trajan Posted 6 June , 2016 Share Posted 6 June , 2016 This was my other little nice find at the Ankara Pazari (see: http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=239944#entry2408619for the other). Well, not that nice-looking really, but S.98/05 a.A. are almost as rare as hen's teeth over here and so yes, it had to be bought even in this condition, especially as this is my first E&F Hörster-made one (I have a K.98 by them)... Allegedly from a village on the Gallipoli peninsula - but one buys the bayonet not the story, although 98/05's were around at Gallipoli. Whatever, it has clearly been looked after as a show piece since the GW: woodworm-ridden grips that have been varnished and the cleaned and damaged scabbard (one of the Ersatz 98/05 type - perhaps / probably intended for the EB 98/05 look-alikes, the EB 41+ series - missing its finial). The spine mark is worn but certainly W/15 - not certain about fraktur there and on the pommel, also worn... I'll post the photographs in two... EDIT: putting the umlaut ö in the name and adding alternative spellings (Horster, Hoerster) to aid web searches! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 6 June , 2016 Author Share Posted 6 June , 2016 To continue with the left / reverse side: Horster were makers of these from 1915 on, some a.A., like this, and a few n.A., and, as Carter reminds us, better known for the WW2 pointed things than their WW1 products of this type... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeyH Posted 6 June , 2016 Share Posted 6 June , 2016 Julian, Odd that the grips don't have the normal grooves, maybe sanded off pre-varnishing? Mike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancashire Fusilier Posted 6 June , 2016 Share Posted 6 June , 2016 as this is my first E&F Horster-made one (I have a K.98 by them)... Julian, Whilst I do not collect German WW1 bayonets, I collected German WW2 engraved bayonets had many nice examples also made by E & F Horster. Regards, LF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 7 June , 2016 Author Share Posted 7 June , 2016 Odd that the grips don't have the normal grooves, maybe sanded off pre-varnishing? Grooves are there but barely visible. I'll check them again when I can as there is a possibility they are not original - well, the woodworming suggests they might be a soft rather than a hard wood... Whilst I do not collect German WW1 bayonets, I collected German WW2 engraved bayonets had many nice examples also made by E & F Horster. Years ago when in my low teens I had an SA dagger that was, I think, Horster, but it somehow 'got lost' during a house move - along with all my other WW2 stuff and a single M1917 helmet... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Haselgrove Posted 7 June , 2016 Share Posted 7 June , 2016 Julian,Yes, you can just make out the grooves on the grips and the wood to metal fit is excellent so original in my opinion. Thanks for sharing. Michael. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 7 June , 2016 Author Share Posted 7 June , 2016 That's a good point, about the close fitting of these grips, so maybe they are original - I need to check when I have 10 minutes to myself at home! My main reason for doubting they were original was the woodworm - never seen evidence of that on S.98/05 grips before, making me think they were soft wood replacements. But, there again, I guess there must be some hard woods also susceptible to this damage. Julian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gew88/05 Posted 7 June , 2016 Share Posted 7 June , 2016 Very nice Julian, I don't think there is any doubt that the grips are original, just severely worn. And the scabbard? I have payed rediculous prices for that type of scabbard to match it to the correct EB, even missing the ball tip, they are very hard to find simply because they were so easily damaged in service and replaced. One of mine (on it's originalEB42) has the ball finial loose. Much more time in actual service use and it would have been lost.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 8 June , 2016 Author Share Posted 8 June , 2016 Thanks Gew88/05! I have at least one good condition example of that type of scabbard, possibly another lurking away at the back of a drawer somewhere, and I never realised that they were that uncommon! Julian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 8 June , 2016 Author Share Posted 8 June , 2016 I checked, and just the one complete example with intact ball finial that came with a 98/05. The locket section is loose though and comes out with the still-attached bayonet springs when the bayonet is withdrawn. No trace of any original paint, just a nice overall brown patina. Julian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gew88/05 Posted 11 June , 2016 Share Posted 11 June , 2016 Lucky guy, it has been a while since I have seen one "on the loose" or even on a bayonet. Being zinc, they were easily damaged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 11 June , 2016 Author Share Posted 11 June , 2016 Zinc? My two seem to be steel... I'll run a magnet over them later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 11 June , 2016 Author Share Posted 11 June , 2016 Zinc? My two seem to be steel... I'll run a magnet over them later. Yes, both steel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gew88/05 Posted 12 June , 2016 Share Posted 12 June , 2016 Hmmmm.... You are correct, checked mine with a magnet and they are steel, don't remember where I came up with that piece of misinformation, thanks for correcting me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 12 June , 2016 Author Share Posted 12 June , 2016 To the best of my limited knowledge the only zinc ones made by Germany and Austro-Hungary were for the captured Russian Mosin–Nagant M.1891 socket jobs. But nothing would surprise me about scabbards for the central powers late in the GW! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gew88/05 Posted 15 June , 2016 Share Posted 15 June , 2016 You are correct (as far as we know....) Zinc scabbards were made in limited types and didn't stand up well under heavy use and abuse. I do appreciate the correction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 15 June , 2016 Author Share Posted 15 June , 2016 I am not aware that anyone tried using zinc for the scabbards of regular bayonets, although various forms of rubber / plastic were certainly used. Zinc was, however, commonly used for the Ersatz scabbards provided for captured M-N bayonets used by the German and A-H forces... And, somewhat shamefully, I confess that I have a drawer full of these captured ones in their 'Ersatz' scabbards (German and A-H) that I have acquired over the years and while some are certainly zinc I have never really looked at all of them properly... A summer vacation task?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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