

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robins2

I thought I would add some more medals for discussion and comments

20170514_220946.jpg

20170514_221006.jpg

20170514_221031.jpg

20170514_221046.jpg

20170514_221128.jpg

20170514_221145.jpg

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robins2

More, I wonder about the Blue ribbon, it appears to have been on the medal for quite some time

20170514_221647.jpg

20170514_221727.jpg

20170514_221912.jpg

20170514_221928.jpg

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robins2

last of the photos, none of the Iron Crosses have manufacture marks other than the !st class marked KO

20170514_222236.jpg

20170514_222258.jpg

20170514_222335.jpg

20170514_222819.jpg

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Khaki
37 minutes ago, robins2 said:

More, I wonder about the Blue ribbon, it appears to have been on the medal for quite some time

20170514_221647.jpg

20170514_221727.jpg

I wonder if the blue ribbon is an 'unofficial' naval variation ?

khaki

 

 

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Kimberley John Lindsay

Dear Khaki,

I once had a Berlin-mounted group of. EKII, Verdienstkreuz (Prussia: for non-combattants), then three unofficial medals, including Kyffhäuser-Bund cross, and Kyffhäuser-Bund medal (like yours), and your Marine-Korps cross. Acquired in Sydney, light-years ago, traded in Stuttgart, also long ago. 

The thing is, the Marine-Korps cross especially, were post-Great War commemorative medals (often with the appropriate clasps - "Russland", etc.), and design-wise, the forerunner of the widely-awarded official "Hindenburgkreuz" - which replaced these unofficial awards.

These Hindenburgkreuze are also to be seen in your collection, with and without swords ("Kämpfer"; "Nichtkämpfer").

Your EKI ("KO") looks like a particularly good example of that award (all ranks, but in practice, mainly to Officers).

Kindest regards,

Kim.

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trajan
8 hours ago, robins2 said:

More, I wonder about the Blue ribbon, it appears to have been on the medal for quite some time

 

If you don't know the makers of the Hindenburgers, they are (according to my list): PSL = Paul Schulze & Co (Lübeck), and WK = Wilhelm Kolwitz (Bergedorf).

 

 

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Khaki
3 hours ago, Kimberley John Lindsay said:

Dear Khaki,

I once had a Berlin-mounted group of. EKII, Verdienstkreuz (Prussia: for non-combattants), then three unofficial medals, including Kyffhäuser-Bund cross, and Kyffhäuser-Bund medal (like yours), and your Marine-Korps cross. Acquired in Sydney, light-years ago, traded in Stuttgart, also long ago. 

The thing is, the Marine-Korps cross especially, were post-Great War commemorative medals (often with the appropriate clasps - "Russland", etc.), and design-wise, the forerunner of the widely-awarded official "Hindenburgkreuz" - which replaced these unofficial awards.

These Hindenburgkreuze are also to be seen in your collection, with and without swords ("Kämpfer"; "Nichtkämpfer").

Your EKI ("KO") looks like a particularly good example of that award (all ranks, but in practice, mainly to Officers).

Kindest regards,

Kim.

Hi Kim,

The medals you are referring to were posted by robins2, I just posted a thought about the blue ribbon. I do have similar medals, but those are not mine. All thanks to robins2 for posting.

khaki

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Kimberley John Lindsay

Dear khaki,

Mixing you up with robins2 was unintentional. Thanks to both of you for contributing!

Kindest regards,

Kim.

PS: Apropos contributing: here is an interesting EKII group worn by a senior German air leader - note that he was awarded two Hanseatenkreuze!591a1334aafc8_Fliegergeneral1913-14.jpg.a8a33a20ae33ee58c33b2cbd2537cd87.jpg

Edited by Kimberley John Lindsay

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Medaler

Robins2,

 

If you have read the rest of this thread, you will know that I am sat on the sidelines taking it all in - and learning much!

 

I really like that Flanders Cross with the 2 clasps. I find it impossible look at it without thinking of the Belgian Yser medal from the other side of the wire.

 

Warmest regards,

Mike

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robins2
10 hours ago, Medaler said:

Robins2,

 

If you have read the rest of this thread, you will know that I am sat on the sidelines taking it all in - and learning much!

 

I really like that Flanders Cross with the 2 clasps. I find it impossible look at it without thinking of the Belgian Yser medal from the other side of the wire.

 

Warmest regards,

Mike

I find that particular medal one of my favorites, not as common as the rest, although Kim (post 119) states it is post war issued?, it is a shame they did not name their medals, would make it a lot easier to research.

 

regards

 

Bob R.

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Kimberley John Lindsay

Dear Bob,

One occasionally sees privately-engraved EKIs.

However the Germans valued their Besitz-Dokumente (award certificates) more than the un-named medals themselves. Extra copies of these latter could be acquired by showing the Besitz-Schein, and mounted on various uniforms, or in different ways (for example, as "Frackspange" - diagonally with the EKII uppermost for wear with white tie and tails). 

Kindest regards,

Kim.e_3928.jpg.ee81a81e98d596a73a3aad4f22433008.jpg

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