trajan Posted 12 May , 2017 Author Share Posted 12 May , 2017 Ghazela, You know, I have seen that photograph of Gerty and TE so many times but never noticed until this time that she has a 'fag' in her hand! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 12 May , 2017 Author Share Posted 12 May , 2017 On 5/9/2017 at 16:38, seaJane said: I don't know if the Army has its own archaeological unit as such, but there is Op Nightingale: https://www.opnightingaleheritage.com/ http://www.wessexarch.co.uk/OperationNightingale http://www.army.mod.uk/royalengineers/units/32526.aspx I had heard of the group, but not seen these links, so thanks Jane! Something for our GWF Pal Ogilwy to get onto when he gets tired of his full-time army job, showing men how things go 'bang', as his BA is an Oxon one in archaeology! Julian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marilyne Posted 23 December , 2018 Share Posted 23 December , 2018 (edited) hi all, getting this thread of ouf the mothballs... I'm starting a bit of research on the advance of work in Egyptology during the war... more specifically: what happened to the excavators when the war broke out? Every dig had it's share of graduate students, young enough to be called up... Can anyone point me towards some sources on the matter? Thanks. M. Edited 23 December , 2018 by Marilyne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seaJane Posted 23 December , 2018 Share Posted 23 December , 2018 These people may be able to advise: https://www.ucl.ac.uk/culture/petrie-museum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 24 December , 2018 Author Share Posted 24 December , 2018 Hi Marilyne, Every time I give my class on Tut I think on this very question! All those involved on that project, though, were on the "wrong" side of the conscription age, if you see what I mean! But I don't know what other projects may have been in hand away from the Valley of the Kings, whether in Egypt of Syrio-Palestine - or Mesopotamia - or Turkey, for that matter... On the other hand I do know that the leader of the excavations at Bogazkoy in the 1930's and 1940's was so desperate to become a member of a certain political party in Germany that they made an exception to their general rule that one had to be resident in Germany to join said party...!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaureenE Posted 24 December , 2018 Share Posted 24 December , 2018 Possibly C F Woolley is a misprint for C L Woolley. Reports "especially of Captain C F Woolley...." form the basis of a c 1919 publication Kurdistan and the Kurds from the British Library IOR/L/MIL/17/15/22, on Qatar Digital Library https://www.qdl.qa/en/archive/81055/vdc_100035251755.0x000005 Cheers Maureen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie962 Posted 24 December , 2018 Share Posted 24 December , 2018 I did a bit of digging (?) about CL Woolley's wartime activities and posted a bit on a thread about HMY Zaida. I have his little book 'As I seem to Remember' which contains a few stories of the time and I will post an extract about his joining the Cairo mob if I can find it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seaJane Posted 24 December , 2018 Share Posted 24 December , 2018 I really must get myself a copy of that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaureenE Posted 24 December , 2018 Share Posted 24 December , 2018 10 hours ago, charlie962 said: I did a bit of digging (?) about CL Woolley's wartime activities and posted a bit on a thread about HMY Zaida. Interesting to read charlie962, The mention of Woolley dropping agents off by boat reminds me of the account (although it's got nothing to do with archaeologists) “Hard Lying”: Eastern Mediterranean, 1914-1919 by Captain L B Weldon 1925. https://archive.org/details/HardLying/page/n5 Happy Christmas to all Maureen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie962 Posted 26 December , 2018 Share Posted 26 December , 2018 (edited) On 24/12/2018 at 20:40, seaJane said: I really must get myself a copy of that! It is not a large book, 112pp, more a series of stories he tells well. Edited 26 December , 2018 by charlie962 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marilyne Posted 26 December , 2018 Share Posted 26 December , 2018 Thanks all for your answers!! M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghazala Posted 27 December , 2018 Share Posted 27 December , 2018 On 13/01/2016 at 18:15, MikeMeech said: Hi TEL was of course working as an archaeologist at Carchemish (a Hittite city) under Hogarth and then Woolley from 1911 to the Great War. Hogarth (who was in British Intelligence) got him the post of assistant archaeologist at Carchemish, this location also being on the route of the projected Berlin to Baghdad railway. TEL's Thesis was published in 1936, after his death, and reprinted with other correspondence in 1992 as 'Crusader Castles', Immel Publishing, with a preface by Michael Haag. Mike 1910 Oxford University - Summer. Lawrence wins first class honours - the highest grade - in his Oxford BA degree, having submitted a notable thesis titled The influence of the Crusades on European Military Architecture - to the end of the XIIth century (published after his death as Crusader Castles). During the summer Lawrence decides to carry out postgraduate research at Oxford on medieval pottery, a subject that has long interested him. In the event, this project will never be fulfilled, because Lawrence will become a field archaeologist. December - Lawrence sails for Beirut. He will study Arabic with Fareedah El Akle at Jebail as a preliminary to joining a trial season's excavations to be conducted by the British Museum at Carchemish, near Jerablus in northern Syria. This work will be unpaid, but he has been awarded a postgraduate research scholarship at Magdalen College, Oxford. 1911, March 11 to July 8. - Trial season's excavations at Carchemish, working under D. G. Hogarth and R. Campbell-Thompson. July 12-28 - Walking tour visiting castles (Lawrence's diary of this tour published after his death as The Diary of T. E. Lawrence, MCMXI). August 12 - Lawrence leaves Beirut for England. End-November - The British Museum has decided to continue the Carchemish excavations. Lawrence leaves England for Jerablus to prepare for a second season. 1912, January - To gain experience of field archaeology, Lawrence works briefly at excavations led by Flinders Petrie at Kafr Ammar in Egypt. Afterwards he returns to Jerablus. March - June - Second season's British Museum excavations at Carchemish, led by Leonard Woolley. Lawrence is mainly responsible for pottery and photography, but also plays an important role in managing the locally-recruited workforce. Lawrence remains in Syria and Lebanon during the summer. September-November - Third season's British Museum excavations at Carchemish. End-November - Lawrence and Woolley leave for England. 1913, January 9 - Lawrence leaves England for Jerablus to prepare for the new season's excavations. March-June - Fourth season's British Museum excavations at Carchemish. End-June - Lawrence leaves Jerablus for a brief visit to England, accompanied by two head-men from the excavations: Hamoudi and Dahoum. August - Lawrence returns to the Middle East. September-early December - Fifth season's British Museum excavations at Carchemish. 1914 , January-February - Woolley and Lawrence, under the auspices of the Palestine Exploration Fund, travel to the Sinai Peninsula to join a party of Royal Engineers commanded by Stewart Newcombe. Their role is to provide 'innocent' archaeological camouflage for a British military survey of a Turkish-controlled area. During this period Lawrence visits Akaba and Petra for the first time. Early-March - Woolley and Lawrence return to Jerablus. 22 March-May - Sixth season's British Museum excavations at Carchemish. Late June - Lawrence returns to Oxford. He and Woolley prepare their archaeological report on the Sinai expedition, to be titled The Wilderness of Zin. August 4 - Outbreak of war. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 29 December , 2018 Author Share Posted 29 December , 2018 Thanks Ghalazal for that overview of TEL's archaeological endeavours. I wasn't aware of the "1914 , January-February - Woolley and Lawrence, under the auspices of the Palestine Exploration Fund, travel to the Sinai Peninsula to join a party of Royal Engineers commanded by Stewart Newcombe. Their role is to provide 'innocent' archaeological camouflage for a British military survey of a Turkish-controlled area. During this period Lawrence visits Akaba and Petra for the first time." escapade. One of the problems we archaeologists have is that our legitimate work can often be interpreted as spying - same with journalists and geologists, etc. I can't tell you how many times I have been pulled over by the Turkish Jandarma for questioning when exploring the Mardin area, the border zone between Turkey and Syria, and the Kurdish areas... And of course archeological field surveys have indeed been used in the past as cover or opportunities for spying activities... My planned visits to the Ushaia area in 1984 prompted telephone calls about "would you mind reporting back on what you see there" - which I duly ignored! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie962 Posted 29 December , 2018 Share Posted 29 December , 2018 5 hours ago, trajan said: - which I duly ignored! But how do you prove it ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 29 December , 2018 Author Share Posted 29 December , 2018 29 minutes ago, charlie962 said: But how do you prove it ? Sir, I am a man of my word! Wasn't a lot to see anyway... Some ex-UK MTB's in the harbour which I was cautioned not to photograph - got the photographs somewhere though! As far as I can establish my request to the FOffice as to where I could get an Argentine visa was the tip-off to somebody, somewhere Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poacherbold Posted 29 December , 2018 Share Posted 29 December , 2018 (edited) Dows Dunham. 1890-1984. American archaeologist who worked in Egypt and the Sudan. Joined the American Field Service in France as an ambulance driver in late December/early January 1916/17 and later served as an officer in the U.S. Army until late spring 1919. Also Professor George Reisner reported on the attitudes and morale of the native Egyptians to the British authorities. Source. Recollections of an Egyptolgist. D Dunham 1972. Edited 29 December , 2018 by poacherbold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith_history_buff Posted 29 December , 2018 Share Posted 29 December , 2018 One other archaeologist who has been mentioned on here before is the Scotsman Philip Langstaffe Ord Guy 1885-1922 who served in the French Foreign Legion before getting a commission in the British Army on 11 March 1915. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David_Underdown Posted 4 January , 2019 Share Posted 4 January , 2019 Several of Dr Juliette Desplat's posts on The National Archives' blog look at archaeology around and between the two world wars: https://blog.nationalarchives.gov.uk/blog/tag/archaeology/ plus a couple of other posts on other scholars suspected of being more than they seemed https://blog.nationalarchives.gov.uk/blog/spy-or-scholar-meet-dr-curt-prufer/ and https://blog.nationalarchives.gov.uk/blog/spy-scoundrel-scholar-leo-frobenius-mission-abyssinia/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BullerTurner Posted 16 January , 2019 Share Posted 16 January , 2019 Arthur Evans was a little old for military service in the Great War! However it is a subject of some controversy as to whether he was in fact a spy in the Balkans, as a young man? His protege John Pendlebury served in a special services role in the war we do not speak of. One wonders if there were ever any conversations between Sir Arthur and Pendlebury on espionage or if Sir Arthur were asked if he could "recommend somebody"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seaJane Posted 16 January , 2019 Share Posted 16 January , 2019 I have all the books there are about John Pendlebury (though not to hand, unfortunately) and if I remember next time I'm by them, I'll check. Alternatively Evans's Oxford DNB entry may say something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IPT Posted 16 January , 2019 Share Posted 16 January , 2019 On 13/01/2016 at 20:22, IPT said: Surrey Recruitment Registers First name(s) J S Last name Playford Service number 25055 Age 35 Years 0 Months Birth year 1881 Occupation Archaeologist Attestation year 1916 Attestation date 19 January 1916 Attestation place London Unit or regiment East Surrey Regiment (depot) Regiment East Surrey Regiment (depot) Height 5ft 7in. Weight in pounds 126 Chest expansion inches 2 Chest size inches 35 Remarks 65 Avondale Rd Croydon Notes Conscripted men I'm beginning to suspect that my man was a mistranscribed archivist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seaJane Posted 17 January , 2019 Share Posted 17 January , 2019 Is he on the 1911 census? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 17 January , 2019 Author Share Posted 17 January , 2019 10 hours ago, BullerTurner said: Arthur Evans was a little old for military service in the Great War! However it is a subject of some controversy as to whether he was in fact a spy in the Balkans, as a young man? His protege John Pendlebury served in a special services role in the war we do not speak of. One wonders if there were ever any conversations between Sir Arthur and Pendlebury on espionage or if Sir Arthur were asked if he could "recommend somebody"? I'm pretty certain he spent some time in the clink in one of the Balkan entities on spying charges. Or was it the Balkan equivalent of gross moral turpitude?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BullerTurner Posted 17 January , 2019 Share Posted 17 January , 2019 I don't believe, from my own experience, that there is a Balkan equivalent to gross moral turpitude...yes, he was indeed imprisoned on allegations of espionage and ownership of a revolver I think, iirc. In the Balkans owning only one revolver is probably grounds for a lengthy custodial sentence! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trajan Posted 17 January , 2019 Author Share Posted 17 January , 2019 8 minutes ago, BullerTurner said: I don't believe, from my own experience, that there is a Balkan equivalent to gross moral turpitude...yes, he was indeed imprisoned on allegations of espionage and ownership of a revolver I think, iirc. In the Balkans owning only one revolver is probably grounds for a lengthy custodial sentence! Perhaps that was the gross moral turpitude? Only one revolver instead of 144? Ok, I'll leave the stage right now... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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