Eran Tearosh Posted 6 August , 2016 Share Posted 6 August , 2016 Hi everyone, I'm trying to find a copy of this publication, or someone who has a copy and will be able to scan a few pages for me. Thanks, Eran Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellis1918 Posted 6 August , 2016 Share Posted 6 August , 2016 A search of CWGC cemeteries for Israel & Gaza produces results for 19 cemeteries and Syria 2. Downloadable as a spreadsheet. Won't the information you are looking for be in there ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eran Tearosh Posted 6 August , 2016 Author Share Posted 6 August , 2016 There are several small cemeteries that were abounded at the early 60's. Remnants of some of these still exist while a few completely vanished. In some cases (2), the people buried at these cemeteries were reburied in Ramleh, however – in the other small plots, the people that were buried there (Mostly members of the Egyptian Labor Corps) were never reburied, which means they are still buried there. This book (Written when all these cemeteries existed and were maintained) has all the details that will assist to record properly these forgotten plots and hopefully commemorate those who fell and buried there in a more appropriate way. . Eran Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaeldr Posted 9 August , 2016 Share Posted 9 August , 2016 Eran, This book is mentioned by Ron Fuchs in Note 12 of his paper Sites of memory in the Holy Land: the design of the British war cemeteries in Mandate Palestine [Ron Fuchs - Department of Art History, Haifa University, Haifa 32000, Israel] as published in the Journal of Historical Geography 30 (2004) 643–664 quote: “Information by site on specific cemeteries and their histories is given in the IWGC Registers. For Palestine see: The Imperial War Graves Commission, The War Graves of the British Empire: Palestine and Syria, 1924–1932, hereafter: the Registers for Palestine and Syria. See also Gibson and Kingsley Ward, Courage Remembered; War Graves Series Military History Reference Books, e.g. no. 14: E. Dermott-Powell, War Cemeteries in Palestine (Israel), 1914–1918 (1993); Garfield, The Fallen. For Gallipoli see N. Steel, The Battlefields of Gallipoli, London, 1990; P. Gough, From heroes’ groves to parks of peace: landscapes of remembrance protest and peace, Landscape Research, 252 (2000) 213–228.” I wonder if Dr Fuchs has a copy of the book you are seeking in his department at Haifa? Michael (My sincere apologies for not thinking of this earlier) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jrmh Posted 9 August , 2016 Share Posted 9 August , 2016 Hi Eran, I have pages 7-25 from CWGC example here - any good to you? Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryBrook Posted 10 August , 2016 Share Posted 10 August , 2016 Birmingham Central Library held bound volumes of original C.W.G.C. registers. They were there in the 1990's. Might be worth contacting them to see if they exist still, or maybe the library has an online catalogue to check. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eran Tearosh Posted 10 August , 2016 Author Share Posted 10 August , 2016 Thank you all, Michael - I'm trying to contact Dr Fuchs. Let you know what comes up. Hard to believe - The local CWGC never heard about this book! Jim - Great! That's what I'm looking for! Writing you a PM Harry - Thanks! I'll give it a try. Eran Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaureenE Posted 10 August , 2016 Share Posted 10 August , 2016 This title is stated to be held at Oxford University Library, There appear to be several volumes or different editions. The copac catalogue entry is http://copac.jisc.ac.uk/search?title=War Graves of the British Empire&iids=66530848 &show-library=Oxford University&rn=1 Cheers Maureen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seaJane Posted 10 August , 2016 Share Posted 10 August , 2016 The Bodleian Library, which is the specific one of the Oxford University libraries housing the volumes, does not lend books, but your local public library system should be able to arrange an inter-library loan or photocopy. Alternatively, if you are able to get to Oxford, there are ways of obtaining a Bodleian reader's card. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 10 August , 2016 Share Posted 10 August , 2016 6 hours ago, seaJane said: ... Alternatively, if you are able to get to Oxford, there are ways of obtaining a Bodleian reader's card. I will second Jane on that. They are very welcoming to people who have very specific resarch purposes. I am currently there on research leave and honestly really very busy on my own research. And I have never tried to have anything copied there, BUT if it is really essential and I can learn exactly what pages are needed then I could try and explore a bit further - no promises though! Trajan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eran Tearosh Posted 21 August , 2016 Author Share Posted 21 August , 2016 (edited) Hi all! Update: As I mentioned, in addition to the main Commonwealth War Cemeteries in Israel there are/were several small cemeteries spread throughout the country. Strange as it may sound, somewhere down the road, some of these small cemeteries were abounded. The burials in these cemeteries are ELC (Egyptian Labour Corps), Indian, Ottoman & a few Germens. As far as I know, the list of the small cemeteries included: DEIR SNEID; JUNCTION STATION; LATRUN; JAFFA; WILHELMA; SARONA; JERUSALEM (INDIAN); JERUSALEM (BAB SITNA MARIAM); JERUSALEM (BAB EL-ZAHARA); JERUSALEM (MAMILA); LIMBER HILL; JERICHO No. 1; JERICHO No.2; TUL KARM; HAIFA (INDIAN). ______________________________________________________ The following is based on a quote from the CWGC website: The RAMLEH 1914-18 MEMORIAL was erected in 1961 to commemorate more than 300 Commonwealth, German and Turkish servicemen of the First World War who lie buried in the following cemeteries in Israel, which could no longer be maintained: JAFFA (JABALIYE) MUHAMMADEN CEMETERY JERICHO MILITARY CEMETERY No.2 JUNCTION STATION MUHAMMADEN CEMETERY; LATRUN EGYPTIAN CEMETERY LIMBER HILL MILITARY CEMETERY Originally the Memorial also commemorated casualties buried in JERUSALEM (Bab Sitna Mariam) MUHAMMADEN CEMETERY and TUL KARM WAR CEMETERY, but these two sites were re-instated in 1997. _____________________________________________________ The whereabouts of most of the small cemeteries is known. However, a few completely vanished (2 in Jerusalem, 2 in Jericho and Latrun). 2 other cemeteries (Junction Station & Limber Hill) were considered lost by the CWGC, but they really are not lost – During the last couple of weeks, I took the local CWGC director to both these “lost” cemeteries. I hope that in the future, they too will be re-instated, as the cemeteries of Jerusalem (Bab Sitna Mariam) and Tul Karm were. We (Myself and some members of The Society for the Heritage of WWI in Israel) are still gathering more information about all the small cemeteries, including those not mentioned in this update. If anyone can assist with details, photos, maps, documents regarding these small cemeteries – It will be most appreciated. Eran Edited 22 August , 2016 by Eran Tearosh Duplication of name Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Evans Posted 21 August , 2016 Share Posted 21 August , 2016 Eran, I don't know if this is of interest? According to CWGC, there was one German at Limber Hill. It appears that this was Joh(ann) Kottenlust, who was buried on 30th September 1918 in Grave No. 33. Details of his burial are on ICRC in A44475. He does not appear on the Ramleh Memorial. His ICRC casualty card can be found here, but unfortunately none of the other "A" pages referred to have been uploaded to their data base as yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaeldr Posted 23 August , 2016 Share Posted 23 August , 2016 On 8/21/2016 at 22:06, Phil Evans said: Eran, I don't know if this is of interest? According to CWGC, there was one German at Limber Hill. It appears that this was Joh(ann) Kottenlust, who was buried on 30th September 1918 in Grave No. 33. Details of his burial are on ICRC in A44475. He does not appear on the Ramleh Memorial. His ICRC casualty card can be found here, but unfortunately none of the other "A" pages referred to have been uploaded to their data base as yet. Eran (& Phil), There is a “Kottenlust (vgl. Fox)” listed in Dr Norbert Schwake's book Deutsche Soldatengräber in Israel and he may be able to tell you more on this man [http://www.deutschesfachbuch.de/Deutsche_Soldatengräber_in_Israel_9783402002315_register.html] regards Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eran Tearosh Posted 28 August , 2016 Author Share Posted 28 August , 2016 Phil & Michael - Thanks! I am aware of a German buried at Limber Hill. I'll speak with Norbert (Michael - Do you speak Germen?). A different issue - At the Ramleh War Memorial there is mentioning of The Egyptian Army. I know a bit about this army, including its actions in the Western Desert and I know they were involved in the defense of the Suez Canal. I can't find a thing regarding their involvement in the Palestine Campaign itself, and yet - Here's evidence (Attached) of such involvement. Anyone? Eran Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gareth Davies Posted 28 August , 2016 Share Posted 28 August , 2016 (edited) In "A Brief record of the Advance of the Egyptian Expeditionary Force; July 1917 to October 1918", and specifically in the 'Palestine Lines of Communication' section the 1st, 2nd and 3rd Egyptian Infantry Battalions are listed. I assume that these were Egyptian Army forces. The Egyptian Labour Corps HQ & Advanced Depot was at Ludd (sic) [Lydda/Lod/al-Ludd] and the Base Depot at Kantara. It had 120 Companies (numbered 1 to 120). Edited 28 August , 2016 by Gareth Davies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 28 August , 2016 Share Posted 28 August , 2016 An aside, as it were. Is there a CWGC site in Gaza? There is a slight chance that I might be able to get a contact who'll be there on charity work for the next two weeks to discover its condition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eran Tearosh Posted 28 August , 2016 Author Share Posted 28 August , 2016 Hi Trajan, Yes. Follow these links: http://www.cwgc.org/find-a-cemetery/cemetery/71701/GAZA WAR CEMETERY http://www.cwgc.org/find-a-cemetery/cemetery/71200/DEIR EL BELAH WAR CEMETERY http://www.cwgc.org/find-a-cemetery/cemetery/72100/DEIR EL BELAH EGYPTIAN CEMETERY Eran Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jrmh Posted 28 August , 2016 Share Posted 28 August , 2016 This from the CWGC site shows some of the units: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jrmh Posted 28 August , 2016 Share Posted 28 August , 2016 (edited) Capt Murad Hussein Egyptian Army Medical Corps Ahmed Abdor Rahman Sadlr Egyptian Camel Transport Corps Gendy Rizbe 12th Coy Transport Corps Madbook Hassandry A.T.C. Edited 28 August , 2016 by Jrmh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eran Tearosh Posted 28 August , 2016 Author Share Posted 28 August , 2016 Hi Gareth, Thanks! I did look at the Brief record, but concentrated on fighting units, I missed those! I assume this means that these soldiers died of sickness, as was quite common generally in this theater of war, particularly among the Egyptians. Eran Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gareth Davies Posted 28 August , 2016 Share Posted 28 August , 2016 28 minutes ago, trajan said: An aside, as it were. Is there a CWGC site in Gaza? There is a slight chance that I might be able to get a contact who'll be there on charity work for the next two weeks to discover its condition. Yes there is. I am in very regular contact with one of the men who looks after the Gazan cemeteries. They are in good condition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 28 August , 2016 Share Posted 28 August , 2016 Just now, Gareth Davies said: Yes there is. I am in very regular contact with one of the men who looks after the Gazan cemeteries. They are in good condition. Thanks - I would have asked my contact to check if necessary but nice not to place an extra task on her! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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