Gallipoli brothers

[Bryn]

HI Bob,

 

 

Photos of two brothers, in case you don't have them. Source is the newspaper 'Sphere', 21 Oct 1916 p20.

 

2nd Lieutenant Robert STANTON, Royal Dublin Fusiliers
Son of John and Catherine Stanton, of 5, Alexandra Place, Cork. Solicitor practising at 47, South Mall, Cork; and a Senior Moderator. B.A., LL.B. of Trinity College, Dublin.
KIA 9 August 1915 (official; but possibly 7th August). No Known Grave. Helles memorial.

 

Captain George STANTON MB, RAMC
'Died of wounds received in France. ‘He was the son of Mr and Mrs Stanton of Alexandra Place, Cork. He received his commission in 1915, and had been at the front since last October.’ (Sphere 21 Oct 1916 p20).
Died of wounds 16 Aug 1916, aged 24.
Buried Cork (St. Finbarr's) Cemetery, Ireland

 

 

 

 

[Guest]

Hello

Attached is a photo of a family grave in the parish church of Hampton, Evesham. At the bottom it shows two brothers both killed within weeks of each other. I can find no further info. Locally, do you have any?

 

Ron Payne

[clk]

Hi Ron,

 

Welcome to the Forum.

 

Unfortunately, Arthur and Thomas don't appear to have surviving service papers.

 

I think that the CWGC has them under the surname of Abbots (single 'T') - search page here. The dates of death are slightly out, but the record for Thomas says "son of John Abbots of 4 The Pool, Hampton, Evesham". In his Soldiers' Effects record his father is recorded in one place as "John J", and in another as "Joseph". Soldiers Died also has him as Abbots - born and enlisting in Evesham, but with a date of death of 10th August 1915.

 

The Soldiers Effects record for Arthur is under the surname of Abbotts - DoW 10th June 1915, His father is named as "John". His Soldiers Died record has him as being born and residing Evesham, but enlisting in Worcester.

 

Their medal rolls are:

Arthur here

Thomas here

 

The 14/15 Star rolls should give a date of arrival in active theatre.

 

The war diary for 4th Battalion Worcestershire Regiment is on Ancestry here. The 9th Battalion diary is here

 

Near number sampling* for men in the same regiment who have surviving service records should hopefully give you an educated guess as to enlistment dates.

 

Regards

Chris

 

Edit 1:

In the census returns for 1901 and 1911 they appear under the surname of Abbots - single 'T'

 

*Edit 2:

15203 Richmond attested 1.9.1914 at Redditch

15215 Daniels attested 31.8.1914 at Fladbury

15218 Cowley attested 31.8.1914 at Fladbury

15228 Cotton attested 1.9.1914 at Worcester

15235

15260 Salisbury attested 31.8.1914 at Worcester

15277

15278 White attested 1.9.1914 at Evesham

15281 Davis attested 1.9.1914 at Worcester

15288 Holloway attested 1.9.1914

15290 Stratford attested 1.9.1914 at Worcester

15299 Winnett attested 1.9.1914 at Worcester

 

Possible record for parents marriage - John Joseph Abbitts vs Fanny Cooke. September quarter 1868. Ref: RD Pershore 6c 433

Edited 18 May , 2017 by clk

[Guest]

Word searching 'also fell'  on all the 22,824 UK names on the CWGC database who are commemorated at Gallipoli generates 61 names. 

 

It includes the Urry brothers who died on the same date....(1/8th Bn Hampshire Regt (Isle of Wight Rifles) (TF))

 

URRY	FREDERICK ALBERT	F A	21		12/08/1915
URRY	WILLIAM HENRY	W H	26		12/08/1915
URRY	EDWARD GEORGE	E G	35		12/08/1915

Edited 16 May , 2017 by Guest

[clk]

 

Hi,

 

27 minutes ago, QGE said:

URRY FREDERICK ALBERT      F A      21   12/08/1915

URRY WILLIAM HENRY            W H      26   12/08/1915

URRY EDWARD GEORGE        E G      35   12/08/1915

 

All 3 are shown as being in 'B' Company in a nominal roll of officers and men proceeding overseas with the battalion.

 

Regards

Chris

[Guest]

39 minutes ago, clk said:

 

Hi,

 

 

All 3 are shown as being in 'B' Company in a nominal roll of officers and men proceeding overseas with the battalion.

 

Regards

Chris

 

Indeed. Rural TF Battalions of course tended to have sub units centred on rural towns and villages, even down to Platoon level. B Company had its HQ at St Helens with drill stations at Bembridge, Seaview and Brading. I can see Bembridge from my study.  Gallipoli had five Territorial Divisions and enough additional TF units that arrived as reinforcements to have created another; In all some 81 TF units operated as Infantry battalions (including restructured Yeomanry). The prospects for small scale devastation on communities was great. 

 

I think is exposes some of the unintended consequences of the 'local' structure of the pre-war TF as well as the Pals Battalions of the New Armies; catastrophic failure could have a highly concentrated effect on some communities. The 1/8th Bn Hampshire Regt (Isle of Wight Rifles) (TF) was in the same Division and the same Brigade as the ill fated 1/5th Norfolks (TF) whose Sandringham Company "All the King's Men" was largely annihilated in the same action.

 

"Hells Foundations" by Geoffrey Moorhouse focuses on the town of Bury and the Lancashire Fusiliers (six Battalions at Gallipoli including one regular, one New Army and four TF) touches on some aspects of this. It is an interesting study in the human impact of the war on a community.  I have often wondered which street in England suffered the most. I would guess some grim street in an industrial town in the North. 

Edited 16 May , 2017 by Guest

[StephenJohnRoberts1958]

On 30/03/2005 at 16:01, Bryn said:

Bob, I don't know who you already have, but here are a few more:

Lieutenant Humphrey Gilbert BELCHER, 5th Bn. Wiltshire Regiment. DOW 7 Aug 1915, Helles memorial.

Captain Austin Charles Sandham BELCHER, Adjutant of the 5th Bn. Wiltshire Regiment. KIA 10 Aug 1915, Helles memorial.

Lieutenant John BOLTON, 1/5th Bn. T.F. The East Lancashire Regiment . DOW 4 June 1915, Twelve tree Copse cemetery.

Captain Harry Hargreaves BOLTON, 1/5th Bn. T.F. The East Lancashire Regiment. DOW 23 May 1915, Helles memorial.

Sub Lieutenant Rupert Chawner BROOKE , Royal Naval Volunteer Reserve. 'A' Coy 'Hood' Bn. Royal Naval Division. His brother Alfred (Lieutenant Post Office Rifles) was killed in France in June 1915.

2nd Lieutenant Randall BURROUGHES, 1/5th Bn. T.F. The Norfolk Regiment. KIA 12 Aug 1915, Helles memorial. His brother 2nd Lieutenant Stephen Burroughes (Rifle Brigade) was killed in France 4th November 1918.

Captain Alfred Victor CLEGG, 1/6th Bn. T.F. The Lancashire Fusiliers. KIA 7 Aug 1915, Lancashire Landing cemetery.

Captain Frank Cecil CLEGG, 6th Bn. The Border Regiment, KIA 22 Aug 1915. Helles memorial.

Captain Edward Randall CUBITT, 1/5th Bn. T.F. The Norfolk Regiment. KIA 12 Aug 1915, Helles memorial.

Lieutenant Victor Murray CUBITT, 1/5th Bn. T.F. The Norfolk Regiment. KIA 12 Aug 1915, Helles memorial.

2nd Lieutenant Francis William Morgan DUNN, 1/5th Bn. T.F. The Welch Regiment. KIA 10 Aug 1915, Helles memorial.

2nd Lieutenant John Robert Collard DUNN, 1/5th Bn. T.F. The Welch Regiment. KIA 20 Aug 1915, Helles memorial.

Lieutenant Richard Stanley EVANS, I/5th Bn. T.F. The Welch Regiment. KIA 10 Aug 1915, Helles memorial.

Captain Rees Tudor EVANS, 1/5th Bn. T.F. The Welch Regiment. KIA 10 Aug 1915, Helles memorial.

Captain Richard Clift FIPPARD, 14th Bn. West Yorkshire Regiment Attached 1st Bn. The Lancashire Fusiliers. His brother Corporal H.J. Fippard (9th Bn. London Regiment) was killed in action on the same day in Belgium. KIA 4 June 1915, Helles Memorial.

2nd Lieutenant David Boyd GALBRAITH, 1/7th Bn. T.F. The Highland Light Infantry. KIA 20 Aug 1915, Helles memorial.

Lieutenant William Brodie GALBRAITH, 1/7th Bn. T.F. The Highland Light Infantry. DOW 14 July 1915, Lancashire Landing cemetery.

Captain William Duncan HEPBURN, Seaforth Highlanders Attached 1/5th Bn. T.F. The Royal Scots. KIA 28 Apr 1915, Helles memorial. His brother 2nd Lieutenant M.A. Hepburn, Seaforth Highlanders was killed at Armentieres 30 Nov 1914.

Lieutenant Colonel George Bennett HINGSTON, Royal Engineers. DOW 16 Jun 1915, Chatby Military cemetery, Egypt. His brother Major E. Hingston - Royal Engineers - was killed in action in Flanders on the 28th March 1915.

Lieutenant Duncan HOOK, 9th Bn. The Lancashire Fusiliers. KIA 7 Aug 1915, Hill 10 cemetery.

2nd Lieutenant Robin HOOK, 9th Bn. The Lancashire Fusiliers. KIA 7 Aug 1915, Hill 10 cemetery.

Captain F. (Francis) A. (Arthur) JAMES, I/5th Bn. T.F. The Manchester Regiment. DOW 18 Sep 1915, Pink Farm cemetery.

Lieutenant George Sidney JAMES, I/5th Bn. T.F. The Manchester Regiment. KIA 4 Jun 1915, Redoubt cemetery.

Major Charles Harry Brownlow JARRETT, lst Bn. The Royal Munster Fusiliers. KIA 25 Apr 1915, Lancashire Landing cemetery. His brother Captain Aylmer Vivian Jarrett (D.S.O.) York and Lanes Regiment, died of wounds in Flanders 22nd June 1915.

Lieutenant Eric Larkin Wheadon LEAKE, 1st Bn. The Lancashire Fusiliers. KIA 4 Jun 1915, Helles memorial. Brother, Captain G.D. Leake, E. Lancashire Regiment, was killed near Ypres on the 13th May 1915.

Lieutenant Duncan Ian Bowen LLOYD , 1st/5th Gurkha Rifles - Indian Army. KIA 14 Aug 1915, Helles memorial.

Captain Gwion Llewelyn Bowen LLOYD, 5th Bn. The Dorsetshire Regiment. KIA 11 Aug 1915, Helles memorial.

Lieutenant Cortland Richard MacGREGOR, 2nd Bn. The South Wales Borderers. KIA 5 May 1915, Helles memorial. Brother, 2nd Lieut Kenneth Cortland MacGregor, K.O.S.B., was killed near Ypres on the 26th February 1915 (Menin Gate memorial).

Captain Thomas Bowyer Lane MAUNSELL, 1st Bn. The Lancashire Fusiliers. KIA 25 Apr 1915, Lancashire Landing Cemetery. His brother Captain Wilfrid Innocent Maunsell, The Cameronians, was killed in France 8th February 1915.

2nd Lieutenant Gerald Thornton PRICKARD, 3rd Bn. The South Wales Borderers Attached lst Bn. The Royal Dublin Fusiliers, KIA 4 Jun 1915, Helles memorial. His elder brother Captain H.S. Prickard (North Staffs) was killed in the South African War.

Captain Clayton RATSEY, 1/8th Bn. T.F. The Hampshire Regiment. KIA 12 Aug 1915, Helles memorial.

Captain Donald White RATSEY, 1/8th Bn. T.F. The Hampshire Regiment. KIA 12 Aug 1915, Helles memorial.

Lieutenant Eric James THOMSON, 1/7th Bn. T.F. The Royal Scots. KIA Gully Ravine 28 Jun 1915, Helles memorial.

2nd Lieutenant Francis Wishart THOMSON, 1/7th Bn. T.F. The Royal Scots. KIA Gully Ravine 28 Jun 1915, Helles memorial.

Captain Beverly USSHER, Leinster Regiment Staff 88th Brigade. KIA 19 Jun 1915, Twelve Tree Copse cemetery. Brother, Captain Stephen Ussher, of the 129th Baluchis, was killed in France 16 Dec 1914.

If I find any more I'll let you know.

One aspect that's really interesting is the relatively large number of brothers who died on the same day. It'd be worth seeing what percentage fell into that category. 

 

 

 

Here are the Clegg brothers on Beetham War Memorial in Westmorland. I photographed it today.

 

[Guest]

On 23/01/2016 at 10:35, chwiliwr said:

Two brothers killed at Gallipoli on the same day 10th August 1915 were:

Private John Edwards 2694 7th Bn RWF aged 28 and

Private Richard Edwards 2739 7th Bn RWF aged 36, both of Dolgellau. They are both commemorated on the Helles Memorial.

Both were copper miners and had also worked in local gold mines. Richard left a wife and four children. They were probably in the first contingent of the local Territorial Force which left Dolgellau railway station on 6th August 1914 (where they were given a rousing send-off) for their HQ in Newtown and then on to the Northampton area before sailing for Gallipoli at the end of July 1915. Another brother Robert served with the battalion in Egypt and Palestine and although he spoke little of what he went through his daughter remembers when she was a child that he would not have dates in the house at Christmas because they reminded him of his experiences.

Five other men on the WW1 memorial in Dolgellau were killed that day, making it the costliest single day of the war for the town. This number included two brothers in law - is this too much of a tangent?

Private Harry Jones 2742 7th Bn RWF was married to the sister of Private William Lewis Evans 2824 7th Bn RWF.They are also remembered on the Helles memorial. Harry was a tanner and Wiliam a coal miner in Rhondda. Harry was a veteran of the Boer War and according to family members had been warned by his wife, because he was more experienced, to look after Will. When Will was shot, Harry stopped to tend to him and was shot himself. This story had been brought back to the family by a local man who had survived. Harry left seven children and Will left four. Harry's medals were sold in the 1920's to put food on the table. One family member recalls that Harry's widow, up to her death in the 1960's, cursed Winston Churchill for sending her boys to the Dardanelles.

These stories came to light during research for a book on the 107 victims of WW1 on the memorial in Dolgellau.

Chwiliwr

 

[Guest]

Richard Edwards was my great Grandfather and John my great Uncle. I wasn't aware there was another brother though so if anyone who is related to Richard Edwards reads this I'd love to hear from you.

[BPC1746]

I have only just come across this thread. There are 2 pairs of brothers on the Memorial at St Chad's Cheetham, Manchester where one brother was killed at Gallipoli and his sibling died on another Front.

John CUPPELLO Corporal 2092 1st/9th Manchester Reg died aged 26 on 19th Dec 1915 and is commemorated on the Helles Memorial. He had landed on V Beach on 9th May 1915. His older brother Joseph CUPPELLO  aged 29 Pte 16919 King's Own Royal Lancaster Reg. died from a sniper's bullet on 2nd May 1915 at Wieltjie Farm and is commemorated on the Menin Gate. The brothers were baptised at St Chad's before the family moved to Ashton under Lyne.

John Joseph FLYNN Corporal 12550 6th Bn Border Reg. Died 9th Aug 1915 at Gallipoli aged 44. He is commemorated on the Helles Memorial. His younger brother Herbert Wilfred FLYNN b. 1878 22nd Section Royal Army Ordnance Corps died on 6th Sept 1918. He was killed in an accident at Sinderland Camp, Altrincham when he was crushed by a railway wagon. He is buried in Moston Cemetery. A third brother, Frederick, a sailor, was torpedoed a week earlier but was rescued.

[Pat Atkins]

14413 Pte Herbert Ernest King ATKINS, 2nd Royal Fusiliers: sniped while negotiating a flooded trench on 26th May 1915. Aged 23 and a pre-War regular, he had landed at X Beach on 25 April. Commemorated on the Helles Memorial.

 

1311 L/Sjt William Frederick ATKINS, 1/23rd London Regiment: KIA in the German front line at Givenchy, France, on the same day. He was aged 20, and is commemorated on the Le Touret Memorial.

 

 

Cheers, Pat.

[Richard John]

Two of my great-uncles from New Zealand. Frank died in1915 at Alexandria of wounds received at Gallipoli. His brother,William, died on 12 October 1917 at Passchendale. I'm on my way now to the centenary commemoration for the kiwis

[bobpike]

I must thank everyone for their contributions and apologise for my tardy response, my only excuse is that I have mainly been in France since March and exposed to variable or little email access.

Although only five sets of brothers that have been posted since I last wrote are new to me, the extra information and photos is very useful and much appreciated,#

Thank-you,

Bob

[RaySearching]

Bob

I have updated the Info on The Rogers brothers  including Sergeant Major JOHN ROGERS 12/128 Auckland Regiment, N.Z.E.F
and included a photo  of S/M.  J Rogers

which can be found on post 672  on this thread

HERE

 

Ray

[hamishmck]

Hi, probably too late to join in the post and research etc but 2 of my relatives were both wounded on Gallipoli and subsequently died from wounds.

Lt William Fielding Sames 4th bn East Lancs died 31.may 1915 Buried at sea in Mudros harbour

Pt Herbert Colin Sames 1st/6th bn Manchester died 23 june 1915 Buried Alexandria (chatby) cemetary. 

They were brothers. 

Their 1st cousin, 2nd Lt Percy Woodhouse 9th bn Manchester contracted dysentery on Gallipoli and died (11.09.15) aboard a hospital ship and was buried at sea somewhere near to Gib on route to England.

hope this helps

cheers

[Guest]

No idea if this has been mentioned at all, and not quite Gallipoli.

However, a news paper article regarding my Great Great Uncles and Great Great Grandfather.

Alfred and Francis O'leary (My uncles) were both Sergeants in the 6th Battalion and it appears that Francis witnessed Alfred's death on August 9th 1915 in the Dardanelles.
 

Harry (my grandfather), according to this newspaper, died the same day from wounds he received in France, but he is listed on CWGC as dying on August 11th 1915.

Francis went on to live through the war, dying in 1956.

[bobpike]

Thank you both very much especially as they are both new to me; also for the extra information too

kind regards

Bob

[hamishmck]

Bobpike, all 3 men were first cousins to my grandfather and great uncle ( brothers) 

I have more info on all 3 as i have their military records, PM me if you are interested,

cheers Hamishmck

[bobpike]

Thank you Hamishmck

[Bryn]

Not sure if you're still doing this work, Bob, but I found another couple of sets of brother just in case:

 

HENDERSON, Captain Eric Lockhart Hume. 1st Bn. The Royal Munster Fusiliers. Born 7 July 1881. Educated Loretto School. First officer from the 'River Clyde' to land at 'V' Beach on 25th April 1915. Wounded in the arm and again wounded. Evacuated to Egypt where he died of wounds 20th May 1915 in the Deaconess Hospital, Alexandria. Buried in Chatby Military Cemetery.

Born 31 May 1881, Dublin, Ireland.

Served in South Africa (Anglo-Boer) War.

Appointed 2nd Lieutenant in Royal Munster Fusiliers 8 March 1901.

Captain 23 July 1913.

Mentioned in Despatches for Gallipoli.

Married Mabel Alice PASKE in Kensington, London, in 1914.

 

Brother, Lieutenant Raymond Montgomery Hume Henderson, Connaught Rangers, killed in action 20 Sep 1914, aged 30, La Ferte-Sous-Jouarre Memorial, France.

 

THE BROTHERS TURNBULL. 
Mr Alexander Turnbull, of Leithen Lodge, Innerleithen, a native of Selkirk, had five sons in the Army at the commencement of the war. Two of them — George, who was in the 14th Australians, and James, who was in the Bth Royal Scots — have been kilied in action. 
Lance-Corpl. J. Turnbull was killed in France on March 17th. He was 23 years of age and went out to the front about the end of October. 
Sergt. George Turnbull was 28 years of age and emigrated to Australia a few years ago. When the family lived in Selkirk he was employed at Messrs Gibson and Lumgair's mill. (Southern Reporter [Selkirk, Scotland] 17 June 1915 p7).