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Steven Broomfield

Mallow, September 1920

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Steven Broomfield

While potterng through a newly-acquired copy of the History of the 17th Lancers, 1895-1924 (don't tell Mrs Broomfield), I happened across a report of a Troop of C Squadron, based at Mallow in Ireland in September 1920 being raided by the IRA. It is also referred HERE

 

The regimental history states (it would, I suppose):

 

"That night Mallow knew the word fear. Though the troops who had suffered took no part, discipline prevailing, Mallow was in flames."

 

I notice from the press report in the link above that a Court of Inquiry was apparently held: was there ever a report? Were the 17th involved?

 

Out of interest, is there any additional information available, ad as a last question, is there an objective history of the British involvement in the post-1919 conflict and (is an objective history possible?) of the Civil war which followed?

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corisande

Your reference to Cairogang web site report is to my site

 

A court of inquiry was held , in lieu of an inquest, as martial law had banned any inquests. Generally the inquiries are available on FmP but I cannot see one on Gibbs. They are all badly indexed, NTA to blame not FmP for these ones. So with a bit of digging you might find it , I usually get 19 out of 20 with time.

 

Also 6 men were found guilty of Gibbs death and there is quite a lot on them on FmP

 

afraid your request for an objective history of the war of independence or the civil war is negative. This is all in the mind of the beholder, what one person thinks objective another thinks is biased.

 

On 17th Lancers there is the odd case of the death of Lt Souchon later in 1921 in Galway

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Gareth Davies

I hadn't heard of Mallow so I had a look at it on the map.  I notice that there's a bit of wetland at the side of the river. What would they be calling that?

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corisande

The trial of the 6 men accused of Gibbs murder is at (you need obviously a FmP sub for that)

 

http://search.findmypast.co.uk/record/browse?id=ire%2fwo35%2f122%2f00285

 

As far as I can see it does not cover the reprisals (official or otherwise) . The news reports do point the finger at the Army. Not the police. Similarly the Inquiry will probably only cover the murder, and avoid the aftermath

 

You would need to find newspaper reports for compensation claims to see what was reporte don who were the guilty parties

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Steven Broomfield
2 hours ago, corisande said:

Your reference to Cairogang web site report is to my site

 

I thought it was yours. It's very good.

2 hours ago, corisande said:

 

 

On 17th Lancers there is the odd case of the death of Lt Souchon later in 1921 in Galway

It's covered in the regimental history: most odd, and after the Armistice, too. In fact, the 17th were unlucky, having had three officers killed in the attack on Bagot's house.

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squirrel

I was once told that there was also an incident in Buttevant near Mallow where "some mounted Lancers" dragged a suspect along the Main Street....

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Steven Broomfield
1 hour ago, corisande said:

The trial of the 6 men accused of Gibbs murder is at (you need obviously a FmP sub for that)

 

http://search.findmypast.co.uk/record/browse?id=ire%2fwo35%2f122%2f00285

 

Thanks. Unfortunately I don't, but I'll keep the bookmark against any time in the future when I do.

 

As ever, thanks for your help, and your efforts in reseraching this unfortunate piece of history.

 

Is there a book you could recommend, even if not fully objective?

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corisande

Field Marshall Sir Henry Wilson recorded in his diary

" lancers.jpg

 

British papers did not (probably could not) cite the 17th Lancers  as responsible for the reprisals, but the release by Associated Press was widely quoted in US papers

lancers2.jpg

 

Without taking a lot more time to categorically prove that Mallow was burnt by the 17 Lancers, contemporary evidence suggests that it was them. And that it was the RIC (including Black and Tans)   who stopped them . In this environment at that time, both the British and the Irish were happy to put the blame of most atrocities at the door of the B&Ts.

 

As it stands, I would need to be convinced that the 17th Lancers did not go on a rampage and burn Mallow

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Steven Broomfield

It might be revealing tha the regimental history (my first post) merely states that " ... the troops who had suffered took no part ..." which doesn't mean no-one else from the 17th wasn't involved. I can't really see who else it would be, either.

3 hours ago, Gareth Davies said:

I hadn't heard of Mallow so I had a look at it on the map.  I notice that there's a bit of wetland at the side of the river. What would they be calling that?

 

:lol:

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